Clayton(PJLD)

Bash back for the Stormers


Written by Clayton Saville (Clayton(PJLD))

Posted in :Original Content, Stormers, Super Rugby on 9 Nov 2011 at 23:22
Tagged with : , , , , ,

In news that will certainly put a smile on the faces of Stormers fans everywhere Peter Grant, the saviour of WP , The Stormers Stormer and general person of interest has signed a new contract for the Cape franchise and will be available at the end of the Japanese season.

Grants return to Cape Town was considered a formality until he tweeted a few weeks ago that he was in fact out of contract with the Stormers and not seen any paperwork, the rumour mill started grinding out a few stories with the lead being that the EP Kings were willing to make Grant a rich man if he put pen to paper for them.

As it turns out Bash knows full well that a Stormers ding is in fact a lekka lekka Stormers ding and now that he is back the Stormers fans kannie warrie nie because they are going to win.

Bash’s signature also bolsters the Stormers flyhalf stocks, as it turns out the more flyhalfs available to the Cape team the better because the chances are high they will get to use all of them. Grants appreciation of the gain line will be a huge asset as almost all of the pivots used saved for van Aswegen were fond of sitting deep in the pocket. As good as Catrakilis has been one almost expects Liefling to blast out of the Newlands PA system.

In the past week WP/Stormers have announced the signatures of Joe Pieterson, Deon Carstens and now Peter Grant and it will be interesting to see if any other names are added to the list.



188 Comments

  • You sound excited..?

  • Comment 1, posted at 09.11.11 23:41:58 by bergshark Reply
    bergsharkSuper Rugby player
     
  • Sharks have actually only confirmed one new signing in tim whitehead.wonder if there will be any more? ..perhaps one or two in the coachibg dept?

  • Comment 2, posted at 09.11.11 23:43:28 by bergshark Reply
    bergsharkSuper Rugby player
     
  • Coaching

  • Comment 3, posted at 09.11.11 23:44:01 by bergshark Reply
    bergsharkSuper Rugby player
     
  • Was trying to be a bit funny but it didnt work

  • Comment 4, posted at 10.11.11 02:10:18 by Clayton(PJLD) Reply
    Administrator
    Clayton(PJLD)Team captain
     
  • Not at all impressed with this signing.

    Grant plays basic error-free rugby, but the myth that he attacks the gain line is holding us back. If not for Morne Steyn, he’d be our worst at that.

    Also don’t think they should be getting into the mode of allowing players to have the best of both by playing in Japan & SA. He needs to make up his mind as to what he wants to do. Not training with the team and not being available for the first few rounds isn’t good enough.

    Hopefully Gary van Aswegen plays so well in the first few rounds – and stays fit, that when Peter eventually returns they stick him on the bench.

  • Comment 5, posted at 10.11.11 03:26:25 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 5) : Grant was in splendid form in this year’s S15. So much that some people here were calling for him to be the 1st choice 10 for the WC.

  • Comment 6, posted at 10.11.11 06:34:56 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 6) : And then he went and got injured..

  • Comment 7, posted at 10.11.11 06:36:06 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • Claytie
    I quite enjoyed reading this – vrek snaaks! :D

  • Comment 8, posted at 10.11.11 07:35:25 by wpw Reply
    Author
    wpwAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 5) : I think you’re being a bit harsh on Grant there. :mrgreen:

  • Comment 9, posted at 10.11.11 08:00:05 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Clayton(PJLD) (Comment 4) : I also enjoyed reading the piece, good stuff

  • Comment 10, posted at 10.11.11 08:06:51 by Franshark Reply
    Author
    FransharkTeam captain
     
  • @bergshark (Comment 2) : and Riaan Viljoen

  • Comment 11, posted at 10.11.11 08:36:24 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • Whether WP fans want to admit it or not, the only guy to get their backline going is Grant! And as history showed, look what happens to the Boks when they go to the RWC and dont play a flyhalf that went to school in KZN!!

