robdylan

Greenaway sees Frans at 13…


Written by Rob Otto (robdylan)

Posted in :In the news, Sharks, Super 14 on 2 Apr 2008 at 12:13

John Plumtree had to smile yesterday when he read in the press that All Black enforcer Jerry Collins is warning his team-mates of a tougher-than-ever battle with the Sharks forwards because of the “Plum factor.”

“He says the Sharks will be ‘like a loaded shotgun’, referring to the way I prepare teams for the big games,” Plumtree said to Mike Greenaway of the Mercury.

Plumtree coached Collins and most of the current Hurricanes team during his four-year tenure as coach of Wellington in the New Zealand National Championships, taking them to the final in his last year before joining the Sharks. So Plumtree knows Collins and Co inside out.

“The trouble is, they know him just as well.

“There is never a good time to play the Hurricanes in Wellington because they are a team that play so well at home (and are not good travellers), and the concern for me is that they are in position in the competition where they cannot afford to lose a home match,” Plumtree warned.

“I am aware that they set a target of winning at least one of their two pre-tour home games (against the Crusaders last week and the Sharks), so having lost to the Crusaders they will be regarding Saturday’s game as an absolute must-win.”

The hot-and-cold Hurricanes are fourth on the table, with four wins from six games and they leave on Sunday for matches in South Africa against the Stormers, Bulls and Cheetahs

“They are not only desperate to win this game but they want to win it well – they have been frustrated with their lack of consistency given the calibre of player in their squad (nine All Blacks),” Plumtree added.

So have the Sharks got what it takes to stop a Hurricanes team intent on blowing hot?

“Of course they have,” says Plumtree.

“It really is a big night for us and our players always respond to the big occasions.

“We have the players and most importantly we have the attitude.

“The thing is, though, and I keep saying it to the guys: If you want to beat the top teams you have play with great intensity and concentration for longer than 10 minutes at a tight, as we have been doing. You have to keep going for the whole match.

“That is what the Crusaders do so well.

“Even when they do not have the ball, they still keep up the intensity and then when the opposition lose focus, they cash in.”

The Sharks trained on Tuesday afternoon at a rugby club in the suburb where Plumtree used to live.

In a sharp session given the jet lag, it became clear that Frederic Michalak will play flyhalf against the Hurricanes, with Frans Steyn moving from that position to the midfield, probably for Waylon Murray, thus giving Steyn a brand new role.

If No 8 Ryan Kankowski does not recover from his ankle problem, Tongan Epi Taione is set to make his run-on debut. In another expected change, Steven Sykes will come in at lock for AJ Venter, who is undergoing a week of intense fitness training to get him up to speed with the rest of the squad.

Venter has been injured much of the season and will play off the bench this week.

Sharks (possible):

15 Stefan Terblanche, 14 Odwa Ndungane, 13 Frans Steyn, 12 Bradley Barritt, 11 JP Pietersen, 10 Fred Michalak, 9 Ruan Pienaar, 8 Ryan Kankowski/Epi Taione, 7 Jacques Botes, 6 Keegan Daniel, 5 Johann Muller, 4 Steven Sykes, 3 BJ Botha, 2 Bismarck du Plessis, 1 Beast Mtawarira



102 Comments

  • Poor bloody KSA… ;)

  • Comment 1, posted at 02.04.08 12:15:26 by robdylan Reply
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  • Rob – is there a huge difference between 12 and 13?

  • Comment 2, posted at 02.04.08 12:22:26 by Nessa Reply

    NessaCurrie Cup player
     
  • What this nonsense… :evil: Steyn should now play 13, first he was SA’s answer to Honiball, then air apparent to the 12 role… What’s next lock :mad: He hasn’t been good at all this season, aint letting the ball go to his outside backs, takes to long to kick at 10, stingy at 12, careless at 15…. :roll:

    Ruan is badly out of form can’t fit in anywhere at the moment, Kockott breathing down his neck – he hasn’t responded with great effect.

    Jacobs is deserved of a start, Barritt not as effective this season. JP’s all round play has improved tenfold-not as mistake prone but needs to score more.

    Ndungane has been superb for the last yr and a half or so. Definitely growing in stature – a clear example of what “development” can do for a player. Classy touches on attack, versatile too.

