robdylan

Plum. What you doing?


Written by Rob Otto (robdylan)

Posted in :Original Content, Sharks, Super 14 on 23 Feb 2010 at 19:00
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While it’s admirable that the Sharks have finally laid out a clear “career path” for Ruan Pienaar, John Plumtree, in his most recent interview with Jan de Koning, seems to have showed Rory Kockott the middle finger in no uncertain terms. While undoubtedly very talented, the “cotton wool” treatment that Pienaar seems to enjoy seems vastly at odds with the “play for your place” message handed out to other members of the squad.

There is no simple answer here, of course – if there was, we wouldn’t have spent nearly as much time debating this as we already have. Fact is, despite how badly everybody else wants him to be a brilliant flyhalf, Ruan Pienaar is not comfortable in that position. We know how good he can be at scrumhalf and on form, to my mind, he is a clear first choice in that position for the Sharks. Plumtree and the Sharks should be applauded for resisting the pressure from “up above” to pick Pienaar at flyhalf in the supposed “national interest”. The Bok selectors have done Pienaar and the Sharks no favours of late and I don’t see why that shouldn’t be mutual.

But for Plumtree to openly criticise one of his players in the press is simply not on. How is Kockot supposed to react to being told that he “doesn’t have the passing game required”. The implication is clear – if Pienaar isn’t needed at flyhalf, he’ll be in the number 9 jersey and Kockott will need to be content with a bench role, or else leave. Now we don’t know what has gone on behind the scenes here, as Kockott hasn’t really been on top form recently and may well have announced his intentions to leave soon anyway. Fact is, though, he’s currently the most reliable goal-kicker in the Sharks squad and most fans would feel a lot more comfortable with him in the starting fifteen based on that factor alone.

The Sharks need to categorically end any and all speculation about Pienaar being used at flyhalf and live with the consequences of that decision. If they intend to back him at 9, that’s fine, even if it means losing Kockott. If they tell him and Kockott to duke it out for the 9 jersey, also fine, since those are the rules that seem to apply to any other position in the squad. But the onus is then firmly on them to find a long-term solution to the flyhalf problem and by bringing in mercenaries and journeymen like Andy Goode, they only delay the inevitable. Is it too much to hope that somebody like Pat Lambie might find himself blooded at flyhalf in this Super 14, to take on the role permanently in the Currie Cup? That, to me, would be the best long-term solution.

John Plumtree needs to learn a lesson here, though. No matter what else is going on within the squad, publicly slagging off your players is not going to improve morale in any way. Use it, don’t use it…



162 Comments

  • I guess what I’m saying is this… if Ruan is first choice 9, pick him there and then worry about who will play 10.

  • Comment 1, posted at 23.02.10 19:06:39 by robdylan Reply
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  • man, how many articles have I written about this now? About 100?

  • Comment 2, posted at 23.02.10 19:09:28 by robdylan Reply
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  • Good read Rob…it looks like Goode is earmarked for the kicking duties down under. However i think Kockott is a better kicker. Im hoping for a Ruan Andy combination against the Highlanders.

  • Comment 3, posted at 23.02.10 19:17:01 by Hertford Highlander Reply
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  • i know hindsight is 20….20 vision. But remember how Frans Steyn burst onto the scene as a 19 year old for sharks at 10? I thought the second Honiball….with an added bonus of a siege gun boot , had arrived.

    What a pity he wasnt left there….Barritt would have stayed at 12, Adi/Murray at 13…Ruan at 9…..

    My opinion…..get Frans Steyn back….at 10….and let him develop there….he wants that 10 spot…..problem is the cash i suppose….but it was the endless shunting of players that caused the chaos.

    Let Ruan be at 9 now….i have no doubt Kockitt will leave…accept it and build ….find a world class 10…and make the 1 st call to Frans Steyn.

  • Comment 4, posted at 23.02.10 19:20:36 by grant10 Reply

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  • The Pienaar Goode combo will be good provided Goode is the place kicker.

    Kockott has been okay so far this season but how long before the “I can do it all” syndrome sets in?

  • Comment 5, posted at 23.02.10 19:21:13 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • Will Greenwood said if you made a list of the top 300 flyhalves in the world Andy Goode would be about half way on the list.

    Not my call …but wouldn’t be far off Sharks supporters may be really disappointed when they see him in action. He appears really slow but kicks well from hand, however is that is what is required ?

  • Comment 6, posted at 23.02.10 19:25:39 by Hertford Highlander Reply
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  • That was a careless bit of media work from plum

  • Comment 7, posted at 23.02.10 19:28:25 by war1 Reply
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  • @Hertford Highlander (Comment 6) :

    Nope kicking is NOT what is required unless it is at goal.

    I saw him play some darn decent Premiership Rugby for Leicester in ’08.

  • Comment 8, posted at 23.02.10 19:30:48 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 1) : for the same number of kicks rory missed on friday, ruan was dropped from the springboks team in the 2nd test against the b&i lions. So can we say that rory is an inconsistent kicker?

  • Comment 9, posted at 23.02.10 19:32:27 by Megatron Reply

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  • @Hertford Highlander (Comment 6) : Greenwood wouldn’t even make the list of the top 300 England centres called Will Greenwood :)

  • Comment 10, posted at 23.02.10 19:33:10 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 10) : :mrgreen:

  • Comment 11, posted at 23.02.10 19:37:16 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • This is not really a surprise considering the make-up of the touring party, if pienaar was seen as a flyhalf, then kockott would have been the only scrumhalf, still think plum should have curbed his enthusiasm and not mouthed off to the press

  • Comment 12, posted at 23.02.10 19:38:00 by war1 Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 10) : Harsh lol :lol:

  • Comment 13, posted at 23.02.10 19:44:37 by Hertford Highlander Reply
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  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 8) :

    Leicester continue to play decent rugby …but it doesn`t even go close to ressembling what`s happening in the Super 14 at the moment !

  • Comment 14, posted at 23.02.10 19:48:50 by Hertford Highlander Reply
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  • @Hertford Highlander (Comment 14) :

    I agree. The Bottom placed S14 side would defeat the Guiness premiership winner on a bad day. Would be a close game but the Southern hemisphere side would still win.