  • Comment 12, posted at 10.11.11 08:38:17 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • Grant is not a bad 10 for Super rugby, but he also last year struggled to get his highly rated backline away, or maybe its the coaching

  • Comment 13, posted at 10.11.11 08:38:42 by Mutley Reply
    Author
    MutleyTeam captain
     
  • @wpw (Comment 8) : so did I!

  • Comment 14, posted at 10.11.11 08:59:17 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • @Mutley (Comment 13) : I personally think it was more a case of the backline ‘stars’ playing as individuals and not as a unit rather than a case of the flyhalf not getting the backline going.

  • Comment 15, posted at 10.11.11 09:24:39 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @beet (Comment 9) : I think you’re being a bit harsh on Hendrikp here; being a fan of rugby is an emotional thing, and we all have players we like and dislike. Sometimes it’s rational and makes complete sense (e.g. – I like: Henry Honiball and dislike: any Australian), some you can sort of understand the logic (e.g. Hendrikp likes: Schalk Burger and dislikes: Peter Grant), and some that are just whoaw-I-just-ate-a-whole-blotter-of-lab-quality-acid out there (e.g. Beet likes: Johan Roets). Just saying. :mrgreen:

  • Comment 16, posted at 10.11.11 09:38:23 by Culling Song Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    Culling SongTeam captain
     
  • @Culling Song (Comment 16) : He’s NEVER going to forget that if u are around! :mrgreen:

    And rightfully so! :twisted:

  • Comment 17, posted at 10.11.11 09:40:58 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • @Ice (Comment 17) : What goes around, comes around; it’s karma catching up to Beet… ;-)

  • Comment 18, posted at 10.11.11 09:42:14 by Culling Song Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    Culling SongTeam captain
     
  • @Culling Song (Comment 16) : :lol:

  • Comment 19, posted at 10.11.11 09:42:55 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @wpw (Comment 8) : @Franshark (Comment 10) : You guys :oops:

  • Comment 20, posted at 10.11.11 09:47:56 by Clayton(PJLD) Reply
    Administrator
    Clayton(PJLD)Team captain
     
  • @Culling Song (Comment 16) : Sometimes you make my day ekse

  • Comment 21, posted at 10.11.11 09:53:04 by Clayton(PJLD) Reply
    Administrator
    Clayton(PJLD)Team captain
     
  • @Clayton(PJLD) (Comment 21) : You guy :oops:

  • Comment 22, posted at 10.11.11 10:20:12 by Culling Song Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    Culling SongTeam captain
     
  • @Culling Song (Comment 22) : @Clayton(PJLD) (Comment 21) : @Clayton(PJLD) (Comment 20) : What the HELL is going on here?? Should’ve known…blerrie WP supporter involved again…

  • Comment 23, posted at 10.11.11 10:24:29 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • @Culling Song (Comment 16) :
    I can’t dispite what you’re saying – we fans are emotional guys but we have differing degrees of emotion. We all have our favourites and dislikes on the field, so I’d be the last guy around trying to deny him his right to have an opinion. I will however from time to time try my best to influence it. :smile:

    One of the things I like about Hendrik is that he isn’t to proud to have a change of heart about a player and admit it.

    I don’t see the Johan Roets thing as a jab at all. Too me Roets was one of the unluckiest players of the modern era. He showed splendid form during a period of Bulls domination and deserved to be a Bok. I’m sad for people who think otherwise :mrgreen:

    Karma did come around at the Bulls tho. When Roetsie retired, karma realised that they had been robbed by Jake not capping their quality fullback, so his replacement, a mediocre at best FB from the Griquas was handed multiple Bok caps to make up for it. :mrgreen:

  • Comment 24, posted at 10.11.11 10:44:17 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 24) : “…so his replacement, a mediocre at best FB from the Griquas was handed multiple Bok caps to make up for it.”

    Now *that* is a statement you and I can agree on 100%!

  • Comment 25, posted at 10.11.11 11:13:04 by Culling Song Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    Culling SongTeam captain
     
  • @Culling Song (Comment 25) : LOVE IT

  • Comment 26, posted at 10.11.11 11:19:47 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • I’d prefer Province did a loan deal for Sias Ebersohn. Free State could use the money.

