VinChainSaw

Nope, the sky isn’t falling


Written by Jonathan Burt (VinChainSaw)

Posted in :Original Content, Springboks, Tri Nations, Wallabies on 25 Jul 2011 at 14:20
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I’ll probably get shot down by a good number for this post, but I honestly didn’t think things went that badly on Saturday morning.

Let us take a cold, objective, un-emotional look at how the game unfolded.

First up, it’s worth noting that, despite John and Peter’s repeated statements to the contrary, this was for all intents and purposes, a B team, if not a C team in certain positions (read open-side flank, lock, eightman to name but a few). I’m not really sure what people expected.  We had two test debutants in the front row, a very late second row replacement and we also had to carry old Stegman on the openside. A very inexperienced and unsettled engine room doesn’t normally lend itself to the formation of any sort of platform to launch attacks. And so it was.

Despite this, for most of the first half we dominated the territory and possession stats. In fact, take away some brilliant attacking play from Cooper and friends along with some pretty lack-lustre tackling by the Bok backs, and we would’ve gone into half-time 6-3 in front! At one point (given we were 12 points down at the time) the only time the Aussies had got into the Boks 22 was when they scored the two break-away tries! That does sound like a team that can’t tackle, but it doesn’t sound like a side that was being put to the sword.

Does anybody really think the Aussies would’ve scored those two first half tries if we had Butch and Jean in the inside channel (for Cooper’s break) instead of Steyn and Olivier? Same again if we had Habana or JPP on the right wing and they didn’t enter the ruck like Basson did? I certainly don’t think so. Do you think they would’ve scored those tries if they were playing Phillips and Giteau instead of Genia and Cooper as we did?

The attack was lack-lustre to say the least, but then we had absolutely no game-breakers in the side. There was no Jean de Villiers, no Bryan Habana, no Fourie du Preez , no Jacques Fourie, no Pierre Spies, no Heinrich Brussouw, no Andries Bekker, no Beast etc etc etc. Yet we still scored two tries?

Now don’t get me wrong; we weren’t great. But field our first choice backline (and add in some monstrous defence from somebody like Burger) and it would’ve been a 5 point game even if we didn’t score any additional points, and that’s without even bringing Spies, Matfield, Bakkies, Bismarck etc into the mix. And this is, after all, an away game and we dont tend to win too many of those in Oz anyway.

Now let’s be completely clear and honest here; much as I don’t like them the Aussie backs were a class above our lot. We looked ineffectual and there were holes in the 10/12 channel that you could drive a tractor through. Also, reference how much better we looked when Steyn and Olivier left the park. There was more urgency, we were standing flatter and actually attacking the game-line. If we’d had that from the start it would’ve been a completely different game.

De Villiers and his cohorts need to take some responsibility for this. It’s been a couple of seasons now that Steyn has been shown to be very ineffective in getting his outside backs away and that’s largely because he just stands too deep in the pocket. For Cooper and o’Connor it was a field day because they knew Steyn’s only option was to kick. Add in a typically frail defensive performance between him and Olivier and all the Aussies needed to do was play the odds and leave some runners back in wait for the inevitable kick and chase. To me it seems an extraordinary waste to even play somebody like Juan de Jongh when he has both Steyn and Olivier on his inside.

All in all, I’d be a lot more concerned if I was Australian. All I heard after the game was how they bossed us around and, while they were a level above us in the backs, I really didn’t see much bossing around at all, especially in the first half.

Given that the Aussies fielded an almost full-strength side and still had to rely on some individual brilliance (which we also have, just not on the field) to pull off the win says a lot to me. I don’t think the doom and gloom is justified but over the years I’ve become rather accustomed to Bok fans thinking the sky is about to fall on their heads the moment we lose a game, with no context given to the situation at all.

Given that we have 22 first choice players currently working hard to over-come niggles and injuries in the lead-up to the world cup and I think we’re in pretty good shape. I do, however, think we’ll get hammered by the kiwis next weekend. They have a much more clinical approach and will viciously target our weak areas.

One last thing; has Steyn evolved at all over the last few seasons. Brilliant kicker that he is, does he offer anything at all outside of this?



92 Comments

  • Steyn offers nothing more at flyhalf than someone who you can bank on to knock the penalties over.

  • Comment 1, posted at 25.07.11 14:25:03 by lostfish Reply
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  • I can’t really comment too much on the game because I Stegmanned it.