    That Said, Goode is a international flyhalf with lots of experience. The only one in the Sharks camp who would be better is Ruan pienaar IMO.

    Pienaar would also be better than Kockott at 9 before the “I can do it all” sets in from kockott.

    Either way having al three of them in your match 22 leaves you with PLENTY of options on match day.

  • Comment 15, posted at 23.02.10 19:53:27 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 15) :

    OOPS got sidetracked.

    What I wanted to say was Goode is Gooder than anything else we have had try out at 10 this season, bar Ruan Pienaar.

  • Comment 16, posted at 23.02.10 19:54:57 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • @Megatron (Comment 9) : you wouldn’t be all that wrong, in that case. Stats don’t lie

  • Comment 17, posted at 23.02.10 20:00:03 by robdylan Reply
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  • andy goode was 3rd choice at Brive…

  • Comment 18, posted at 23.02.10 20:02:21 by Megatron Reply

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  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 16) : I don’t think Goode will be a disaster however he won’t be a saviour either i would have gone with young talent….why wouldn’t you with all the experience in the squad.

    Stop gap is being polite…my call Goode well off the pace. Goode looks like he is about 20 Stone :lol:

    All will be revealed in time…..Dan Carter first stop :shock: ….good luck Andy !

  • Comment 19, posted at 23.02.10 20:04:47 by Hertford Highlander Reply
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  • @Megatron (Comment 18) : Not in the drinking races :cool:

  • Comment 20, posted at 23.02.10 20:06:20 by Hertford Highlander Reply
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  • @Hertford Highlander (Comment 20) : lol :D

  • Comment 21, posted at 23.02.10 20:07:28 by Megatron Reply

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  • @Hertford Highlander (Comment 19) :

    We can blood the youngsters IF the season goes pear shaped. Until then we need to go with experience.

  • Comment 22, posted at 23.02.10 20:10:24 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 22) : After the tour then ;-)

  • Comment 23, posted at 23.02.10 20:21:13 by Hertford Highlander Reply
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  • @Hertford Highlander (Comment 23) : :mrgreen: OUCH!!!!!! :mrgreen:

  • Comment 24, posted at 23.02.10 20:24:45 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • Thank Goodness plum finally saw that Kockett does not have one of the most important things to be a decent scrummie…passing. By the way that’s only one of the things he doesn’t have.

  • Comment 25, posted at 23.02.10 20:43:14 by Letgo Reply
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  • SHOLDN`T PLUM AND REST OF COACHING STAFF WORK WITH THE PLAYERS TO MAKE THEM BETTER PLAYERS ?????????SURELY THERE MUST BE ENOUGH RUGBY BALLS AROUND FOR HIM TO PRACTICE,PRACTICE,PRACTICE??? OR ,HE COULD HAVE BEEN SENT TO THE NEW STADIUM ACROSS THE ROAD AND PASSED BRICKS TO THE GUYS BUILDING .

  • Comment 26, posted at 23.02.10 20:59:28 by bergshark Reply

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  • GET THE COACHING STAFF “THE IDIOT`S GUIDE TO COACHING RUGBY UNION” AND THE ADMIN STAFF “THE IDIOT`S GUIDE TO RUNNING A SUCCESFUL SPORTS TEAM”!!!

  • Comment 27, posted at 23.02.10 21:01:35 by bergshark Reply

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  • don`t wanna see kockott leave the sharks .

  • Comment 28, posted at 23.02.10 21:03:41 by bergshark Reply

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  • @war1 (Comment 7) : hope he was misquoted .. reporter looking to stir perhaps? putting words in plum`s mouth? hope so…

  • Comment 29, posted at 23.02.10 21:05:41 by bergshark Reply

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  • @bergshark (Comment 27) : my ears! :-)

  • Comment 30, posted at 23.02.10 21:18:04 by robdylan Reply
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  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 22) : in the meantime the hurricanes are not wasting any time blooding the mercurial [irb junior world player of the year] aaron cruden, he is going to mature infront of our own eyes and become an asset for the all blacks while we stall the progress of our youngsters with our conservatism.

  • Comment 31, posted at 23.02.10 21:25:04 by Megatron Reply

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  • @Megatron (Comment 31) : cru are doing the same with Robbie Freuan

  • Comment 32, posted at 23.02.10 21:39:59 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan: oops ..sorry ,pardon my enthusiasm :) ..but the backroom team makes me really upset at the moment

  • Comment 33, posted at 23.02.10 21:40:21 by bergshark Reply

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  • rob, is plum off the mark? i am sure plum has spoken to him hundreds of times at training about this and the guy shows no interest in improving. how is a team supposed to score tries with their backline if their scrumhalf is selfish? i think rory has been given enough time to improve his distribution, he has no desire to, so why should the coach cover up for him. i am with plum on this one. plum has taken a lot of flack for his selections and the teams inability to score, so if a player is not performing and plum gets more flack for it should he rollover and take it? i like the way he has grown balls. it sends a clear message to the egotistical players, listen or get the boot. the coach is the first under fire, so he has the right to put the players against the wall with him. next he must take jannie and stefan. if a player doesn’t play as a team man, then he mustn’t get special treatment.

  • Comment 34, posted at 24.02.10 07:37:21 by try time Reply

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  • @Hertford Highlander (Comment 3) : you obviously never watched fridays game. :roll:

  • Comment 35, posted at 24.02.10 07:38:13 by try time Reply

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  • @war1 (Comment 7) : i think it was intended. he saying to his team, let me down and you will sink to. plum has kept quiet and taken a lot of criticism for his team. but the time has come to start putting the players in there place. i say good one plum, name and shame the players that are dragging your reputation through the mud.

  • Comment 36, posted at 24.02.10 07:43:45 by try time Reply

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  • @bergshark (Comment 28) : i wouldn’t mind. there are a lot better ones out there.