    I actually really like Peter Grant. Spoke to him in Dunedin a few years ago after that test we won through Ricky Januarie’s late try. Genuine good guy, I just don’t believe he’s the one to take us forward.

    I actually wish they’d never moved Peter Grant from 12. Even if he had to go elsewhere to play there, it was easily his best position. His tactical kicking alone makes me cringe.

    Again, stats don’t say it all, but can sometimes give some insight:

    Morne Steyn:
    Minutes Played – 1255
    Runs – 37
    Tackles Bust – 8
    Offloads – 5
    Linebreaks – 2
    Linebreaks create – 8
    Tackles made – 185
    Tackles missed – 31

    Sias Ebersohn
    Minutes played – 991
    Runs – 28
    Tackles bust – 20
    Offloads – 3
    Linebreaks – 8
    Linebreaks create – 3
    Tackles made – 101
    Tackles missed – 37

    Elton Jantjies
    Minutes played – 745
    Runs – 57
    Tackles bust – 19
    Offloads – 10
    Linebreaks – 5
    Linebreaks create – 8
    Tackles – 62
    Tackles missed – 24

    Patrick Lambie
    Minutes played – 1106 (some not at flyhalf, but majority was)
    Runs – 53
    Tackles bust – 17
    Offloads – 4
    Linebreaks – 5
    Linebreaks create – 3
    Tackles – 133
    Tackles missed – 16

    Peter Grant
    Minutes played – 738
    Runs – 35
    Tackles Bust – 6
    Offloads – 1
    Linebreaks – 2
    Linebreaks create – 1
    Tackles made – 94
    Tackles missed – 22

    As for not liking certain players. The one guy I can’t stand is Ali Williams. Just wanna wipe that smug look of his face. W.a.n.k.e.r. that guy.

  • Comment 27, posted at 10.11.11 11:29:09 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • Ooh, and while I reckon beet knows what he’s talking about pretty much 100% of the time… Johan Roets was about as one dimensional a fullback as you could find IMO.

    Those Bulls players who gave Francois Steyn a hard time, telling him that he shouldn’t be in the Bok squad ahead of Roets (their buddy) should be ashamed of themselves.

  • Comment 28, posted at 10.11.11 11:30:53 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • Stick with Van Aswegen

  • Comment 29, posted at 10.11.11 11:37:28 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 29) :

    Well that would be option number 1, but he’s injured 80% of the time.

    If he can’t go a few games without an injury, it might be time to let him go. Would be a poor investment.

  • Comment 30, posted at 10.11.11 11:39:09 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 27) : Jeez bro i get that with Duane V and Gio Aplon ,i know what you are talking about.Also Ashton

  • Comment 31, posted at 10.11.11 11:40:21 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 30) : or just play jdv at 10 and JDJ at 12 ,then let Joe kick but that would really be clutching at straws

  • Comment 32, posted at 10.11.11 11:41:38 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 32) :

    That would be a heck no.

    I was just complaining at Peter Grant’s tactical kicking, but at least he can kick!

  • Comment 33, posted at 10.11.11 11:43:08 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 27) : Yeah Grant rocked at 12

  • Comment 34, posted at 10.11.11 11:46:17 by Clayton(PJLD) Reply
    Administrator
    Clayton(PJLD)Team captain
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 33) :well for our imagination sake it would be interesting . GVA is who I would select at 10 ,PG can cover 10/12

  • Comment 35, posted at 10.11.11 11:48:19 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 35) :

    Might even find Joe Pietersen covering the bench spot when Jaque Fourie & Peter Grant eventually return.

    Luckily I don’t see the Stormers carrying on with this charade forever. This will probably be Grant’s last season in Stormers colours, unless he returns on a permanent basis of course.

  • Comment 36, posted at 10.11.11 11:50:50 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 33) : Jdv at fh is probably not the best example but in SA we are to dogmatic about player flexibility ,Frances use of two scrumhalves was innovative and out the box thinking at its best.