    My Sharks backline:

    9.Kockott
    10.Michalak
    11.JP
    12.Jacobs
    13.Murray
    14.Ndungane
    15.Steyn

  • Comment 3, posted at 02.04.08 12:23:07 by Charlie Reply

    CharlieSuper Rugby player
     
  • Maybe this could work aswell… :wink:

    Freddie & Adi in the 10 & 12 axis would be awesome, but Dick Muir prefer Adi as a super sub… The other option would be to start Barritt and bring on Jacobs for the last 30 minutes :mrgreen:

  • Comment 4, posted at 02.04.08 12:28:47 by Charlie Reply

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  • I prefer to believe what the coach actually says to what a journalist surmises/supposes.

    Muir admitted that Steyn would prefer inside centre – where he played at the World Cup – to flyhalf and said that was where he would be used against the Hurricanes. That, of course, is not good news for centre Brad Barritt

  • Comment 5, posted at 02.04.08 12:34:17 by KSA Shark © Reply

    KSA Shark ©Head Coach
     
  • stingy at 12???????????????????

    Did I miss a match this season? :roll:

  • Comment 6, posted at 02.04.08 12:35:39 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • KSA – which is inside centre and which is outside? Which one is 12 and which one is 13?

  • Comment 7, posted at 02.04.08 12:37:27 by Nessa Reply

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  • 12 is inside, 13 is outside. They are vastly different positions.

    KSA, this is the way they are running at practice… perhaps Waylon has not recovered from the knock he took.

  • Comment 8, posted at 02.04.08 12:41:57 by robdylan Reply
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  • BTW, Frans has operated at 12 on a number of occasions this year, after the backs have been reshuffled in the second half.

    He was at 12 against the Lions for most of the second half, for one thing.

  • Comment 9, posted at 02.04.08 12:42:54 by robdylan Reply
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  • Rob that is right they are VASTLY different and to expect him to addapt would be silly.

    If this happens which I suspect it won’t then we will have yet another Monday of Sack Steyn in favour of Adi or Love child.

    The Fact that Steyn was playing out of position yet again is a minor detail that will be ignored/overlooked again.

    I am just glad i will be looking at tigers rather than having to fight the good fight again. :wink:

  • Comment 10, posted at 02.04.08 12:46:28 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • Thanks for that guys – appreciate it. Wasn’t sure.

  • Comment 11, posted at 02.04.08 12:49:11 by Nessa Reply

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  • Poor Steyn…it seems that Waylon is a doubtful starter so Mr. Fix-It might be called to that position… :mrgreen:

  • Comment 12, posted at 02.04.08 12:50:55 by blackshark Reply

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  • Rob

    Are you sure?

    Where did Barrit go when Frans moved to 12 for most of the second half against the Lions?

  • Comment 13, posted at 02.04.08 12:51:28 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • Gee this is going confuse TT on where to stand on it ;)

  • Comment 14, posted at 02.04.08 12:55:09 by Dive Pass Reply

    Dive PassCurrie Cup player
     
  • Frans did play at 13 in the 2nd half on Saturday …. Either Murray is injured or Muir and Rob are going to have to have a paternity battle as to who actual is Brad’s father.

  • Comment 15, posted at 02.04.08 12:59:51 by Dive Pass Reply

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  • Poor Steyn…it seems that Waylon is a doubtful starter so Mr. Fix-It might be called to that position…

    02.04.08 12:50:55 – blackshark Edit

    Only if you stand in out camp. :wink: The other camp sees it like this.

    What this nonsense… Steyn should now play 13, first he was SA’s answer to Honiball, then air apparent to the 12 role… What’s next lock He hasn’t been good at all this season, aint letting the ball go to his outside backs, takes to long to kick at 10, stingy at 12, careless at 15….

    Oh i just love rugby :lol:

  • Comment 16, posted at 02.04.08 13:01:30 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • Been comparing pictures and I think Plum is the daddy… :lol:

  • Comment 17, posted at 02.04.08 13:03:38 by blackshark Reply

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  • Barritt went off against the Lions, KSA. Fred at 10, Frans at 12.