  • Comment 37, posted at 24.02.10 07:47:06 by try time Reply

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  • a scrumhalf is the LINK between forwards and backs, he isn’t the wing. so therefore his main job is distribution. rory doesn’t distribute at all, therefore cannot be classed a scrumhalf. i have suggested that we can still keep him in the team but as a wing. problem is we all saw in a game last year he was brought on for an injured backline player, while charl was the scrummie and he kept taken over charls job. this shows the idiocy of the guy.

  • Comment 38, posted at 24.02.10 07:51:13 by try time Reply

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  • @Megatron (Comment 31) : yeah you just need to look at the youngsters in the reds. yes they make mistakes but when they get it together they are awesome. we wait until our youngsters have lost the hunger before we recruit. why the hell is lambie not getting game time. are they waiting for his spirit to break?

  • Comment 39, posted at 24.02.10 07:53:20 by try time Reply

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  • I must say I was surprised by this call by Plum.

    Forget Pienaar for a second.

    Firstly, Kockett has been accused of being his own man and doing too many things on his own and kicking the ball away too much.

    Well here is a little bit of information for everyone.

    A 9 WILL NOT kick 9 out of 10 balls UNLESS instructed to do so.

    Nor would any half decent 9 ‘go at it on his own’ unless again it is part of the game plan or strategy to ‘keep things close’ in certain situations.

    IN fact, Rory is one of the better 9′s around the fringes in my view – and to slate his passing game? That is rich.

    Rory to my mind is the closest to a Fourie du Preez clone that we could wish to have in SA (if that is what you are looking for) with his only criticism being his temperament – but that is an issue which can be managed.

    Every other single scrummy in SA has at least one or two glaring weaknesses in their game in which Rory, to my mind is the more rounded 9′s you could wish for. Put that guy in a Bulls team and see him control and win you matches similar to Fourie du Preez.

    I guess Bob Dwyer is licking his lips – he will be getting a world class scrummy to go with his England international flyhalf at the Rebels very soon.

    This is #%^*&@ daft.

  • Comment 40, posted at 24.02.10 08:17:16 by Morné Reply
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  • @Morné (Comment 40) : totally disagree, rory is selfish and cannot be put in the same class as fourie, not even the same postal code. fourie you will see all over the park and he is quick to get the ball to morne steyn. fourie makes flyhalves look good. rory makes a backline disappear. you can’t compare the two.

  • Comment 41, posted at 24.02.10 08:22:57 by try time Reply

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  • jarno vermaak is the closest scrummie to fourie.

  • Comment 42, posted at 24.02.10 08:24:06 by try time Reply

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  • @Morné (Comment 40) : i don’t mind rory being sent to sabotage the rebels chances.

  • Comment 43, posted at 24.02.10 08:25:11 by try time Reply

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  • @Morné (Comment 40) : Agree with you 95%. What I would add is that, besides Rory’s temperament, he is too slow in clearing the ball from the rucks. Both Ruan and Charl provide better service in my view.

  • Comment 44, posted at 24.02.10 08:30:17 by rhineshark Reply
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  • @try time (Comment 43) : you’re starting to sound a little petty and vindictive here. Did Rory steal your parking spot at Gateway, or something?

  • Comment 45, posted at 24.02.10 08:30:33 by robdylan Reply
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  • @try time (Comment 41) :

    Dude that is utter kak.

    Do you for one second believe a scrummy or any player just decides on his own to kick or run 8 out of 10 balls on his own?

    The whole Sharks approach to rugby in the last 3 years has been the counter game, i.e. kick everything in sight and hope the opposition makes a mistake.

    That means players play towards that strategy and we can both highlight many players and instances to support that statement.

    I dare you to take one single aspect of Rory’s play as a scrumhalf, and the skill set his has, and prove to me he is shit.

    Why is it that not three seasons ago (about the last time the Sharks played decent rugby) Rory was punted as a Bok and when he was not selected a massive upheavel was made of that fact especially on this very blog?

    Since then, the Sharks game strategies went for a ball of shit, and with it, the form of Pienaar, Murray, JP (in 2008 and part of 09), and a host of other Sharks players?

    And you single out Rory?

    Like I said – take one aspect of his play, or even look at it hollistically and tell me he is a shit 9.

    Then ask yourself, is he a shit 9 or is he simply playing under shit coaching strategies (like half the Sharks team)?

    @try time (Comment 42) :

    Jano Vermaak is overrated.

    He is one of about 5 very good scrummies with no wow factor that sets him apart.

  • Comment 46, posted at 24.02.10 08:32:26 by Morné Reply
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  • Completely off topic.

    Rob, I have a suggestion. I have been on other blogs, where they have a different system of awarding posts, by allowing anyone to pos or neg a post.

    So instead of people racking up the posts to get their stars they will have to make comments worthy of a postive status by impressing others with their awesome rugby knowledge, sharp wit and supporter’s cred.

    Quality over quantity. Whaddaya reckon?

  • Comment 47, posted at 24.02.10 08:37:36 by rhineshark Reply
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  • @Morné (Comment 46) : If that is the case then somebody is lying cause Plum has repeatedly stated that that he wants the sharks to keep more ball in hand, even during the halftime interview. So either Plum is bullshitting us or Rory (and Stefan) refuses to listen

  • Comment 48, posted at 24.02.10 08:38:02 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Morné (Comment 46): bryce would back you up on this, if he were still around. Seems the scrummie-as-fourth-loose-forward approach is a hallmark of the Plumtree game

  • Comment 49, posted at 24.02.10 08:39:42 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 48) :

    Just look at how your team has played in the last 2 years dude.

    Either the whole team is ignoring the coach or the coach is coaching them to play that way – what is your guess?

  • Comment 50, posted at 24.02.10 08:43:01 by Morné Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 49) :

    You want more evidence of this?

    Have a look at Weepu’s game early in his career and compare that to what you see now in the Sharks… (both under the Plumtree hand)

  • Comment 51, posted at 24.02.10 08:44:05 by Morné Reply
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  • Sorry dudes – your coach is losing the plot quickly here.