  • Comment 37, posted at 10.11.11 11:53:36 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 37) : or should i say out the boks :roll:

  • Comment 38, posted at 10.11.11 11:55:09 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 36) : What are their contractual agreements re playing in Japan ,do the Stormers pay them or not ?From a team dynamic point of view it cant be good

  • Comment 39, posted at 10.11.11 11:58:11 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 37) :

    Didn’t exactly work for them though. Parra did alright, but Trinh-duc was far better when he eventually came on.

    France were in the position of having Yachvili doing 90% of their kicking.

  • Comment 40, posted at 10.11.11 12:00:17 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 40) : Well the game plan changed when he came on ,but I enjoyed the way they played .For the way they needed to play Trinh-duc was a better option

  • Comment 41, posted at 10.11.11 12:04:30 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 39) :

    Their contracts only start when they eventually return, which will be at the completion of the Japanese season (not when their team gets eliminated, which was what happened in the past).

    I’m also of the opinion that if the player wasn’t available for off-season training because he was playing elsewhere, then he shouldn’t be brought in.

    But then again it’s not my job at stake. :mrgreen:

  • Comment 42, posted at 10.11.11 12:05:08 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 36) :

    Seriously, I respect your opinion but I don’t think Van Aswegan is ready to be first choice flyhalf for us and I wouldn’t rely on Sias Ebersohn either.

    Grant will do just fine imo. He is not a world beater but he does the basics well and has been a very good player for us over the years.

    My only gripe with him is that he doesn;t seem to have the ability to outplay his opposing 10 in NB matches like 2010 CC and S14 finals. :roll:

  • Comment 43, posted at 10.11.11 12:10:40 by wpw Reply
    Author
    wpwAssistant coach
     
  • @wpw (Comment 43) :

    No BMT perhaps?

    Let me put it another way. I don’t think he’s the right fit for this Stormers team. Challenges the line often enough, but isn’t good enough when he does.

    I’m not going to complain about him if he has good performances though! He can easily change my mind by putting players into space. Much of the blame for Habana’s supposed poor form should fall on his shoulder IMO. Used to get 1-on-1 situations. Now it’s more like 1-on-3.

  • Comment 44, posted at 10.11.11 12:20:00 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @wpw (Comment 43) : does the basics well pfff you been staring at the mountain to long hahaha

    @hendrikp (Comment 42) : I agree but maybe it cuts costs or something

  • Comment 45, posted at 10.11.11 12:46:52 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 45) :

    Nothing to do with cutting costs.

    Also, wpw is spot on, Grant does the basics pretty well.

    It’s making an impact against top teams, where he needs that little bit extra that he struggles. In general he plays mistake-free rugby.

  • Comment 46, posted at 10.11.11 13:02:39 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 45) : @hendrikp (Comment 46) :

    In other words he doens’t make things happen the way Jantjies or Lambie does (note I didn’t mention the overhyped Johan Goosen) :mrgreen:

    hendrikp

    No BMT is spot on!!

  • Comment 47, posted at 10.11.11 13:06:00 by wpw Reply
    Author
    wpwAssistant coach
     
  • @wpw (Comment 47) :

    overhyped my arse!

    You’ll be eating humble pie in a few months :lol:

  • Comment 48, posted at 10.11.11 13:10:33 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • Great news for WP.
    With the return of Bash and Joe our attack is looking better than ever.
    And with the signing of Carstens our scrum looks to finally have some semblance of stability.
    Go Stormers!

  • Comment 49, posted at 10.11.11 13:49:38 by Leviathan Reply

    Under 21 player
     
  • @wpw (Comment 47) :

    well lets see .. maybe he makes it .. maybe he doesnt .. lets give him a season of super rugby .

    who do you think the Cheetahs will start with @ 10 . Goosen above Sias ? wont that be a bit risky ?