    I also agree the Wobblies are taking too much out of the game because these were not our first choice and a lot of these guys hadn’t played together and for some it was their first game in the green and gold.

  • Comment 2, posted at 25.07.11 14:26:54 by lostfish Reply
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  • @lostfish (Comment 2) :

    Lol. Stegmanned it. Classic.

    I also forgot to mention something that a brilliant coach once told me: 9 out of 10 times the better-drilled side, and not the most talented side, will win.
    Given the lack of experience some of the combinations had together (and differing styles of play at SR level)and that rings completely true.
    How do you even begin to compare the relationship that Cooper and Genai have developed playing with the Reds and Wallabies with the lack of relationship that Pienaar, playing in Ireland, and Steyn had.

  • Comment 3, posted at 25.07.11 14:31:09 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 3) :

    Vinnie…..you nearly had me there until you mentioned Spies 3 times in the article as a player we missed……eish! :mrgreen:

  • Comment 4, posted at 25.07.11 14:35:59 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 3) : It’s trending on twitter – rather amusing.

  • Comment 5, posted at 25.07.11 14:39:39 by lostfish Reply
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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 3) :

    You’ve been scarce. How are you doing Vinnie?

  • Comment 6, posted at 25.07.11 14:39:54 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 4) :

    Hehe. Not a fan myself in any form!

  • Comment 7, posted at 25.07.11 14:47:30 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 6) :

    Agh, not bad mate. Just been busy of late but got a bit more of my own time back now. How bout yourself?

  • Comment 8, posted at 25.07.11 14:48:20 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • You raise a lot of good points which I hadn’t considered but as other have pointed out – when last has Habana or Spies been game breakers?

  • Comment 9, posted at 25.07.11 15:00:34 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 8) : Not bad……..carrying on!

    Very cold here today…..we might even see some snow and I’ll admit I hope we get some. :mrgreen:

    When you live here and it only snows once every 10 years or so then it becomes quite an event. Not like you mud island inhabitants that are used to this kind of weather. ;-)

  • Comment 10, posted at 25.07.11 15:01:35 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 9) :

    Hehe. Yes but at least they have in the past. When has Basson or Johnson ever been a game-breaker?

  • Comment 11, posted at 25.07.11 15:03:49 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 10) :

    I love the snow myself. But only for about two days – after that it just becomes a disgusting black sludge!
    Its a good 22 degrees here today; off to the golf course this afternoon – in shorts!

  • Comment 12, posted at 25.07.11 15:04:54 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • Wakaka!!! Stegmanned!!! That needs to go into the dictionary for a new synonym for missing something. But back to the game: Apart from Stegmann (And I haven’t hidden my distaste from him before) the forwards weren’t that bad. Our scrums stood up quite well with two rookie props. Ashley did what was needed and hit the rucks more to try and secure the ball. But in the backs were woefull. Pienaar is in my opinion the person who is to blame the most for this. He gave the Aussies more than enough time to organize their defense while he waved his arms and looked at the ref with puppy-eyes. Steyn is limited (Bulls fault, as a youngster he was a runner, not a kicker) and tried his best. Meisiekind needs a snotklap. De Jongh tried his best with the scraps he got. Basson is so over-rated, yes he can catch a high ball but nothing more than that. Mvovo really tried all night long and can be pleased, same with Aplon.

  • Comment 13, posted at 25.07.11 15:05:16 by KingRiaan Reply

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  • Personally, I think the thing we can take from the game is who should *not* be considered for the World Cup squad. Even though the team featured many new and untried combinations, and hence lacked synergy, some players showed us in no uncertain terms that they belong nowhere near the national team. Stegmann joined the League of Extraordinary Gentlemen – once he dons the green and gold, he disappears. Steyn is as multifaceted as a sheet of paper. Olivier varies his distribution game, but only between non-existent and atrocious. Basson’s composure is of the “rabbit in headlights variety”. The national selectors should take out a restraining order prohibiting these gentlemen from coming within 5 miles of the Bok jersey. The rest of the guys did as well as could be expected and probably deserve another crack at it.

  • Comment 14, posted at 25.07.11 15:59:16 by Culling Song Reply
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  • @Culling Song (Comment 14) : You do have a way with words sir. I agree with all of the above.

  • Comment 15, posted at 25.07.11 16:03:14 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 15) : @Culling Song (Comment 14) : get a room, you two :)

  • Comment 16, posted at 25.07.11 16:05:40 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Culling Song (Comment 14) :

    Me thinks you should’ve written this article!