  • Comment 52, posted at 24.02.10 08:45:18 by Morné Reply
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  • @Morné (Comment 46) : yes scrummies have always been laws unto themselves. i am not complaining about rory’s kicking. all scrummies kick. i am complaining about his distribution. i don’t get how you can compare him to fourie in this department. when fourie gets a ball to his flyhalf the flyhalf has time to make a dozen decisions. when rory hands the ball to his flyhalf, the guy already has 3 defenders in his rib cage. the reason rory takes so long to get the ball out is he first try to make the break himself and then passes it when he realises he has kocked it.

    as for defence it isn’t a big part of a scrummies game because he has loosies around to do that for him, he shouldn’t be at the bottom of a breakdown anyway. so who cares how many scrummies are better defenders.

  • Comment 53, posted at 24.02.10 08:45:29 by try time Reply

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  • And as a matter of interest, go back and have a look at how I criticised Rory before, but just about all of my criticism on him has been on temperament – same as with Bismarck.

    So he is not my favourite player by a bloody longshot.

    But when it comes to pure skill as a 9 – this guys is bloody good.

  • Comment 54, posted at 24.02.10 08:46:54 by Morné Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 45) : no he has made the sharks backline look shit. and that used to be the pride of sharks rugby. i don’t like what the sharks have become, and he is part of the rot.

  • Comment 55, posted at 24.02.10 08:47:39 by try time Reply

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  • @Morné (Comment 50) : At this moment I don’t have a clue….honestly because there is big issues at the Sharks at the moment.
    On a lighter note a good friend of mine and big Sharks fan told me yesterday that he disconnected his DSTV because he refuses to put himself through the same stress again this year about the rugby.
    He also came over to my house with the 2007 S14 final and we all know what happened that day

  • Comment 56, posted at 24.02.10 08:48:16 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 48) : with you here.

  • Comment 57, posted at 24.02.10 08:48:51 by try time Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 49) : i disagree because if this were so he wouldn’t be fighting in ruans corner.

  • Comment 58, posted at 24.02.10 08:49:51 by try time Reply

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  • @try time (Comment 53) :

    Do you think quick distribution is solely dependent on your scrummy?

    Interesting…

    Tell me, how did you rate Fourie’s distribution (and also his all-round game in getting the backline and his forwards on the front foot) at the EOYT last year?

    And defence is not big for a 9???

    Go check how many times Ruan was run-over when he was your first choice…

    Defence is massive for a 9 dude, bloody massive

  • Comment 59, posted at 24.02.10 08:50:11 by Morné Reply
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  • @Morné (Comment 50) : or maybe it is a combination of the two. i would take that option.

  • Comment 60, posted at 24.02.10 08:50:59 by try time Reply

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  • @try time (Comment 39) : look at israel dagg at the highlanders he was the rookie of the year last year in my book and is gaining in confidence & poise, the boy is only 21!

    In south africa, stefan terblanche would’ve been played ad nauseum before a talent like dagg with no benefit to the boks or the future of the franchise! Our favourite line to justify our conservatism “he is still young he will get his chance”

  • Comment 61, posted at 24.02.10 08:51:36 by Megatron Reply

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  • @grant10 (Comment 4) : well said and agree :razz: :smile: ;-)

  • Comment 62, posted at 24.02.10 08:52:42 by Charmaine Reply

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  • @Morné (Comment 52) : Now we agree, I am starting to think that the best thing that can happen with the Sharks this year is that they end dead last in the S14, so they can clear some of the baggage

  • Comment 63, posted at 24.02.10 08:52:43 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Morné (Comment 59) : if you use eoyt’s as a bench mark of players abilities then you are going to be disappointed. by the time these guys get on the plane they are sore, exhausted and gatvol. lets rather look at fouries s14 performance last year. he is the glue in that team.

  • Comment 64, posted at 24.02.10 08:56:31 by try time Reply

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  • @bergshark (Comment 26) : aaahhhh but still nice stadium though ;-)

  • Comment 65, posted at 24.02.10 08:58:28 by Charmaine Reply

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  • @Megatron (Comment 61) : You’re right. The Bulls are the only SA franchise not afraid to blood very young players and then stick by them, even if they screw up in the beginning. The Reds put their faith in Cooper and Beale, who had a few shockers between them, but have started maturing into the kind of players that can sink any team on any day. Such as the Crusaders.

  • Comment 66, posted at 24.02.10 08:59:37 by rhineshark Reply
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  • @try time (Comment 55) :

    Rory made the Sharks backline look shit?

    How about not having a decent 10 in 3 years?

    How about stuffing around the only most decent 12 you had since Dick Muir?

    You know what the problem with the Sharks are?

    It is coaches saying the following about players (Muir on Steyn):

    He is just too talented to leave out (so they select him on wing, 13, 15, 12 and 10). And then effectively, pissing people off and losing them.

  • Comment 67, posted at 24.02.10 09:01:55 by Morné Reply
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  • @Morné (Comment 59) : but then ruan’s loosies weren’t doing their job, and that is hardly surprising. scrumhalves should only defend if it is absolutely critical. watch how the bulls loosies protect fourie.

  • Comment 68, posted at 24.02.10 09:04:32 by try time Reply

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  • @try time (Comment 64) :

    The point is quite simple (using the EOYT).

    Classy players does not suddenly become shit – situations around them, and that surrounds them contribute to that.

    Rory did not turn from Bok quality 2 or 3 seasons ago where he was unlucky not to get selected to absolute rubbish.

    Similarly, Fourie did not turn to shit simply because he had a bad EOYT.

    It is not as easy as that.

  • Comment 69, posted at 24.02.10 09:04:39 by Morné Reply
    Author
    MornéTeam captain
     
  • @Morné (Comment 67) : what is the point of wasting money on a ten if he isn’t going to get decent ball. i also question why our tens get injured a lot more than other teams and maybe it is because our scrummie isn’t giving them clean ball.

  • Comment 70, posted at 24.02.10 09:06:06 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @try time (Comment 68) :

    Fourie plays a totally different game defensively.

