robdylan

Protea on the left, Bok on the right


Written by Rob Otto (robdylan)

Posted in :In the news, Springboks on 3 Nov 2008 at 10:11
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The South African Rugby Union have taken a decision to recognise the Protea as the national emblem and move the Springbok off the heart of the national rugby jersey.

www.rugby365.com/SAPA

Afrikaans Sunday newspaper Sondag reported that SARU took the decision last week at a President’s Council meeting, but did not announce it as they still wanted to communicate the decision in a discussion with Sports Minister Makhenkesi Stofile.

At the extraordinary meeting, SARU decided that they recognise the need for the King Protea to be on the World Champions’ jersey as the national emblem.

But the team will still be known as the Springboks and the Springbok emblem will be emblazoned on the right side of the jersey in future.

However, the organisation was requesting a meeting with the Sports Minister to sort out logistical issues, the newspaper said, as the pending Sports Act stipulates that no emblem may be bigger than the national emblem on any sporting jersey.

This would mean that the Protea would be bigger than the Springbok on the national rugby jersey.

There was also uncertainty as to how this pertained to the sponsor’s logos on the jersey, the newspaper added.

SARU President Oregan Hoskins confirmed the Springbok issue was discussed by the Presidents Council.

“We did discuss it and we need to have a discussion with the Sports Minister now. We don’t want to make any announcements before we have talked to him,” Hoskins told the newspaper.

The old jersey may still be in play until after the British and Irish Lions tour, the newspaper added, as the orders for national jerseys are nine months in advance and any change would take that long to implement.



79 Comments

  • I hope this settles it then. How big must the protea be then?

  • Comment 1, posted at 03.11.08 11:07:16 by McLovin Reply
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  • @McLovin (Comment 1) :

    I hope so too.
    The Protes has to be bigger than the Bok but I guess this is better than removing it altogether.

  • Comment 2, posted at 03.11.08 11:12:42 by chernaya akula - BS Reply
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  • @chernaya akula – BS (Comment 2) : A sensible compromise, I would say

  • Comment 3, posted at 03.11.08 11:35:44 by robdylan (CC Champ '08) Reply
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  • Agreed. SA national sporting identity is the Protea. The teams identity is the Boks. Excellent compromise until BK has to hide another dismal performance in another sporting code.

  • Comment 4, posted at 03.11.08 12:33:28 by Worcestershire Sauce Reply
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  • @Worcestershire Sauce (Comment 4) : cynical, but can’t fault your reasoning :)

  • Comment 5, posted at 03.11.08 13:36:01 by robdylan (CC Champ '08) Reply
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  • As long as Luke doesn’t wear the jersey in future I’ll be fine… :shock:

  • Comment 6, posted at 03.11.08 14:53:25 by wpw Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 6) : Amen

  • Comment 7, posted at 03.11.08 14:58:14 by Worcestershire Sauce Reply
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  • @Worcestershire Sauce (Comment 7) : amen to the power ten

  • Comment 8, posted at 03.11.08 15:08:06 by robdylan (CC Champ '08) Reply
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  • I don’t want this thread to become about Luke but a colleague of mine (fine blonde chic) :cool: was best buddies with Lukas’ cousin.

    Aai, maar baie van die stories van hulle familie is waar!!! :roll:

  • Comment 9, posted at 03.11.08 15:11:26 by wpw Reply
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  • “Clowns to the left of me,
    Jokers to the right, here I am,
    Stuck in the middle with you.”

    Stealers Wheel 1972.

    These guys were vissionaries to be able to write so accurately about South African rugby back then.

  • Comment 10, posted at 03.11.08 15:31:19 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @Salmonoid (Comment 10) : 1972? Is it really such an old song?

  • Comment 11, posted at 03.11.08 15:57:55 by robdylan (CC Champ '08) Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 9) : so they actually DID do those unspeakable :shock: things to the family goat?

  • Comment 12, posted at 03.11.08 15:58:27 by robdylan (CC Champ '08) Reply
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  • @robdylan (CC Champ ‘08) (Comment 11) :
    Yes, according to the clip on youtube, the video looks as if it could also be that old.

  • Comment 13, posted at 03.11.08 16:23:27 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @Salmonoid (Comment 13) : odd… I heard it for the first time in the 90s and just kind of assumed it was from that era

  • Comment 14, posted at 03.11.08 16:57:00 by robdylan (CC Champ '08) Reply
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  • They rehash all good (and sometimes not so good) music in the modern era. Not enough creativity these days, or the dope is of inferior quality.