  • Comment 17, posted at 25.07.11 16:06:08 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 16) : :shock:

  • Comment 18, posted at 25.07.11 16:07:16 by Pokkel Reply
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  • an article about a disjointed bok team ends up being potshots at stegmann next thing will be “keegan should’ve been there” :D

  • Comment 19, posted at 25.07.11 16:46:36 by Megatron Reply

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  • SuperPat has now graced twitter with his presence.

  • Comment 20, posted at 25.07.11 16:52:00 by lostfish Reply
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  • @lostfish (Comment 20) : woohoo :)

  • Comment 21, posted at 25.07.11 17:21:17 by robdylan Reply
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  • @lostfish (Comment 20) :

    I’ve never understood why they do it. It can only end in tears.

  • Comment 22, posted at 25.07.11 17:22:50 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @lostfish (Comment 20) : oh blimey, sharon is there :roll:

  • Comment 23, posted at 25.07.11 17:23:52 by Megatron Reply

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  • Nice one Vinnie. I fully agree: was trying to find time for a similar article myself.
    I would be worried if I were Deans. His best team (bar an ageing Giteau and Barnes) were unable to really impose themselves on a rag-tag bunch of new combinations.

    We certainly suffered with 2 props who got owned, and a 9, 10, 12 axis that didn’t click on either defence or attack, but one must allow that not only have these guys seldom played together, but also this was the first game of their season (while Aus already had the “benefit” of the Samoa humiliation).

    So, I reckon things aren’t that bad despite a less than stellar performance.

  • Comment 24, posted at 25.07.11 18:26:18 by Big Fish Reply
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  • So who is your team for sat?changes I would like to see:6 Brussouw if fit,7 Deysel, 8 Kanko, 10 Lambo,11 mvovo, 12 De Jongh,13 AD,

  • Comment 25, posted at 25.07.11 18:36:36 by catfish Reply
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  • @Megatron (Comment 19) : Not potshots. Just a bit of banter about him Stegmanning in action. :twisted:

  • Comment 26, posted at 25.07.11 19:23:34 by lostfish Reply
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  • Culling Song
    Al Hargreaves?? Or do u think he deserves another shot?

    I find it a bit strange that all the players you mentioned play for the Bulls. Oh wait, this is Sharksworld after all. What was I thinking? :roll:

  • Comment 27, posted at 25.07.11 19:41:27 by wpw Reply
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  • Good arti @vincechainsaw

  • Comment 28, posted at 25.07.11 19:42:03 by bergshark Reply

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  • @wpw:nasty :-D

  • Comment 29, posted at 25.07.11 19:43:11 by bergshark Reply

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  • @lostfish (Comment 20) : I think this is just guy fishing for followers he’s been a member since 4 June.

  • Comment 30, posted at 25.07.11 19:44:45 by Danman110 Reply

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  • @wpw:wait till we start discussing the efforts-or lack thereof-of gio aplon.

  • Comment 31, posted at 25.07.11 19:47:45 by bergshark Reply

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  • @bergshark (Comment 31) :

    careful… :evil:

  • Comment 32, posted at 25.07.11 20:02:08 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @bergshark (Comment 31) : you might not want to pick one of the better players on Saturday.

  • Comment 33, posted at 25.07.11 20:15:54 by lostfish Reply
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  • I’m convinced Lambie at flyhalf, De Jongh (who had a shocker on Saturday) at inside center and Jacobs at outside center (who didn’t do so well either mind you) would have been a much better combo.

    Lambie can kick at poles. He is certianly more reliable than Pienaar (who Steyn orginally replaced) and is not that far behind Steyn.

    As I have said before, it all comes down to what a coach wants. Would you rather want a guy who kicks 6/6 as opposed to 4/6 and has a range of about 10-15m more, or a guy that can create 3 or 4 try scoring opportunities like Cooper and Lambie and thereby remove any need of 100% goal kicker.

  • Comment 34, posted at 25.07.11 20:44:25 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
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  • The Sharks Sharkie
    I don’t necessarily think it boils down to ‘what the coach wants’
    Morne is the incumbent flyhalf and had an exceptional year in 2009 which is why Div has been selecting him as first choice.
    I hope Lambie starts next week though cos Morne has really gone backwards since 2009.