    The Bulls have their 8th man in the first line of defense and Fourie takes over the last line of defense (falls back and covers) simply because the Bulls play a territorial game.

    Plum uses his scrummy as a 4th loosie on defense.

  • Comment 71, posted at 24.02.10 09:06:40 by Morné Reply
    Author
    MornéTeam captain
     
  • @try time (Comment 70) :

    Again, you claim that it is the sole responsibility of a 9 to get the backline moving forward?

    I think you are going to be in for one hell of a surprise when Ruan takes over the 9 role at the Sharks and you see exactly the same stuff repeated.

  • Comment 72, posted at 24.02.10 09:07:53 by Morné Reply
    Author
    MornéTeam captain
     
  • @Morné (Comment 69) : so a classy player turning shit is a coaches fault? that makes sense. or maybe it is because they become predictable and opposition know their weaknesses, or maybe they rest on their laurels, like ernie els.

  • Comment 73, posted at 24.02.10 09:09:49 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @Morné (Comment 71) : funny then how the bulls are scoring a lot more tries through their backline then. this what i said pees me off the most about the current sharks. th bulls are playing classic sharks rugby and the sharks are playing traditional bulls 10 man rugby.

  • Comment 74, posted at 24.02.10 09:12:15 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • Anycase – I am done on this subject.

    I have just about supported Plum in everything so far but this article if to be believed, makes me think he is losing the plot.

    I hope you guys do not have to endure a kak season I believe you might.

  • Comment 75, posted at 24.02.10 09:12:44 by Morné Reply
    Author
    MornéTeam captain
     
  • @try time (Comment 73) : @try time (Comment 74) :

    Both of what you said comes down to strategies employed which comes back to the coach.

    If only one player turns to shit for form, then I would agree with you.

    But mate, close to 70% of players in the Sharks team are utter kak at the moment and have been for some time.

    There is no way in hell a bug exists that would infect that many classy, Bok capped players to play the utter rubbish they do now.

  • Comment 76, posted at 24.02.10 09:14:43 by Morné Reply
    Author
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  • @Morné (Comment 72) : no if you look at my pre-season article i had highlighted what a good scrummie would do. and both ruan and rory are at opposite extremes.

  • Comment 77, posted at 24.02.10 09:15:55 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @Morné (Comment 76) : morne it all started with the backline disappearing. in last years s14 the forwards carried the team because between rory and stefan the backline had squat attacking ball. this year i think the forwards are just gatvol carrying 7 players.

  • Comment 78, posted at 24.02.10 09:17:50 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • Rob this whole article (and attack on Plumtree) is based on him mouthing off in the open behind Rory’s back. Is there any evidence that he has not spoken to him prior to this interview and stipulated exactly the same sentiments to him in a friendly professional way which is agreeable with Rory (even if its hard to digest) Rory is on the bench so I presume Plum would have told him that and why. This interview took place after the team announcement.

    Yesterday we were asked to email messages of support to the team to give them moral support. This article can go a long way to negating that if my abovementioned scenario took place.

  • Comment 79, posted at 24.02.10 09:23:07 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @try time (Comment 78) :

    Mate with all due respect, that is a deluded view to take.

    You blame 2 years of average to poor rugby on two players?

  • Comment 80, posted at 24.02.10 09:24:26 by Morné Reply
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  • @Morné (Comment 76) : i agree partly, i am not totally vindicating plum here. his hands also have blood on them. but i also think plum is stuck between a rock and a hard place. he has administration that loses more quality players than gains through poor contracting. and he has some average players he has to field because there is nothing better. but i also blame him for not taking a gamble on some talented youngsters we do have. he can be a little conservative at times. so i think the blame must be evenly spread here.

  • Comment 81, posted at 24.02.10 09:25:15 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • I am out.

  • Comment 82, posted at 24.02.10 09:25:33 by Morné Reply
    Author
    MornéTeam captain
     
  • @try time (Comment 81) :

    The sum of parts is coming together in my view now.

    Sad thing is, Plum is not a bad coach, and you have no bad players in your team, in fact, most of them bloody class.

    I will say what I said before – structural issues at the Sharks which limits talented people doing their jobs to the best of their ability – and it affects everyone.

    Plum is panicking, and it is to be expected.

    Sad, but expected.

    Okay now I am really out – later dudes.

  • Comment 83, posted at 24.02.10 09:28:15 by Morné Reply
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    MornéTeam captain
     
  • @Morné (Comment 80) : damn right, between stefan and rory handing ball to the opposition last year the sharks spent most the season defending. this not only lessened the chance of four try bp, but it also burnt out the players. the defending totally stuffed the players up so that at the business end of the comp the sharks had nothing left in their tanks.

  • Comment 84, posted at 24.02.10 09:28:32 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @Morné (Comment 83) : i agree. we are both arguing about parts but i think when we look at the whole we agree. and it is really the whole that has put the sharks in the quagmire they are currently in. whether rory is the devil incarnate is only a bit part in a major tragedy.

  • Comment 85, posted at 24.02.10 09:33:00 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • thanks morne. that was enjoyable. as most people i have blinkers on and it is nice to discuss pertinent issues to actually get more out. as long as you take the blinkers off during the discussion that is.

  • Comment 86, posted at 24.02.10 09:38:47 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • See, with my suggested pos or neg system we could have been handing out rewards for this TT/Morné debate instead of just a meaningless :grin:

  • Comment 87, posted at 24.02.10 09:50:43 by rhineshark Reply
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  • here is what i want from the sharks. i want all the players and coaches to clear their slate. they must start afresh. we may not make the playoffs this year but we must go down fighting. we need to take gambles. we need to breathe life back into the team. we want the team on a high so they are ready for next year. the super 15 is going to suit the sharks a lot more, so the sharks need to be ready for that. lets rebuild, with a hope of a playoff this year, but with an aim of the first super 15 trophy in their cabinet. if the sharks administration don’t take this view then the sharks are going to be in b section in no time at all.

  • Comment 88, posted at 24.02.10 09:55:25 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @try time (Comment 84) : and last year that tactic worked to a certain degree but this year with the new law applications giving away possesion is just not on.