  • Comment 15, posted at 03.11.08 17:21:49 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @Salmonoid (Comment 15) : he he :)

  • Comment 16, posted at 03.11.08 17:35:53 by robdylan (CC Champ '08) Reply
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  • Coming in late here but what the heck. Completely agree with Worcs. Sensible compromise but watch. Give them a hand and they will take the whole arm. We’ve met them halfway and at some point we will have to meet them halfway again and again and again. Anyone know what an asymptote looks like? :neutral:

  • Comment 17, posted at 11.11.08 12:25:34 by klempie Reply

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  • I dont know. This just sound like killing some fires and Stofile wont be satisfied with the compromise. He want the Bokkie of the jersey and wontb settle for less. They should have leave it as it is , try plan A to keep the Bokkie and if it dont work settle in between with plan B. Now they start with plan B and will probably miss the pot completely.

  • Comment 18, posted at 11.11.08 12:37:31 by PaarlBok Reply

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  • @klempie (Comment 17) : Is it a mammal? :wink:

  • Comment 19, posted at 11.11.08 12:39:57 by McLovin Reply

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  • @McLovin (Comment 19) :

    Listen – what do you people know about tWatson’s charges being dropped?

  • Comment 20, posted at 11.11.08 12:40:50 by Ice (Bébé de Glace) Reply
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  • @McLovin (Comment 19) : Ain’t you a bean counter to be? :wink:

  • Comment 21, posted at 11.11.08 12:42:36 by klempie Reply

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  • @McLovin (Comment 19) : nah – definitely mineral

  • Comment 22, posted at 11.11.08 12:45:25 by robdylan Reply
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  • @klempie (Comment 17) :

    is it not a graph of some sorts? :oops:

  • Comment 23, posted at 11.11.08 12:46:57 by Ice (Bébé de Glace) Reply
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  • @Ice (Bébé de Glace) (Comment 20) : I don’t know anything. :roll:

  • Comment 24, posted at 11.11.08 12:46:57 by McLovin Reply

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  • @McLovin (Comment 24) :

    how sure ar you about that?? :twisted:

  • Comment 25, posted at 11.11.08 12:47:43 by Ice (Bébé de Glace) Reply
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  • @Ice (Bébé de Glace) (Comment 20) : Its on IOL, looks like a technicality. So charges have been dismissed.

    “Charges against controversial loose forward Luke Watson has been dismissed, after the South African Rugby Union failed to show that the presiding officer in the matter had the authority to hear the case in the first place.

    The contention was the first ground of Watson’s defence at Tuesday’s disciplinary hearing into controversial comments the Bok flanker reportedly made at the Ubumbo Rugby Club at UCT last month.

    The hearing lasted 90 minutes, with the presiding officer, attorney Nape Dolamo, agreeing with Watson’s legal counsel, Jeremy Gauntlett SC and Matthew Blumberg.”

  • Comment 26, posted at 11.11.08 12:48:43 by Worcestershire Sauce Reply
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  • @klempie (Comment 21) : It’s what I keep telling myself, but at the current rate I’ll pass my final exam shortly before my 90th birthday. :neutral:

  • Comment 27, posted at 11.11.08 12:49:45 by McLovin Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 22) : LOL.

  • Comment 28, posted at 11.11.08 12:51:24 by klempie Reply

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  • @Ice (Bébé de Glace) (Comment 23) : Well it’s part of a graph. It’s a line which a graph gets closer and closer to but never actually reaches. The point being that if you keep dividing the remaining distance to the line by half, you never actually get there. However, in this context, what it means is that if they continue down the road of compromise, they will lose so much of the Bok presence as for it be negligble.

  • Comment 29, posted at 11.11.08 12:54:06 by klempie Reply

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  • @klempie (Comment 29) :

    You mean they will be allowed to have it on their kit but it will have to be on the jock-strap or on the bottom of the foot of the sock?

  • Comment 30, posted at 11.11.08 12:56:42 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • @klempie (Comment 29) : Exactly. :mrgreen:

  • Comment 31, posted at 11.11.08 12:58:01 by McLovin Reply

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  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 30) : KSA gets the gist.

  • Comment 32, posted at 11.11.08 12:58:53 by klempie Reply

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  • @klempie (Comment 32) :

    the what?

  • Comment 33, posted at 11.11.08 13:04:22 by Ice (Bébé de Glace) Reply
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  • @Ice (Bébé de Glace) (Comment 33) : http://www.dictionary.com :roll:

  • Comment 34, posted at 11.11.08 13:06:19 by klempie Reply

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  • @klempie (Comment 34) :

    :razz:

  • Comment 35, posted at 11.11.08 13:08:21 by Ice (Bébé de Glace) Reply
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  • Not posting a whole thread for this.