  • Comment 50, posted at 10.11.11 13:51:40 by Zibbie Reply
    Friend of SharksworldCompetition Winner
    ZibbieTeam captain
     
  • @wpw (Comment 47) : His basics are poor for one thing he cant kick out of his 22 when he is on his goal line ,basics like passing ?and catching the ball? ya he can do those…

  • Comment 51, posted at 10.11.11 14:18:19 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @bergshark (Comment 2) : Forget it, our management thinks we have the best coaching staff.

  • Comment 52, posted at 10.11.11 20:42:50 by GreatSharksays Reply

    Assistant coach
     
  • @GreatSharksays: it does seem like it

  • Comment 53, posted at 10.11.11 21:44:30 by bergshark Reply

    bergsharkSuper Rugby player
     
  • Anyway, bit of a ‘questionnaire’ for anyone interested.

    Assuming the following players are sure things to make the Bok squad (I’m sure not all are, but the point is to see whom else is favored by bloggers):

    Props: Jannie du Plessis & Coenie Oosthuizen
    Hookers: Bismarck du Plessis & Chiliboy Ralepelle
    Locks: Andries Bekker & Juandre Kruger
    Loose-Forwards: Heinrich Brussow, Schalk Burger, Juan Smith & Willem Alberts
    Scrumhalves: Francois Hougaard & Ruan Pienaar
    Flyhalves: Patrick Lambie
    Centres: Francois Steyn, Jaque Fourie, Juan de Jongh, Johann Sadie
    Wingers: JP Pietersen
    Fullback: Gio Aplon

    Now name the players you would select to fill up the roster (26-man) from the following…

    - Pick 1 of Gurthro Steenkamp & Beast Mtawarira.
    - Pick 1 of CJ van der Linde & WP Nel.
    - Pick 1 of Flip van der Merwe & Rynhardt Elstadt.
    - Pick 1 of Nick Koster, Duane Vermeulen & Ashley Johnson.
    - Pick 1 of Johan Goosen & Elton Jantjes.
    - Pick 2 of Jean de Villiers, Francois Venter, Bryan Habana & Jaco Taute.

  • Comment 54, posted at 11.11.11 01:08:17 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 54) : You reckon Coenie is a sure thing for the Bok squad? :lol:

  • Comment 55, posted at 11.11.11 02:33:18 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 54) : Let’s wait and see how Koster does in the S15 and if he actually comes through it uninjured before you go and throw him in front of Kanko in the pecking order.

  • Comment 56, posted at 11.11.11 02:51:36 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 55) :

    Yes I think Coenie will, or should be there, but the point was not to select sure things. It was to see who you would pick if you had to between Gurthro & Beast. Personally I’d go with Gurthro, but that would be tough for a Sharks supporter I realize.

    @Ben (Comment 56) :

    Again not the point… but anyway I think Kankowski has shown himself to not be quite up to test rugby. Just saying.

    My picks would be, at this stage, before the S15 starts:
    Gurthro Steenkamp, CJ van der Linde, Flip van der Merwe, Nick Koster, Johan Goosen (though I’d leave him to play in Junior World Champs and give Elton a go), Jean de Villiers & Bryan Habana.

  • Comment 57, posted at 11.11.11 03:22:07 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 57) : Okay here is my picks. BTW I’m guessing its hard for a Province supporter not to pick Koster.

    Beast
    CJ
    Flip
    Johnson
    Jantjies
    De Villiers
    Habana

  • Comment 58, posted at 11.11.11 03:34:36 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 58) :

    Here’s my argument against where you differ.

    Beast – Gurthro is probably the best loosehead in world rugby at the moment. He’s just hit his peak. I’d include him as a sure thing if he weren’t overseas, but would still pick him now. The reason I wouldn’t include both is that one would have to be outside the 22 at all times. It gives you very little to work with. Coenie can be on the bench or start, plus he’s like an extra loose-forward and a half when he comes on. Gurthro & Beast can only start.

    Johnson – Much as I like Johnson, his best position is on the blindside. His control off the back of the scrum is poor. Koster gives you another option as a pure out-and-out number eight. I don’t include Kankowski because he brings the very same things that we criticize Pierre Spies for. Too much open field running. Can’t put his head down. To his credit he links with the backs much better then Spies, but I believe Koster will convince you by also being strong in the tackle. Duane Vermeulen could probably do that role, but I see him more as a blindside.