  • Comment 89, posted at 24.02.10 09:56:45 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @rhineshark (Comment 87) : only problem with that system is it gets ruined by lazy people that don’t rate. sharksworld should view all posts as important as it is an effort made by the poster. but maybe merit points can be added for entertaining or pertinent posts.

  • Comment 90, posted at 24.02.10 09:58:34 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @try time (Comment 88) : I agree totally

  • Comment 91, posted at 24.02.10 09:58:37 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @try time (Comment 88) : well then you need to clear the slate from your side as well. I’m trying so hard to encourage people to be positive – at least about the players – yet you refuse to play along.

  • Comment 92, posted at 24.02.10 09:59:11 by robdylan Reply
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  • @try time (Comment 90) : that is an idea I’m working on… like “comment of the day” getting an extra few million points.

  • Comment 93, posted at 24.02.10 10:00:04 by robdylan Reply
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  • @try time (Comment 86) : @Morné (Comment 83) :

    You have to look at the funny side of this…Tits and ass having a full blown rugby conversation here :mrgreen: ;-)

  • Comment 94, posted at 24.02.10 10:00:28 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 89) : this year that tactic is pure suicide. look at that simple cheetahs try because stefan kicked the ball away, all our players were offside so had to retreat so weren’t able to creat a defensive line and the cheetahs 15 waltzed through. this is why i want pat or ludik to take over at the back. someone that runs it under pressure rather than kicks it.

  • Comment 95, posted at 24.02.10 10:01:26 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @Pokkel (Comment 94) : :lol: :lol: i feel like a real tit. and morne well he is an ass. :lol: :lol: (just joking morne, it just went well with the comment ;-) )

  • Comment 96, posted at 24.02.10 10:03:51 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @Pokkel (Comment 94) : Now see – daai bek het jam nodig :mrgreen:

  • Comment 97, posted at 24.02.10 10:04:27 by rhineshark Reply
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  • @try time (Comment 95) : One day we will probably know what exactly the problem is with the Sharks but they need to look at solving it now so we can look forward to next year…..and give the younsters exposure please

  • Comment 98, posted at 24.02.10 10:05:26 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 94) : @try time (Comment 96) :

    Kak funny.

    Rob there is your comments of the day!

  • Comment 99, posted at 24.02.10 10:06:18 by Morné Reply
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    MornéTeam captain
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 92) : aaah but that is the whole argument being had whether it is better to have happy robots living in harmony, or being human? there is no right or wrong answer. without the negative you don’t see the positive, but too much negative and you kill the positive. it isn’t an easy balancing act.

  • Comment 100, posted at 24.02.10 10:07:29 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @try time (Comment 96) : @rhineshark (Comment 97) : @Morné (Comment 99) : I’ll take the comment of the day points thank you very much :mrgreen:

  • Comment 101, posted at 24.02.10 10:07:55 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 98) : oh yes the younsters bring them on they have to learn to play with the big boys or when are they going to ripe ;-) :razz:

  • Comment 102, posted at 24.02.10 10:10:35 by Charmaine Reply

    ChazTeam captain
     
  • @Pokkel (Comment 98) : yes that is why hope pat and mvovo are given a chance to prove themselves.

  • Comment 103, posted at 24.02.10 10:11:50 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @Pokkel (Comment 101) : you can have mine. :lol: i don’t need accolades. i just want my team to win.

  • Comment 104, posted at 24.02.10 10:12:46 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 92) : but rob haven’t you noticed your site is so much busier the more negativity there is, so you cannot tell me secretly you don’t mind it. even negativity has a positive.

  • Comment 105, posted at 24.02.10 10:14:38 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @try time (Comment 90) : That’s just the beauty of it. Every post is important to the poster, but could be meaningless in the context of the topic, so that such a post (like the majority of posts on any given topic) would simply remain a neutral.

    The idea isn’t to dole out possies (or negs) like it’s sweeties, but like you said, awarding a bit of wit and positivity or negging the trollers.

    It might not even be possible on this blog, because the ones I’ve seen it used on look totally different and will likely have totally different coding as well.

  • Comment 106, posted at 24.02.10 10:16:43 by rhineshark Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 92) : and about clearing my slate i did try. if you go back to my pre season article and my comments, i was very positive. wasn’t my fault the sharks peed on that fire. but even in my negativity i did post a postive article last week. so don’t be as blinkered as i. ;-)

  • Comment 107, posted at 24.02.10 10:19:28 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @try time (Comment 107) : let’s be honest… your positive article was slightly tongue-in-cheek :) Just slightly…

  • Comment 108, posted at 24.02.10 10:22:00 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 101) :

    With Tits and Ass we can sort out world peace.

    But let’s start with the Sharks.

  • Comment 109, posted at 24.02.10 10:25:27 by Morné Reply
    Author
    MornéTeam captain
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 108) : what the tour article. no it wasn’t i was really pinning the sharks chances on using the returning teams fatigue against them. but since that shocker on friday my positivity has been quashed.

  • Comment 110, posted at 24.02.10 10:28:18 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 108) : oh i know what article you are talking about. my friday article. oh that was totally sarcastic and vindictive. :lol: :lol:

  • Comment 111, posted at 24.02.10 10:29:16 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • I don’t think Plum done the right thing by talking about Kockott to the press like that. What that does to a players confidence? Especially just before the tour of hell.

    If your team needs you then you play where ever they need you to play. I feel if Ruan played FH for a season he would be a really great FH. He needs to play in one position only and for a season at least. He wont get a place in the Bok squad playing scrummie that is for sure. Probably still get selected for (all positions man) Ricky will be on the bench for FdP. Ruan is our only other choice to fill in if Morne gets injured.

    Rory just getting messed about and will soon leave like Frans Steyn did.

  • Comment 112, posted at 24.02.10 10:37:32 by Puma Reply

    PumaCurrie Cup player
     
  • TT, Morne
    Your conversation made me think of the old Frank Zappa song – Titties and beer so I went to listen to it and had a good laugh. Thanks for the nostalgia prompt. :cool:

    Can be heard here. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=441-Vnv7cRY

    Titties and beer, titties and beer…..