  • Comment 35, posted at 25.07.11 21:01:09 by wpw Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 35) : Everything boils down to “what the coach wants”. He is the boss and therefore what he says goes whether we like it or not! :twisted:

    Morne was exceptional in the kick-and-chase days of 2009 and now is struggling. Lambie made a huge impact on Saturday, he deserves a start but I doubt it will happen.

  • Comment 36, posted at 25.07.11 21:04:20 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
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  • @The Sharks Sharkie (Comment 34) : A couple of little things, first, Steyn is nowhere near a 100% kicker, his kicking percentage is much closer to 80%, which also just happens to be extremely close to what Lambie’s 2011 percentage was. So I seriously doubt Steyn would kick 6 for 6 while Lambie would miss two of the same kicks. Also, watching Lambie this year, his distance has improved dramatically, which he is not credited with, I seriously doubt that Steyn can legitimately kick 10 to 15 metres further.

    I know you are being supportive of Lambie starting, but in my opinion, the only positive attribute that Steyn has that Lambie may be lacking is experience. Lambie’s is streets better with ball in hand and as a distributor, and he may give up a little to Steyn in kicking out of hand, but in all other assets, Lambie is as good or better than Steyn. My opinion.

  • Comment 37, posted at 25.07.11 21:13:14 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @The Sharks Sharkie (Comment 34) : Furthermore, we all know, and it has become so clear over the past 12 months, that Steyn is worthless without FdP at 9. FdP takes a lot of pressure off Steyn, who may even be better than Lambie with FdP. I think that FdP would stifle much of Lambie’s creativity.

  • Comment 38, posted at 25.07.11 21:14:50 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 37) : @Dancing Bear (Comment 38) : I’m with you 100% man!!! I totally agree.

    On Steyn’s kicking, that was an exaggeration. On a previous blog I mentioned the fact that Lambie’s Super 15 kicking stats must just be below Steyn’s, if not on par.

    Then I thought about the fact that Lambie’s distance has improved as well and you touched on that now.

    Lambie is a good kicker (read more consistent than Pienaar) and has a great playmaking ability. Screw experience! Experience is only gained one way, and that is by playing! Look at how Quade Cooper has developed. We have a Cooper flyhalf in Lambie. Cooper is also a young flyhalf who was trusted and played. Lambie in fact I would say is more solid and consistant than Cooper was at 20 and is by far a better goalkicker.

    Lambie is the obvious choice. Play him!

  • Comment 39, posted at 25.07.11 21:26:58 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
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  • I wonder if players like Lambie, Kanko etc would rather be on the bench this weekend. I have this uncomfortable feeling that this Bok Bunch are going to be smashed. If Steyn ( Turnstyle) & Meisiekind are going to face Carter and Williams whos going to stop them Aplon? I saw Stegman once I think and saw that his shorts were dirty and I wondered how did that happen? We have had a huge dumping of snow here in Christchurch and I think Wellington might have had some as well, so its going to be very Bloody cold and I see the Boks are still training in Aus, as the article I read said Mostert had arrived from France and had a light get over jetlag run in Aus, so that is going to be another obstacle for the Boks as they aren’t going to be used to these conditions. Oh well we can just hope and pray and try keep our head high with these Kiwis gloating at our misfortune.

  • Comment 40, posted at 25.07.11 21:27:15 by Dynamite Reply

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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 38) : FdP is another Bok past his prime. The media loves him and puts a blanket around him and Matfield will firing at Smit, yet FdP is another player whom I think should warm the wood at the World Cup. I know I will be shot down for that comment but FdP is a media-loved player. People don’t WANT to see that he is past his prime coz he has always been one of those players the media have adored. Smit on the otherhand was never liked by the media and one mistake on the field and he will be told to f**k off and retire.

  • Comment 41, posted at 25.07.11 21:31:29 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
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  • @Dynamite (Comment 40) : If it is raining and cold than Kanko must warm the wood but I still think Lambie can play to the conditions. Morne Steyn’s kicking in field isn’t as good as you think either. Lambie’s general kicking is just as good and he is just a point or two beind Steyn in the goal kicking department.

    Let’s face reality though. Steyn and Oliver will start of Saturday.

  • Comment 42, posted at 25.07.11 21:34:19 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
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  • @The Sharks Sharkie (Comment 41) : I’m with you 100% there. Not sure why the media dislike for Smit, and the love affair with the likes of Victor, Bakkies and FdP. Right now, I personally think Danie would make a better 4 lock for the Boks than Bakkies. Both have gotten older, but Danie does not seem to have lost a step, and he always works so hard around the pitch.