    Silas Nkanunu defends the Bok
    2008-11-12 22:33

    Stephen Nell

    Cape Town – The Springbok emblem was also used by black and coloured players before unity and linking it exclusively with white identity does not take historical factors into account.

    That was the message on Wednesday from the former president of the South African Rugby Football Union Silas Nkanunu.

    In an interview Nkanunu expressed his concern that real issues confronting South African rugby were being overlooked in the debate over the emblem.

    “You won’t be helping the transformation-agenda by shooting the Springbok,” Nkanunu said on Wednesday.

    “The removal of the Springbok won’t change the fact that enough resources aren’t ploughed into the development of the game.

    “Rugby is not being played in many black schools where it used to be the case. You can address transformation through support of schools and clubs. Government’s role should be to provide resources and facilities.”

    Nkanunu is particularly worried about the state of rugby in Eastern Province.

    He believes historic factors should be taken into account when it comes to the Bok emblem.

    “The National Sports Congress met in Vanderbijlpark after unity where a resolution was taken that rugby could use the Bok emblem,” said Nkanunu.

    “There is no racist thread in this thing. I wonder if people are taking historic factors into account when they talk about it.”

    Nkanunu pointed out that the Springbok was also used as emblem by the non-racial Saru prior to unity.

    “I find the debate strange because black and coloured players were considered Springboks prior to unity,” he said.

    “The non-racial Saru’s emblem was a Protea with two Springbok heads on the side. We sent a touring team to Namibia with that emblem.

    “Prior to unity the South African Sports Congress decided at a meeting in Port Elizabeth that the Springbok would not be the national emblem. The one used after unity was only a temporary measure.

    “However, at the meeting in Vanderbijlpark it was decided in the spirit of reconciliation that rugby could use the Springbok.”

  • Comment 36, posted at 13.11.08 09:54:19 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 36) :
    Ah…come on…just leave it Nkanunu- they might just decide to resort to a Protea with 2 Springbok heads. No bodies…just 2 heads. :roll:

    Bokke 41 – Scots 9

  • Comment 37, posted at 13.11.08 10:22:11 by Kamov Ka50 - blckshrk Reply

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  • ANC: Springbok here to stay – News24
    2008-11-24 22:04

    Carien du Plessis

    Johannesburg. – The name of the Springbok rugby team and the emblem can stay, but the King Protea has to appear on the left-hand side, ANC secretary-general Gwede Mantashe said on Monday.

    Mantashe repeated the solution proposed by the minister of sport and recreation Makhenkesi Stofile at a news conference at Luthuli House.

    He referred to the Bok issue as an example of where a solution was found after a public debate.

    “When they talk about destroying the Springbok emblem, I say the country’s emblem, which is the King Protea, should appear on the left-hand side. You can have the Springbok on the right, on your arm, your shorts or anywhere else.

    “It is the commercial trademark of the Springboks. That’s fine. You can call the team the Springboks as you call the Australian rugby team the Wallabies.

  • Comment 38, posted at 25.11.08 10:21:21 by Dive Pass Reply

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  • Nice! Will still wear my Paul Roos jersey on 1 December ! :cool:

  • Comment 39, posted at 25.11.08 10:24:38 by PaarlBok Reply

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  • Guys, Rob has just given me Admin powers so just please watch it with the political comments!!! :twisted:

  • Comment 40, posted at 25.11.08 10:33:07 by wpw Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 40) : Hey you talking to me. As long as he keep giving some powers to the WeePee manne I dont have a prob at all. The more the merrier, we want to change the Tjark to a snoek!. :wink:

  • Comment 41, posted at 25.11.08 10:36:41 by PaarlBok Reply

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  • @wpw (Comment 40) :

    Then Rob shouldn’t have posted this article in the first place ;)

    Rob trusted @PaarlBok (Comment 41) :

    Look at the picture on the top left of the home page….you know you want to support those guys in the black and white next season ;)

  • Comment 42, posted at 25.11.08 10:43:52 by Dive Pass Reply

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  • @Dive Pass (Comment 42) :

    Still have to motivate myself supporting a team that have Puke Watson in it. :twisted:

    Myself will support the team the first moer him. Think I’ll try and boe him off Newlands everytime he touch the ball or throw him with a beer tin or vrot snoek.

    Luckily we have a summer holiday (sun tan lotion and the smell of kaalgat bodies)to motivate us for 2009.

  • Comment 43, posted at 25.11.08 10:54:02 by PaarlBok Reply

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  • @PaarlBok (Comment 43) :

    I am trying to be in CT for the Sharks vs Stormers match on the 14th Feb, should be a good one.