    Jantjies – People say Goosen hasn’t proven himself at Super rugby level, but neither has Elton. He was terrible for 95% of the Super rugby season.

    People concerned about whether Goosen will have the temperament. I heard it best the other week. Something along the lines of him being naughty enough at school for people not to have to worry about him ‘thinking too much’.

    Here’s a guy who got up at 5am, while the rest of his roommates were fast asleep, to go out onto the field and practice his goalkicking. Don’t know about you, but I couldn’t do that in a million years, especially not with how cold it is in Bloemfontein at night. I lived there for 2 years, and if you left the sprinkler on overnight you’d have a frozen tree the next morning.

    He’s determined. He’s made for it.

  • Comment 59, posted at 11.11.11 03:57:31 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 59) :

    If your 4 props were to be CJ, Jannie, Coenie & Gurthro…

    1 CJ van der Linde / Coenie Oosthuizen / Gurthro Steenkamp
    3 CJ van der Linde / Jannie du Plessis / (Coenie Oosthuizen can cover off bench)
    17 Any of the 4 can be on the bench if not starting.

    If you went with both Beast & Gurthro at Coenie’s expense…
    1 CJ van der Linde / Gurthro Steenkamp / Beast Mtawarira
    3 CJ van der Linde / Jannie du Plessis
    17 You could only include one of CJ or Jannie, depending on which one starts.

    If you’ve got 4 props, at least 3 of them have to be able to play on the tighthead side. Otherwise you’re limiting yourself on that side by having to pick only between the looseheads. One of Beast & Gurthro would always have to miss out on the matchday-22, which isn’t the path we should be going down IMO.

  • Comment 60, posted at 11.11.11 04:02:20 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 59) : Not denying that Goosen has heaps of talent. I think most people are aware of that already. Just wouldn’t pick him for the Boks yet. @hendrikp (Comment 60) : My 3 props in the match 22 would be Beast, Jannie and Guthro. Coenie is far from Bok material IMO.

  • Comment 61, posted at 11.11.11 04:08:47 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 59) : Sounds like you have VERY high hopes for Koster. For your sake I hope he doesn’t disappoint you.

    But imo you are going to be a very disappointed man when you realise Koster isn’t all you thought he would be. ;)

  • Comment 62, posted at 11.11.11 04:16:07 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 59) : Johnson might not be our best bet at 8 but you already have Burger and Alberts who can cover that position.

  • Comment 63, posted at 11.11.11 04:19:15 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 59) : Want to ask you if you think its a good idea to play Deysel at 4 during the S15.

    For me its a big NO NO! Let me tell you why.

    Besides from our lineouts not being as strong as it would be with a specialised lock at 4 my other concern is ruck time. Deysel doesn’t seem interested in cleaning out the rucks. All he wants to do is stand next to Alberts at 1st receiver and take the ball up. And when he does attend to the rucks he seems to fly into it like a wreckless wrecking ball. But not only that, he is one of our slowest players out there. Might be why he can’t get to the rucks.

    Personally I would use him of the bench to come on for Alberts. Or even come on for Kanko and move Alberts to 8 for the last 20 minutes of the game. Most importently I want to see Alberts being rested during the S15. He is so much more effective when he is fresh. His body broke down in this year’s S15. Deysel is the man to play 7 when Alberts is being rested.

  • Comment 64, posted at 11.11.11 04:27:51 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 61) :

    Your 3 props would mean Jannie having to play the entire 80 mins, every single game, no matter what.

    Look at it this way. Why do you think Wyatt Crockett missed out on the All Blacks squad for the World Cup? Because they already had Tony Woodcock and needed versatility, not another loosehead. So they stuck with John Afoa who could play both sides despite not being highly thought of.

    We shouldn’t be accommodating. Shouldn’t be making exceptions like this.

    One ‘loosehead only’ maximum.
    One ‘tighthead only’ maximum.
    Minimum of 2 props who can play both sides.