    Just one other thing to add, I think Lambie is already more composed and solid (consistent) than Cooper is now. Cooper has that certain flair, but he is still terribly inconsistent. I have seen some real shockers from him, and his kicking at posts or out of hand is not on the level of Lambie.

  • Comment 43, posted at 25.07.11 21:37:11 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • Of real concern is how the South African teams have reversed when it come to scrumming. Maybe they need some help from the Argies. During the Super 15 all the SA teams struggled come scrum time. I still do think that they have tinkered too much with the scrum laws so that most scrums are a lottery when you are relying on refs who’s knowledge of scrums is weak at the best of times, but I don’t see the passion or fire that I see in the Franks Bru’s eyes come scrum time in any of the Saffa props???? :shock:

  • Comment 44, posted at 25.07.11 21:39:38 by Dynamite Reply

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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 43) : Yes Lambie is better rounded than Cooper is!

    Cooper does beat Lambie hands-down on flashes of brillaince like side-stepping or dummying but he is by far closer to the complete product.

    Lambie rarely has a “bad day”, he kicks better than Cooper (at poles and in general), he dictates play well (which Cooper does to), he has some X-factor (Cooper maybe pipes him here), he has a very cool head on young shoulders (Cooper does too mind you), he isn’t injury prone (like James), isn’t afraid to attack the line and carry the ball up (like James) and certianly defends his channel very well (like James, unlike Cooper).

    I’m not saying Lambie is the complete article yet. Carter certianly could teach him a trick or two but he IMHO is a better flyhalf than Cooper, Steyn and James.

  • Comment 45, posted at 25.07.11 21:44:36 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
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  • My friend sent an email that his friend put together which showed that the Boks were an aggregate of 36 years older than their Aussie opponents with only 3 Aussies being the older guy when comparing individual players position by position. He added something about experience. I don’t remember.

    Just thought I’d share that useless bit of information with you.

  • Comment 46, posted at 25.07.11 21:46:04 by beet Reply
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  • FDP is one of the best players to ever wear the Boks jersey. I think he is still 27/8 and in his prime.
    When he is on form there isn’t a scrumhalf that comes close to him – not even Genia.

  • Comment 47, posted at 25.07.11 21:47:21 by wpw Reply
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  • @The Sharks Sharkie (Comment 45) : That’s a well-constructed argument there. Well done!

  • Comment 48, posted at 25.07.11 21:48:06 by beet Reply
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  • @beet (Comment 46) : Experience counts, but it isn’t that deciding factor. Look at the Wannabies lost year, they were a good inexperienced team. Now they are “of age” and look at them. Their real test though will be against the All Blacks.

  • Comment 49, posted at 25.07.11 21:51:25 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 10) : u got it, happy IT’S SNOWING in newcastle :)

  • Comment 50, posted at 25.07.11 21:56:10 by Franshark Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 47) : Thank you for proving my point about the FdP being a media loved player!

    Don’t get me wrong, he was a great player and will always be a Bok legend, like Smit and Matfield and Botha and De Villiers and Habana, etc.

    But what match evidence has FdP given you to show that he has regained his form?? The last Super 15 match he played he came on and kicked the ball directly into touch at a crucial point when the Bulls were trying to mount a comeback (against the Sharks).

    Smit has done little to regain any form and people shoot him down (and rightfully so). FdP has done the exact same thing and yet people still say he must play, why? If FdP must play then so must Smit (using that logic).

    Genia is the now, FdP is the then. Time to move on.

  • Comment 51, posted at 25.07.11 21:56:28 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
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  • @beet (Comment 48) : I try. :smile:

  • Comment 52, posted at 25.07.11 21:57:27 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 47) : but that’s just the thing “is he on form… Hope he is going to be…

  • Comment 53, posted at 25.07.11 22:12:12 by Franshark Reply
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  • @The Sharks Sharkie (Comment 42) : I wasn’t trying to say Steyn is better than Lambie, what I thought was would he want to be in the run on team knowing there is a good chance of getting thrashed, as this can’t be that good for the confidence. Also this will give amunition to the idiots who will then say ” see Lambie played and they were beaten”. So I for one would probably not like him to play until such stage as they have a settled team.