  • Comment 18, posted at 02.04.08 13:03:41 by robdylan Reply
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  • hey now…. don’t make me haul out the DNA test results ;)

  • Comment 19, posted at 02.04.08 13:04:06 by robdylan Reply
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  • Fransie will surely answer in his next interview if asked where do he prefers to play…”Wel oom, eintlik enige plek, net asseblief nie van die bank af nie…” :roll:

  • Comment 20, posted at 02.04.08 13:17:25 by Charlie Reply

    CharlieSuper Rugby player
     
  • Come the end of the S14 he might have all the jersey numbers up to 15 Charlie… :lol:

  • Comment 21, posted at 02.04.08 13:20:42 by blackshark Reply

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  • Nessa

    12 is more of a “brains” position, you are still a decision maker and need to assist the flyhalf by taking the pressure off him in certain situations. Key attributes for a 12 are a quick brain, solid in defence and preferably a decent boot.
    The Poms used Mike Catt there successfully as a foil for Jonny Wilkinson when Will Greenwood retired. It worked as Wilkinson although 2 footed is more natural on his left side and Catt has a decent right boot. 12 is also usually the fulcrum in organising the defensive pattern.

    13 is a “flair” position, requiring more pace and linebreaking ability. Although you are required to do your fair share of tackling it is a slightly easier defensive position since you don’t usually have large forwards running directly at you and also a lot of backlines drift and a lot less of your tackles are front on, more side on. You can also shepherd guys to the touchline.

    Dick Muir was a TOP QUALITY 12 in his time because he had a wonderful rugby brain and was a backline leader. He brought out the best in those outside him with his clever play and quickthinking. With Jeremy Thomson outside him that was one of the great Natal centre pairings!

  • Comment 22, posted at 02.04.08 13:53:38 by Villie Reply
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  • Maybe Steyn needs to be dropped for a couple of games.. I sometimes get the idea that his head is a bit big… being a RWC winner and all.
    I’d love to see Jacobs been given a go…Is he still injured?

  • Comment 23, posted at 02.04.08 13:54:18 by Pokkel Reply
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  • I remember the first time I saw Frans play.. It was a very wet Kingspark in a game against the WP in the Currie Cup. He was at 10 and had a fantastic game at 10. Had some brilliant line breaks and single handedly won the game

  • Comment 24, posted at 02.04.08 13:57:39 by Pokkel Reply
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  • Having said that I still don’t rate him as a flyhalf

  • Comment 25, posted at 02.04.08 13:58:20 by Pokkel Reply
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  • 02.04.08 13:17:25 – Charlie

    “Verstaan”

  • Comment 26, posted at 02.04.08 13:58:20 by Kal-El Reply

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  • “I sometimes get the idea that his head is a bit big”

    Pokkel,
    Ek dink dis net sy hare wat bietjie lank is, verstaan.

  • Comment 27, posted at 02.04.08 14:01:29 by Kal-El Reply

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  • Villie – you don’t say much about the 12′s role on attack…

    Based on what I read above, Brad Barritt is the perfect number 12 ;) And Frans would do fine at 13.

  • Comment 28, posted at 02.04.08 14:02:18 by robdylan Reply
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  • Die hare is dalk n bietjie lank , miskien as hy beter kan sien my kind.

  • Comment 29, posted at 02.04.08 14:03:09 by Pokkel Reply
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  • Kal-El…

    Ja swaer… :roll:

  • Comment 30, posted at 02.04.08 14:04:09 by Charlie Reply

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  • Charlie, of is dit “verstôn”

  • Comment 31, posted at 02.04.08 14:05:34 by Kal-El Reply

    Kal-ElCurrie Cup player
     
  • verstaan

  • Comment 32, posted at 02.04.08 14:06:23 by robdylan Reply
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  • Villie – thank you for the explanation. :wink:

  • Comment 33, posted at 02.04.08 14:06:53 by Nessa Reply

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  • My rather oversimplified way of looking at the centers is that 12 is ‘almost’ a flyhalf and 13 ‘almost’ a wing. :)

  • Comment 34, posted at 02.04.08 14:10:24 by Waz Reply

    WazUnder 21 player
     
  • Okay Rob, I will add my views on 12′s attacking role, since that is where I played most of my rugger! :razz:
    I actually cut my views short because the post was getting lengthy and long posts tend to lose peoples attention.

    I agree, Barritt is ideally suited for 12. And Barritt is also a perfect example of the difference between 10 and 12. In my opinion Barritt will never make a top level 10 (he is ok at CC level) but is a fine 12 and will probably develop into the finest 12 in SA. Bearing in mind he is still a youngster!