  • Comment 44, posted at 25.11.08 10:56:43 by Dive Pass Reply

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  • @Dive Pass (Comment 44) : They always are. Time for the Stormers to revenge 2008!

    One critic I have on Rassie was our lack of warmup matches in 2008 and we drop that first games due to this.

  • Comment 45, posted at 25.11.08 11:04:57 by PaarlBok Reply

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  • @wpw (Comment 40) : :shock:

  • Comment 46, posted at 25.11.08 11:12:58 by Worcestershire Sauce Reply
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  • @Worcestershire Sauce (Comment 46) : hehehe

  • Comment 47, posted at 25.11.08 11:24:35 by wpw Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 40) :

    O Vader… :roll:

  • Comment 48, posted at 25.11.08 11:26:20 by Ice (Bébé de Glace) Reply
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  • erm hrm hrm

  • Comment 49, posted at 25.11.08 11:43:41 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 49) : Hi there Rob.

    :shock: :shock:

    Just been keeping a beady eye on things while you were away…

    :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

  • Comment 50, posted at 25.11.08 11:47:49 by wpw Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 50) :

    This comment is for you….:

    I AM HAVING LUNCH!! :twisted: :wink:

  • Comment 51, posted at 25.11.08 11:49:25 by Ice (Bébé de Glace) Reply
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  • @Ice (Bébé de Glace) (Comment 51) :

    :roll: :roll:

    So what’s on the menu???

    I really should start a food thread…

  • Comment 52, posted at 25.11.08 11:53:35 by wpw Reply
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  • Rump steak-salad with balsamic..mmmmmmmm :grin:

    I’ll join you….we can call it: In die Kombuis met Wes en Ys.. :idea:

  • Comment 53, posted at 25.11.08 11:57:04 by Ice (Bébé de Glace) Reply
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  • @Ice (Bébé de Glace) (Comment 53) :

    Will you guys be on before or after “Oor die Kole met Kobus and Toks” ? :roll:

  • Comment 54, posted at 25.11.08 11:59:42 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • @wpw (Comment 52) :

    From what I have seen you might not let any of us near the FOOD thread. :razz:

  • Comment 55, posted at 25.11.08 12:00:16 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • @Ice (Bébé de Glace) (Comment 53) : Niiiiiice!!! :wink:

  • Comment 56, posted at 25.11.08 12:01:30 by wpw Reply
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  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 55) :

    :lol:

    The reason why I decided to put his name first and then mine…gewigsvoordeel… :lol:

    @KSA Shark © (Comment 54) :

    After…because then even Wes might look vaartbelyn compared to Kobus and Tiks.. :mrgreen:

  • Comment 57, posted at 25.11.08 12:03:27 by Ice (Bébé de Glace) Reply
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  • @Ice (Bébé de Glace) (Comment 57) :

    OK, so I see it is ‘make fun of Wes’ day today!!! :evil: :evil:

  • Comment 58, posted at 25.11.08 12:07:53 by wpw Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 58) :

    today????

  • Comment 59, posted at 25.11.08 12:10:12 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • @wpw (Comment 58) :

    Not at all…just stating the Obvious!! :lol: :lol:

  • Comment 60, posted at 25.11.08 12:10:29 by Ice (Bébé de Glace) Reply
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  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 59) :

    U can be lucky you on the udda side of the world. :evil:

  • Comment 61, posted at 25.11.08 12:12:42 by wpw Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 61) : :smile:

  • Comment 62, posted at 25.11.08 12:16:57 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 62) :

    O Jinne…I am getting the flat ignore… :wink:

  • Comment 63, posted at 25.11.08 12:25:53 by Ice (Bébé de Glace) Reply
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  • @Ice (Bébé de Glace) (Comment 63) : Its becos u so fine!!! Whereas KSA Shark on the other hand ….

  • Comment 64, posted at 25.11.08 12:54:58 by wpw Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 64) :

    Phew!! Was just worried we starting our business venture on the wrong food(t).. :lol:

  • Comment 65, posted at 25.11.08 12:57:39 by Ice (Bébé de Glace) Reply
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  • As you all know yesterday was Springbok Day. Look like it was a success and myself in my Paul Roos Bok one sure the kind of Bok supporter that will wear the green & gold seven days a week and definetly my favourate dress.

    Anyway show a bit of the day on SABC news but this little qoute from “Die Burger” very important for our Dutchmen in Stormers territory

    Rassie-hulle wys op ‘Springbok-dag’ hul kaarte

    Kaapstad. – Die Stormers se afrigtingspan het gister met Luke Watson in sy midde geen twyfel gelaat nie oor hoe hy oor die Springbok-embleem voel.