  • Comment 54, posted at 26.07.11 00:56:49 by Dynamite Reply

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  • Now that Flip vd Merwe is out and on his way back to SA, the sky might actually start falling down. :(

  • Comment 55, posted at 26.07.11 07:55:04 by KSA Shark © Reply

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  • @Franshark (Comment 53) :

    Not at the moment. He is injured!! :twisted: :lol:

  • Comment 56, posted at 26.07.11 08:10:16 by wpw Reply
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  • Morning guys – could anyone please help me. Who is the best guy currently in SA (even Bok Players) that’s best under a highball – and best under the higball with the least errors?

    Will appreciate!!!

  • Comment 57, posted at 26.07.11 08:12:12 by Ice Reply
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  • @The Sharks Sharkie (Comment 51) :

    How did I prove your point??

    To compare FDP with John Smit is just ridiculous.

    John is not even first choice hooker at his own franchise whereas FDP IS Bok incumbent and first choice at the Bulls.

    Consider this, whenever FDP plays the Bulls or Boks win trophies.

    2004 – Boks win TN’s
    2007 – Bulls SR Champs, Boks RWC Champs
    2009 – Bulls SR Champs, Boks beat B&I Lions, Boks win TN’s
    2010 – Bulls SR Champs. Gets injured soon thereafter, Boks struggle
    2011 – FDP returns from injury and struggles with his form for a few games before getting injured AGAIN!! Bulls struggle!

  • Comment 58, posted at 26.07.11 08:19:15 by wpw Reply
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  • @Ice (Comment 57) :

    Zane Kirchner!! :twisted:

  • Comment 59, posted at 26.07.11 08:20:40 by wpw Reply
    Author
    wpwAssistant coach
     
  • I agree with the heading of the article but not with all that was said. Firstly there were new combinations everywhere from the front row to the back 3 so a disjointed performance was expected. What was not expected was a below par defensive performance. Defending in 1 on 1 situations and at ruck time is all about the individual and not the team structure. So those that did not stand up in those areas cannot be forgiven- this is international rugby not club stuff! Secondly i think the team was selected without any thought on how we would win. He selected Steyn,Basson and Mvovo…so why kick deep then? Kick so that Basson and Mvovo have a slight chance of regaining the ball. He picked Johnson and Olivier…so once Johnson bashed it up the ball went to the backs and Olivier bashed it up again and we got turned over as the loosies were still in previous ruck. These are simple basic mistakes that top international teams should not be making! Yes the first blame should be with the players, but the coaching staff should also not be forgotten! Its not the result but rather the manner of play that has most supporters upset.

  • Comment 60, posted at 26.07.11 08:34:31 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • Wow okay.

    Let me just say this.

    If we lose FDP for this year’s World Cup, there is no hope in hell we win this thing.

    Losing FDP for the Boks is NZ losing Carter.

  • Comment 61, posted at 26.07.11 10:10:34 by Morné Reply
    Author
    MornéTeam captain
     
  • @Morné (Comment 61) : Ah, a voice of reason. :smile:

  • Comment 62, posted at 26.07.11 10:12:25 by diablo Reply

    diabloVodacom Cup player
     
  • @Morné (Comment 61) :
    @diablo (Comment 62) :
    The site name says it all.

    FdP is the world’s best scrumhalf. I don’t know how to engage those who think he is crap.

  • Comment 63, posted at 26.07.11 10:37:09 by Big Fish Reply
    Author
    Big FishAssistant coach
     
  • @Big Fish (Comment 63) :

    + 1

  • Comment 64, posted at 26.07.11 10:52:52 by wpw Reply
    Author
    wpwAssistant coach
     
  • @Big Fish (Comment 63) : +2

  • Comment 65, posted at 26.07.11 11:12:53 by Just a Fan Reply

    Just a FanCurrie Cup player
     
  • Has anyone mentioned that Stegmann should be replaced by Keegan? :evil:

  • Comment 66, posted at 26.07.11 11:20:18 by vanmartin Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    vanmartinAssistant coach
     
  • @Morné (Comment 61) : @diablo (Comment 62) : @Big Fish (Comment 63) :

    I agree he’s the world’s premier scrumhalf.

    My concern is his lack of game-time due to injury over the last couple of seasons. I havent yet seen the player who can play so little and simply slot back in at and play well.