  • Comment 35, posted at 02.04.08 14:11:03 by Villie Reply
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  • Sharks … so much talent so little entertainment…I really hope they start firing this weekend.

  • Comment 36, posted at 02.04.08 14:11:36 by Pokkel Reply
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  • Waz,

    The modern game of rugby has bring forth this situation… :wink:

  • Comment 37, posted at 02.04.08 14:11:51 by Charlie Reply

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  • Waz,

    IMO versatality… :grin:

  • Comment 38, posted at 02.04.08 14:12:25 by Charlie Reply

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  • Waz – now that is an explanation I can understand. :wink:

    This boy is clever – must have a very bright mom!

  • Comment 39, posted at 02.04.08 14:13:50 by Nessa Reply

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  • Andries Strauss ??? But this guy is slow… :roll:

  • Comment 40, posted at 02.04.08 14:13:51 by Charlie Reply

    CharlieSuper Rugby player
     
  • This weeks Superbru predictions is not that easy… lots of kak teams playing other kak teams….

  • Comment 41, posted at 02.04.08 14:13:56 by Pokkel Reply
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  • Waz..not a bad way of looking at it!! :lol:

  • Comment 42, posted at 02.04.08 14:14:21 by Villie Reply
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  • Waz,

    “Your mom looks quite nice…” :roll:

  • Comment 43, posted at 02.04.08 14:14:48 by Charlie Reply

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  • “quite” :?: :?: :?:

  • Comment 44, posted at 02.04.08 14:16:31 by Nessa Reply

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  • Haha. Mom! You’re embarrasing me in front of my friends! :oops:

  • Comment 45, posted at 02.04.08 14:16:34 by Waz Reply

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  • :mrgreen: 02.04.08 14:14:48 – Charlie :mrgreen:

  • Comment 46, posted at 02.04.08 14:18:14 by Kal-El Reply

    Kal-ElCurrie Cup player
     
  • Sorry! :oops:

  • Comment 47, posted at 02.04.08 14:19:12 by Nessa Reply

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  • quite sorry?
    did you check up? :mrgreen:

  • Comment 48, posted at 02.04.08 14:20:47 by Kal-El Reply

    Kal-ElCurrie Cup player
     
  • Heh, she bites Charlie. :)

  • Comment 49, posted at 02.04.08 14:21:26 by Waz Reply

    WazUnder 21 player
     
  • Waz,

    And she’s a angel… :wink:

  • Comment 50, posted at 02.04.08 14:21:43 by Charlie Reply

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  • Waz,

    Seems more bark then bite…soft hearted… :grin:

  • Comment 51, posted at 02.04.08 14:22:43 by Charlie Reply

    CharlieSuper Rugby player
     
  • Kallie – no he said “quite nice”.

    Now Charlie – you can’t backtrack. You have to explain yourself! :evil:

  • Comment 52, posted at 02.04.08 14:23:00 by Nessa Reply

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  • bliksem, Kal El… cool pic!

  • Comment 53, posted at 02.04.08 14:23:12 by robdylan Reply
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  • Waz – I think you should write a book called “Dummies guide to rugby”.

  • Comment 54, posted at 02.04.08 14:24:06 by Nessa Reply

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  • Notice how Rob very casually steers the conversation away from any animosity! :wink:

  • Comment 55, posted at 02.04.08 14:26:29 by Nessa Reply

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  • Geez – what happened – lost the site there for a minute.

  • Comment 56, posted at 02.04.08 14:49:45 by Nessa Reply

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  • it was unintentional ;)

  • Comment 57, posted at 02.04.08 14:49:57 by robdylan Reply
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  • apologies all… the site went down. I am already speaking to our hosting partner… someone is going to bleed today.

  • Comment 58, posted at 02.04.08 14:51:26 by robdylan Reply
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  • No problem Rob – thought the problem was on my side until Waz mailed me to say the same had happened to him.