    Rassie Erasmus, afrigter van die Kaapse streekrugbyspan en sy verdedigingskonsultant, Brendan Venter, het op “Springbok-dag” pette met dié embleem gedra.

    Een van die hulpafrigters, Allister Coetzee, het ’n broek met die Bok-embleem op gedra.

    Coetzee was verlede jaar nog die Bokke se hulpafrigter onder Jake White, terwyl Erasmus én Venter vir Suid-Afrika gespeel het.

    “Ek is baie trots om ’n Springbok te wees. Ek het die embleem gedra met ’n sekere bedoeling in my hart en het ’n Bok-erekode afgelê,” het Erasmus gesê.

    Frikkie Erasmus, kommersiële bestuurder van die Stormers, het in sy Bok-hempie bevestig die afrigters se besluit om die embleem te dra was ’n reaksie op die e-pos wat die ronde gedoen het vir Suid-Afrikaners om op 1 Desember hul ondersteuning vir die behoud van die embleem te wys.

    “Rassie het gevoel hy wil wys dat hy die behoud van die embleem ondersteun,” het Frikkie Erasmus gesê.

    Daar is sedert Oktober se nasionale sportindaba in Durban uit politieke kringe ’n aanslag op die embleem.

    Uiteindelik het die Suid-Afrikaanse Rugbyunie (Saru) besluit om die Protea as nasionale embleem te aanvaar, met die Springbok wat na regs op die trui sal skuif.

    ’n Herrie het onlangs om die Stormers se Springbok-losvoorspeler Watson losgebars oor ’n uitlating dat hy hom daarvan moes weerhou om op die Bok-trui te braak.

    Rassie Erasmus het gesê die Stormers is ’n diverse groep en daar sal uiteenlopende menings wees. Hy meen egter niemand se siening oor die embleem kan “veralgemeen” word nie.

    Myself not worried where they place the Bokkie as long as he is on the jersey.

    Long live the Springbok.

  • Comment 66, posted at 02.12.08 10:26:20 by PaarlBok Reply

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  • Yesterday was also World Aids day and I only found out when I saw a few folks wearing their red ribbons.

    Why in the name of all that is holy would SA rugby supporters choose 1 December???

  • Comment 67, posted at 02.12.08 10:56:06 by wpw Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 67) : my question as well.

    To be blunt, I think it’s because they have their heads shoved so firmly up their asses that they think this Springbok issue is actually one of the bigger problems that the world is facing.

    But let me stop this rant now before I break all sorts of rules.

  • Comment 68, posted at 02.12.08 11:02:44 by robdylan Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 67) :
    Maybe you can become a Springbok in Aids or something? :?:

  • Comment 69, posted at 02.12.08 11:05:47 by PaarlBok Reply

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  • @PaarlBok (Comment 69) : that wasn’t particularly sensitive.

  • Comment 70, posted at 02.12.08 11:38:22 by robdylan Reply
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  • I wonder if the Boks will now sing the national Anthem with their hands on the right of their jerseys. That would send the message loud and clear about what the players want. I would love to see that happen. :twisted: :roll:

  • Comment 71, posted at 02.12.08 11:49:26 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 68) : Come-on Rob Break the rules :twisted:

  • Comment 72, posted at 02.12.08 11:52:23 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 72) : no – because they are my rules and if I break them, I’ll have no moral high ground and will lose my ability to kak on all the rest of you :)

  • Comment 73, posted at 02.12.08 12:16:29 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 73) : Did you ever have it? :lol:

  • Comment 74, posted at 02.12.08 12:28:51 by Worcestershire Sauce Reply
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  • I got conned by a breast cancer lady. She got me to buy some of those pins only to discover breast cancer day was the previous week. :oops:

  • Comment 75, posted at 02.12.08 12:30:21 by McLovin Reply

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  • @Worcestershire Sauce (Comment 74) : fair enough :)

  • Comment 76, posted at 02.12.08 12:35:10 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 73) : Stay strong…don’t ever compromise on your ethics. If there is one thing I hate in life it’s a ‘twee gat jakkals’

  • Comment 77, posted at 02.12.08 12:38:46 by Pokkel Reply
    Friend of SharksworldCompetition Winner Author
    Assistant coach
     
  • @Pokkel (Comment 77) : And never buy a sticker that says give me hugs not drugs

  • Comment 78, posted at 02.12.08 12:47:50 by Worcestershire Sauce Reply
    Author
    Worcestershire SauceCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Worcestershire Sauce (Comment 78) : sage advice

  • Comment 79, posted at 02.12.08 13:04:36 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     

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