  • Comment 67, posted at 26.07.11 11:42:00 by VinChainSaw Reply
    Author
    VinChainSawTeam captain
     
  • @wpw (Comment 27) : I mentioned on another thread that I did not feel that Ali H had a good game, and probably dented his Bok aspirations. He’s a Shark though, and hence gets the benefit of the doubt :lol: As for the anti-Bulls slant, I freely admit to a massive dislike of the boys from Pretoria. Having said that, I’m not calling for the props’ heads, even though the Aussies owned them, nor am I afraid to admit that Danie Rossouw was the pick of the forwards. So I actually resisted my natural impulses! :shock:

  • Comment 68, posted at 26.07.11 17:37:59 by Culling Song Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    Culling SongTeam captain
     
  • @Culling Song (Comment 68) : scrums aside, Greyling had a bloody good game.

    Kruger, I thought, was as close to useless as it’s possible to be.

  • Comment 69, posted at 26.07.11 18:15:08 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 69) : One prop had a good game, the other not, but at the end of the day both have only had one game for the Boks. The situation could just as easily reverse this weekend; it’s still too early to judge.

    That’s neither here nor there though; the point was that I was trying to defend my honour after Wes accused me of being vehemently anti-Bulls in selecting which players to criticise, when anyone with half a brain cell could see that my feelings towards the Bulls only contributed 50 to 60 percent (ok, 70 tops, 80 at a stretch) towards the decision. :mrgreen:

  • Comment 70, posted at 26.07.11 19:31:55 by Culling Song Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    Culling SongTeam captain
     
  • Nice arti Vin. :razz:

  • Comment 71, posted at 26.07.11 20:10:35 by SharonvanWyk Reply
    Author
    ShazCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Megatron (Comment 23) : Darling, I don’t converse with fakes, only the real deal! :cool:

  • Comment 72, posted at 26.07.11 20:12:28 by SharonvanWyk Reply
    Author
    ShazCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Dynamite (Comment 54) : On the other hand though Lambie could have a great game, be the difference between victory and defeat, render forward dominance completely useless and secure the No10 jersey for World Cup.

    Think what you like but I don’t agree with your logic. Not playing a good player just coz you are scared the team might perform badly is dumb (IMO). Lambie would gain valuable experience from playing against the world’s best side. It will grow him as a player. Lambie hasn’t shied away from any challenge presented to him yet, why would this scenario be any different???

  • Comment 73, posted at 26.07.11 20:13:07 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
    Author
    The Sharks SharkieVodacom Cup player
     
  • @The Sharks Sharkie (Comment 73) : Yay! Sharkie you’re my hero! :mrgreen:

  • Comment 74, posted at 26.07.11 20:17:51 by SharonvanWyk Reply
    Author
    ShazCurrie Cup player
     
  • @wpw (Comment 58) : Smit was there for all the Bok games as well, and we all know that the Sharks probabaly should have won the Super 14 final in 2007 which would have seen Smit be the winner there as well.

    Maybe FdP is better than Smit. Maybe Smit really is kak and FdP is what we need. But maybe Smit adds more value than FdP. Maybe Smit is what we need and FdP needs to be dropped.

    Again the later part of my statement will get some people fuming and telling me I know nothing about rugga. The simple case is people, media included, just don’t critise FdP. If he played poorly then it is injury or a “bad day”. Smit plays badly its coz he is kak.

    It’s media indoctrination that too many fall for, I did too. I’m not saying I don’t agree (with the media) but I am wary and it always surprises me how Smit is written off but FdP can’t set a foot wrong.

  • Comment 75, posted at 26.07.11 20:17:55 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
    Author
    The Sharks SharkieVodacom Cup player
     
  • @wpw (Comment 58) : And you proved my point about people wrapping FdP up and kaking on Smit.

  • Comment 76, posted at 26.07.11 20:19:20 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
    Author
    The Sharks SharkieVodacom Cup player
     
  • @The Sharks Sharkie (Comment 75) : Yay! Sharkie you’re my hero!!!!!! :mrgreen:

  • Comment 77, posted at 26.07.11 20:20:19 by SharonvanWyk Reply
    Author
    ShazCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Big Fish (Comment 63) : @wpw (Comment 64) : @Just a Fan (Comment 65) : Yeah so he is the world’s best scrumhalf who has lost his form. Every player’s glory days come to an end, simple fact.

    Show me how FdP, on form, has justified any Bok selection? I agree with anyone who says that experience wins trophies but it isn’t the sole factor. Form comes into play too, as does the tactics to some extent.