  • Comment 59, posted at 02.04.08 14:53:39 by Nessa Reply

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  • I nearly got bored… :roll: But we’re back on track… :lol:

  • Comment 60, posted at 02.04.08 14:57:09 by Charlie Reply

    CharlieSuper Rugby player
     
  • Kal-El…

    Regarding your pic…perhaps queueing for tooth brushing or a floss… :mrgreen:

  • Comment 61, posted at 02.04.08 15:00:16 by Charlie Reply

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  • Charlie… are you “mshiniwam” on Keo? :shock:

  • Comment 62, posted at 02.04.08 15:01:30 by robdylan Reply
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  • Waz – I think you should write a book called “Dummies guide to rugby”.

    02.04.08 14:24:06 – Nessa

    “Rugby for mother’s – the simplified edition.” ? :twisted:

  • Comment 63, posted at 02.04.08 15:03:06 by blackshark Reply

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  • Waz – I think you should write a book called “Dummies guide to rugby”.

    02.04.08 14:24:06 – Nessa

    “Rugby for mothers – the simplified edition.” ? :twisted:

  • Comment 64, posted at 02.04.08 15:03:27 by blackshark Reply

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  • Aaai! :mad:
    Sorry for the double post there…

  • Comment 65, posted at 02.04.08 15:04:34 by blackshark Reply

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  • blackshark,

    Now you”ll have to go into hiding… :twisted:

  • Comment 66, posted at 02.04.08 15:05:11 by Charlie Reply

    CharlieSuper Rugby player
     
  • BS – ha ha. :lol: He has been mailing me though with some very “simple” explanations which I understand so much better.

    Glad you said “mothers” and not “women”. There are a lot of women out there who understand the rules of rugby much better than I do.

    I also battle with off sides in rugby – it is not as clear cut as soccer.

  • Comment 67, posted at 02.04.08 15:06:17 by Nessa Reply

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  • Charlie :lol: I thought “mothers” sounded better than “dummies”. So I will let BS live a while longer. :wink:

  • Comment 68, posted at 02.04.08 15:08:04 by Nessa Reply

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  • blackshark,

    Where are you… it’s safe now.. you can come out… :twisted:

  • Comment 69, posted at 02.04.08 15:09:53 by Charlie Reply

    CharlieSuper Rugby player
     
  • “I also battle with off sides in rugby ”

    You should go and become a referee in Australia

  • Comment 70, posted at 02.04.08 15:09:55 by robdylan Reply
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  • :mrgreen:

  • Comment 71, posted at 02.04.08 15:11:52 by Charlie Reply

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  • Heh :D

  • Comment 72, posted at 02.04.08 15:13:56 by Waz Reply

    WazUnder 21 player
     
  • I think we should get Deon to write us a short article on the differences and nuances of tighthead and loosehead. Most of us understand the basic elements but would be great to get it from a member of the front row club and especially one that has played both sides and often!

  • Comment 73, posted at 02.04.08 15:15:08 by Villie Reply
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  • Anyone care to ask him? Ness?

  • Comment 74, posted at 02.04.08 15:16:48 by robdylan Reply
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  • Okay – that will be my mission – I will speak to Deon when he gets back and ask him to do that for us.

    He prefers loosehead to tighthead because it allows him to be more “loose” and he can run more and score tries. He likes that. :wink:

  • Comment 75, posted at 02.04.08 15:17:05 by Nessa Reply

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  • There we go Rob – I have answered your question. I will get hold of him when he gets back.

  • Comment 76, posted at 02.04.08 15:17:52 by Nessa Reply

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  • it was unintentional

    02.04.08 14:49:57 – robdylan

    But it was international.

  • Comment 77, posted at 02.04.08 15:19:00 by Kal-El Reply

    Kal-ElCurrie Cup player
     
  • A bit tough getting interviews now that the guys have gone. I’ve been a bit slack, but will blame it on my holiday.

    Prolly a good idea to get hold of young Patric Cillers…

  • Comment 78, posted at 02.04.08 15:19:15 by robdylan Reply
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  • Kal-El, stop trying to confuse me ;)

  • Comment 79, posted at 02.04.08 15:19:36 by robdylan Reply
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  • You are right RD – won’t probably get anything out of DC until the guys are back.

  • Comment 80, posted at 02.04.08 15:21:10 by Nessa Reply

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  • Some of the guys (like Ruan) are still Facebooking while they are there. Will send him a message anyway and see if he responds.

  • Comment 81, posted at 02.04.08 15:23:16 by Nessa Reply

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  • “I also battle with off sides in rugby – it is not as clear cut as soccer.