  • Comment 113, posted at 24.02.10 10:48:35 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @Salmonoid (Comment 113) : we do our best to add positivity and cheer to peoples lives. :lol: :lol:

  • Comment 114, posted at 24.02.10 10:55:48 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • actually i’m looking at this article and wondering how my negativity towards rory, is any different to the negativity shown towards plum in the article and any different to plums negativity to rory. i realised good news doesn’t sell newspapers.

  • Comment 115, posted at 24.02.10 11:00:55 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @try time (Comment 114) : and very occasionally, you actually succeed :)

  • Comment 116, posted at 24.02.10 11:01:21 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
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  • @try time (Comment 115) : my protection only extends to the players. The coaches and administrators are up to shit and need to be shown the door

  • Comment 117, posted at 24.02.10 11:02:25 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
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  • @try time (Comment 115) :
    thus my comment here @Salmonoid (Comment 79) :

  • Comment 118, posted at 24.02.10 11:04:10 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 117) : agree ;-)

  • Comment 119, posted at 24.02.10 11:04:14 by Charmaine Reply

    ChazTeam captain
     
  • @try time (Comment 104) : Which team would that be :twisted: ;-)

  • Comment 120, posted at 24.02.10 11:04:59 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 117) :
    Do the players know this?, if yes then I wasted my time sending them a message yesterday.

  • Comment 121, posted at 24.02.10 11:08:12 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @Puma (Comment 112) : everyone in south africa gets slated to punt ruan! pdv said ruan has this & that & is the best yack yack yack & morne is not, yet when the chips were down at loftus, he called on “ice in the veins” morne to take us home…

    Jake white did the same thing with schalk burger vs both luke watson & heinrich brussow “if i were to throw the no.6 jersey into a room & put both players in there i know who would come out with it” “schalk was irb player of the year can heinrich ever achieve that?”

    If rory really doesn’t have the quick passing game plum wants, clearly it is something Plum has proof of and has asked of rory before…

    It’s like saying brussow gives the boks an extra dimension on the deck that schalk doesn’t have, it is a fact and there would be no reason 4 schalk to sulk!

  • Comment 122, posted at 24.02.10 11:09:54 by Megatron Reply

    MegatronSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Megatron (Comment 122) : I don’t think most of us would say that Ruan is better than Morne…but who is next in line if Morne gets injured? Ruan can be great if he gets a good run at 10 and SA needs that backup and competition for the top spot.

  • Comment 123, posted at 24.02.10 11:15:23 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Salmonoid (Comment 121) : Sammy, to my knowledge, the biggest issue right now in the Sharks setup is that the players have lost faith in the structures that are supposed to be ensuring their success

  • Comment 124, posted at 24.02.10 11:16:51 by robdylan Reply
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  • I would have prefered us to have ‘borrowed’ JL Potgieter from the Bulls. He was probably the 2nd best flyhalf in SA last year and he’s not gonna get much gametime behind Morne…and he can play 12.

  • Comment 125, posted at 24.02.10 11:19:49 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 124) :
    Have they lost faith in the coach?

  • Comment 126, posted at 24.02.10 11:19:52 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 123) : so you are saying Ruan must play a position unfamiliar to him just to have a shot at being the Bok backup 10? Makes no sense. He clearly believes that, on top of his game, he has the potential to challenge du Preez for 9.

  • Comment 127, posted at 24.02.10 11:20:29 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Salmonoid (Comment 126) : Sammy, I wouldn’t go out and say categorically 100% that they have, but I’m lead to believe that it may be so.

  • Comment 128, posted at 24.02.10 11:21:24 by robdylan Reply
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  • Did you guys hear Big Cobus` comment on superrugby monday night? I can`t believe he gets away with saying things like that on TV. :roll:

  • Comment 129, posted at 24.02.10 11:22:43 by Original Pierre Reply
    Author
    Original PierreSuper Rugby player
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 127) : The only reason the position is unfamiliar with him is because he hasn’t played there consistantly…..look I respect him for taking a stand but sometimes you need to bite the bullet and do what is best for the team

  • Comment 130, posted at 24.02.10 11:24:19 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Original Pierre (Comment 129) : I don’t watch superrugby…what did he say?

  • Comment 131, posted at 24.02.10 11:25:29 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 128) :
    If so then you can stand on your head but the results wont come, regardless of who plays scrumhalf / flyhalf.

  • Comment 132, posted at 24.02.10 11:30:47 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 123) : i wasn’t trying to open up that debate just merely showing that coaches from time to time do make comparisons! and there’s nothing wrong with it…especially when answering a direct question from a journalist about “where andy goode will slot in & what about ruan” then the coach has to give reasons for his decisions.

    For instance the ELVs sped up the game & necessitated that forward players needed to be far much more mobile, that is a consequence a coach needs to be aware of when making selections and is within his right to comment on in the media…bismarck is far much more mobile that captain dikgat & is a workaholic in the loose…fact

  • Comment 133, posted at 24.02.10 11:31:46 by Megatron Reply

    MegatronSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Original Pierre (Comment 129) : I’m afraid to ask what he said.

    @Salmonoid (Comment 132) : well… yes. But we can’t abandon them now, can we?

  • Comment 134, posted at 24.02.10 11:43:26 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Megatron (Comment 133) : True we don’t really know what goes on on the inside.

  • Comment 135, posted at 24.02.10 11:46:12 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 134) :
    No not abandon them, but certainly not get any hopes up, and start putting measures in place to start rectifying the problem.

  • Comment 136, posted at 24.02.10 12:02:10 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @Salmonoid (Comment 136) : well, yes. We’re on the same page. Look, I’m not expecting a miracle against the Crusaders this week. About the only thing that might make them better is getting away from the Durban “pressure cooker” for a bit. Also, teams that have THAT MUCH talent in them can always find a way to manufacture an unlikely win. But I will always support them 1000% every time they take the field. Believing they can win and thinking that they will win are not the same thing.