  • Comment 78, posted at 26.07.11 20:22:46 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
    Author
    The Sharks SharkieVodacom Cup player
     
  • @SharonvanWyk (Comment 77) : I got it the first time. :grin: :cool:

  • Comment 79, posted at 26.07.11 20:23:40 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
    Author
    The Sharks SharkieVodacom Cup player
     
  • @Culling Song (Comment 68) : I’m not baised when I make statements. For me the Bok team must be the best players, whether they are from the Sharks, Bulls, Stormers, whereever, it doesn’t matter!!

    I believe Lambie is the best option (at flyhalf) right now and I think that FdP is being wrapped in a blanket.

  • Comment 80, posted at 26.07.11 20:26:05 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
    Author
    The Sharks SharkieVodacom Cup player
     
  • @The Sharks Sharkie (Comment 79) : Yeah – but for BOTH comments! haha!

  • Comment 81, posted at 26.07.11 20:37:58 by SharonvanWyk Reply
    Author
    ShazCurrie Cup player
     
  • @The Sharks Sharkie (Comment 78) : I enjoy reading your opinions.

    With regards to FdP, I think it’s safe to say that we all hope he will produce the form that earned him the reputation; during this RWC. Time will tell! But I fear time is going to prove you right. Many of the kingpin players of other teams look like they’ll be starting the RWC with recent form to back up the statements made about their importance to team success (eg Carter and Genia), however I don’t think FdP will fall into that category come September. :sad:

  • Comment 82, posted at 26.07.11 21:10:22 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @The Sharks Sharkie (Comment 78) :
    So is FdP out of form or is he past it? They are not the same thing. Irrespective of which you choose, one can just point out that he hasn’t had enough game time to show either a lack of form or ability – just a lack of game time.

    At the end of the day his record speaks for itself – just like Smit’s does.

  • Comment 83, posted at 26.07.11 21:37:57 by Big Fish Reply
    Author
    Big FishAssistant coach
     
  • Hi all I am a newbie here and glad to be in the internet shark cage. Okay I been wanting to blog about this topic…firstly where did Aplon have a good game? He with butter fingers let two tries go begging and missed quite a few tackles and let a try through? Puzzled ??? At least meisiekind won’t make the cut as for his kamakazi passes especially the one on lambie … Okie dokie just adding my two cents worth

  • Comment 84, posted at 26.07.11 22:05:20 by AlterEgo Reply

    AlterEgoUnder 19 player
     
  • @AlterEgo (Comment 84) : u speak like a oldie :)

  • Comment 85, posted at 26.07.11 22:43:45 by Franshark Reply
    Author
    FransharkTeam captain
     
  • Cheers buddy …was a facebook freak hehehehe :)

  • Comment 86, posted at 26.07.11 22:52:28 by AlterEgo Reply

    AlterEgoUnder 19 player
     
  • @AlterEgo (Comment 84) : Bear in mind this article was written by a die hard Stormer fan. Just saying…..

  • Comment 87, posted at 26.07.11 23:04:34 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 87) : Just kidding btw. I know Vinnie didn’t say Gio had a good game.

  • Comment 88, posted at 26.07.11 23:20:20 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • Yeah…I do not rate him as his defensive capabilities are very obscure …the writing was on the wall when the crusaders esposed his weakness…in attack yes but when gio is placed under pressure he fumbles like lomo…we have to have a fullback that can tackle,kick like a tornado and join the line when needed . As small as Lambie is he fits a better criteria and I honestly think he has more vision than both frans and gio

  • Comment 89, posted at 26.07.11 23:52:55 by AlterEgo Reply

    AlterEgoUnder 19 player
     
  • Sorry exposed… I would try lambie at 15

  • Comment 90, posted at 26.07.11 23:56:39 by AlterEgo Reply

    AlterEgoUnder 19 player
     
  • @Big Fish (Comment 83) : FdP may be out of form, or past it, or niether. No one knows. I don’t know, you don’t know, the player himself probably doesn’t know. I am hoping though that it is just his form.

  • Comment 91, posted at 27.07.11 18:11:20 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
    Author
    The Sharks SharkieVodacom Cup player
     
  • It was announced all referees have been trained in the Heimlich Maneuver. Just in case the host nation chokes. :twisted:

  • Comment 92, posted at 28.07.11 08:42:22 by lostfish Reply
    Valued Sharksworld Supporter Competition Winner
    lostfishSuper Rugby player
     

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