    02.04.08 15:06:17 – Nessa”

    No! Rugby offside is easier to spot, surely?

  • Comment 82, posted at 02.04.08 15:23:49 by Dawn Reply

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  • Ness, no rush. Whenever he has time would be great. Deon is a great guy so I’m sure he won’t mind.

    He is a much better loosehead anyway, so they should just leave him there. I guess it is handy to have someone who can cover boths sides though and sometimes he is required to do a job at tighthead!

  • Comment 83, posted at 02.04.08 15:28:44 by Villie Reply
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  • Dawn

    Think it’s mostly the offside rules at the breakdown that confuses.

  • Comment 84, posted at 02.04.08 15:29:34 by Waz Reply

    WazUnder 21 player
     
  • Kanko is Facebooking all right… but he ignores me these days. Seems my stalking is destined to catch up with me ;)

  • Comment 85, posted at 02.04.08 15:30:45 by robdylan Reply
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  • Waz

    Can nogal spot that too.

    But don’t ask me about football offsides. Aikona.

  • Comment 86, posted at 02.04.08 15:32:23 by Dawn Reply

    DawnUnder 19 player
     
  • Deon was never a very good tighthead… I think it’s a “mind” thing. A tighthead by nature should not be a flamboyant guy. Look at BJ. There is only one thing on his mind – “destroy”.

  • Comment 87, posted at 02.04.08 15:32:51 by robdylan Reply
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  • robdylan

    Is he not interested in someone younger and female, maybe?

  • Comment 88, posted at 02.04.08 15:34:52 by Dawn Reply

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  • Rob – do you remember when Deon was playing tighthead for the Boks years ago? It was a disaster.

    Waz – can most definitely NOT spot those.

  • Comment 89, posted at 02.04.08 15:41:30 by Nessa Reply

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  • Dawn – you will have to message Kanko – maybe he will reply to you.

    Sorry Rob – can’t help you there. He is one player that I don’t know that well.

  • Comment 90, posted at 02.04.08 15:42:10 by Nessa Reply

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  • I only ask because Kanko is now ignoring Rob.

  • Comment 91, posted at 02.04.08 15:49:40 by Dawn Reply

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  • I know – but if you change your profile pic to a feminine version – maybe he will reply :?: :?:

  • Comment 92, posted at 02.04.08 15:51:30 by Nessa Reply

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  • Kal-El

    Howcome you have a Shark pic on your profile? Aren’t you a Stormer?

    Or is it a case of picking the winning team :wink:

  • Comment 93, posted at 02.04.08 15:53:25 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • oh my god… I could never pass for a chick ;)

  • Comment 94, posted at 02.04.08 15:55:49 by robdylan Reply
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  • Not you Rob – Dawn! :lol:

  • Comment 95, posted at 02.04.08 15:58:07 by Nessa Reply

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  • oh – I reckon Dawn could pass for a chick… ;)

  • Comment 96, posted at 02.04.08 16:04:16 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • RD
    sorry i could not get you the Naas & Joost in time maybe next time

  • Comment 97, posted at 02.04.08 16:21:03 by barend Reply

    barendVodacom Cup player
     
  • he he… we will definitely do it ;)

    Barend, how about you write us some stuff about your involvement in schoolboy rugby sometime? I reckon there are some fascinating stories you could tell…

  • Comment 98, posted at 02.04.08 16:25:29 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • 02.04.08 15:53:25 – KSA Shark ©

    Ektjoehalie, I’m a Crusader :oops:
    The shark is just to feel part of your world :wink:

    If I was a Stormer it would be a case of picking an “occasional” winning team :lol:

  • Comment 99, posted at 02.04.08 16:34:56 by Kal-El Reply

    Kal-ElCurrie Cup player
     
  • will do so
    there are some real aggro parents out there

  • Comment 100, posted at 02.04.08 16:37:50 by barend Reply

    barendVodacom Cup player
     
  • Kal-El

    :lol: Crusaders :shock: :oops:

  • Comment 101, posted at 02.04.08 18:43:46 by KSA Shark © Reply

    KSA Shark ©Head Coach
     
  • eish this just proves why i said its not steyns fault and again he gets a new position ?????????????????????????????

  • Comment 102, posted at 02.04.08 21:19:12 by sharks_lover Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    sharks_loverTeam captain
     

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