  • Comment 137, posted at 24.02.10 12:09:08 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 131) : @robdylan (Comment 134) : erm don`t tell me you guys don`t even understand Afrikaans?! Jeez . . .
    But okay I admit it`s not really up to Boots an All standards is it?
    I get the feeling those guys are not professional enough or they get easily distracted cause they would go on and on about the same thing and just forget to move on to a different topic! Very frustrating. Oh yeah and of course the sharks don`t really get coverage . . .

    Cobus was explaining something about a former player I think who you couldn`t get the ball from in the rucks cause he would hold onto it so tight it almost formed a T in his hands.
    I was watching with some friends and yes there were some young girls present so you can imagine the reaction.

    Come to think of it, I won`t be watching it again any time soon either! :shock:

  • Comment 138, posted at 24.02.10 12:14:33 by Original Pierre Reply
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    Original PierreSuper Rugby player
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 137) : I`m with you there Rob. We have to be realistic. While we still all support them of course, we can`t go around saying irresponsible things like ” they`re gonna make a come back and win the super 14″ . . .

    That`s just asking for egg on your face!

  • Comment 139, posted at 24.02.10 12:17:28 by Original Pierre Reply
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  • @Original Pierre (Comment 138) : Ek is Afrikaans, maar hulle show irriteer my verskriklik….Cobussie en Breytie….hulle maak hulle name gat. Ek het laas week n half uur gekyk en opgegee, kyk liewer Boots ‘n All

  • Comment 140, posted at 24.02.10 12:23:41 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 93) : how about 1000 my way Rob that would really be nice ;-)

  • Comment 141, posted at 24.02.10 12:33:27 by Charmaine Reply

    ChazTeam captain
     
  • @Pokkel (Comment 140) : boot ‘n all is a baie goeie program ek dink :|

  • Comment 142, posted at 24.02.10 12:34:46 by Charmaine Reply

    ChazTeam captain
     
  • @Charmaine (Comment 142) : if you don’t mind bulls bias. :lol:

  • Comment 143, posted at 24.02.10 12:54:36 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @Pokkel (Comment 140) : kobus makes me look intelligent. joel makes me look positive. and hugh makes me look sober. :lol: :lol: :lol:

  • Comment 144, posted at 24.02.10 12:57:55 by try time Reply

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  • I saw somewhere Joel had a lot to say regarding the signing of Goode. He was not impressed. I wonder where his loyalties are now. He left the sharks for wp didn`t he?

  • Comment 145, posted at 24.02.10 13:04:41 by Original Pierre Reply
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  • @Original Pierre (Comment 145) : joel has always been a bull at heart as that is where he started his career. that is where his loyalties lie. funny as it was his performances for the sharks that got him a bok spot. you can pick it up how commentates between the two teams.

  • Comment 146, posted at 24.02.10 13:07:33 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @try time
    :| :x :smile: ;-)

  • Comment 147, posted at 24.02.10 13:16:26 by Charmaine Reply

    ChazTeam captain
     
  • @try time (Comment 144) : I wouldn’t know all I see is boobs :mrgreen:

  • Comment 148, posted at 24.02.10 13:20:42 by Pokkel Reply
    Friend of SharksworldCompetition Winner Author
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 148) : :lol: :lol: rather boobs on my chest than a set of bull testicles. :lol: :lol:

  • Comment 149, posted at 24.02.10 13:22:47 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @try time (Comment 149) : Time for a change…Morne at least gives us a new ass every now and again ;-)

  • Comment 150, posted at 24.02.10 13:29:28 by Pokkel Reply
    Friend of SharksworldCompetition Winner Author
    Assistant coach
     
  • @Pokkel (Comment 150) : yeah i started to the other day, but got sidetracked.

  • Comment 151, posted at 24.02.10 13:40:24 by try time Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @try time (Comment 146) : That’s right. Stransky did his national service in the Air Force in Pretoria and started his career playing for N-Tvl U-19. The only reason I know this is because we were in the same compartment on the troeptrein to Snor City and the same bungalow in basics at Valhalla.

  • Comment 152, posted at 24.02.10 14:00:30 by rhineshark Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    Spirit of RugbyTeam captain
     
  • @rhineshark (Comment 152) : so you also lived in Tshwane? :)

  • Comment 153, posted at 24.02.10 14:26:05 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @rhineshark (Comment 152) : My condolences . ..

  • Comment 154, posted at 24.02.10 14:29:50 by Original Pierre Reply
    Author
    Original PierreSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Morné (Comment 40) : *clapping* Morne…if your misses doesn’t mind I’d like to marry you…..

  • Comment 155, posted at 24.02.10 15:13:05 by Just a Fan Reply

    Just a FanCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Morné (Comment 46) : *more clapping* marriage offer still on the table ;-)

  • Comment 156, posted at 24.02.10 15:15:34 by Just a Fan Reply

    Just a FanCurrie Cup player
     
  • @try time (Comment 146) : That is one person I would LOVE to throw rotten tomatoes at! He is completely negative about the Sharks – they should not allow him to work those games…..

  • Comment 157, posted at 24.02.10 15:30:32 by Just a Fan Reply

    Just a FanCurrie Cup player
     
  • :twisted: :| ;-)

  • Comment 158, posted at 25.02.10 07:56:31 by Charmaine Reply

    ChazTeam captain
     
  • @Charmaine (Comment 158) : you’re a very smiley person :-)

  • Comment 159, posted at 25.02.10 08:32:15 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 159) : that is who i am just bring my old 21yrs of age back where it should be lost it with all the years of marrige i guess but on this site must of found it thanks Rob your site really bring the good in people out
    :smile: ;-)

  • Comment 160, posted at 25.02.10 09:02:35 by Charmaine Reply

    ChazTeam captain
     
  • @Charmaine (Comment 160) : really glad you feel that way. Makes it seem even more worthwhile

  • Comment 161, posted at 25.02.10 09:12:22 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 161) : ;-)

  • Comment 162, posted at 25.02.10 09:18:36 by Charmaine Reply

    ChazTeam captain
     

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