    In New Zealands case it was:
    Tony Woodcock – Loosehead only
    Owen Franks – Tighthead only
    Ben Franks & John Afoa – both sides.

    @Ben (Comment 64) :

    I’m no big Deysel fan tbh. Reckon he’s got the athleticism/physicality, but he’s just not got the feel for it. He can do plenty of good things, but is anonymous for a lot of the game. Another Francois Louw. We don’t need Deysel to try run over people, and his workrate on defense or off the ball isn’t great. He’s no great ball-carrier either.

    Also we don’t need ‘cover’ at 8. We need a guy who can play 8. I don’t see Willem Alberts as a long-term solution there. Schalk, yes, but we need someone else there as well.

    If not Nick Koster (if he disappoints me like you say :razz: ) then I’d be looking towards Arno Botha.

  • Comment 65, posted at 11.11.11 05:51:44 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Ben (Comment 64) :

    Also, when people say a player “can’t get to the rucks”. Last thing you want is a guy sprinting around trying to hit every ruck possible.

    For the first 3 phases at least you need players to act as support runners and then blow-over if the ball carrier goes to ground. Last thing you want is a guy sprinting from one touchline to the over. Therefore I don’t think it’s got anything to do with Deysel being necessary slow. It’s rather his feel for the game, that anticipation that is lacking.

  • Comment 66, posted at 11.11.11 05:53:56 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • And my 3 props would be.

    1 Gurthro Steenkamp
    3 Jannie du Plessis

    16 Coenie Oosthuizen – Perfect place to learn from, and what an impact he would make off the bench! The WC definitely showed us the value in an ‘impact’ bench.

    And CJ van der Linde would be able to cover anybody, not just the loosehead side of the scrum.

    Harsh on Beast, yes, but you can only go in with 1 specialist loosehead prop unless you’re accommodating players, which we shouldn’t be doing.

  • Comment 67, posted at 11.11.11 05:56:44 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 66) :

    ***other. Not over :mrgreen:

  • Comment 68, posted at 11.11.11 05:59:41 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Ben (Comment 61) :

    Problem I have with leaving Goosen out if he’s performing is you are creating a situation whereby you’d be potentially putting Jantjies into the nr. 1 spot for the next 4 years.

    I’m a believer in ‘If you’re good enough, you’re old enough’, which Goosen is.

    Would be open to letting Goosen participate in the Junior World Champs and giving Jantjies an opportunity during the incoming England tour, but the coach needs to give Goosen as much opportunity as he will give Jantjies – if both performs in Super Rugby of course. Not hand the 10 jersey to Jantjies, and ignore Goosen completely while using every excuse under the sun, which I can see happening.

    Goosen is the only flyhalf in SA with the ability to be the best in the world. Lambie could do it in every department besides his kicking, but Goosen has it all.

    So for me, a sure thing.

  • Comment 69, posted at 11.11.11 06:08:19 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • The question of who is really next in line in terms of Bok selections would easily be sorted out if we went back to Tours like the old days. Then the dirt tracker side that plays during the week could be used to blood the youngsters and see if they ready for the test side! I would love to see this Rugby Championship scrapped and go back to the old school 5 week tour of a country! Those are proper tests!

  • Comment 70, posted at 11.11.11 08:00:11 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 70) :

    Not going to happen in a million years, but it does sound good!

    I’d like to see an Emerging Springboks side playing against the NZ Maori and Australia A, or teams of that nature.

    Also an U20 tournament alongside the ‘Rugby Championship’ would be nice.

  • Comment 71, posted at 11.11.11 08:17:19 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • Hendrikp you are a hoot!

  • Comment 72, posted at 11.11.11 08:36:42 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 71) : Yeh i k now its not going to happen because of the current sponsorships etc. But cricket still has tours so i dont see why rugby cant! That Emerging Bok side is hardly ever the next best though.

  • Comment 73, posted at 11.11.11 08:40:41 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 69) : “Goosen is the only flyhalf in SA with the ability to be the best in the world. Lambie could do it in every department besides his kicking, but Goosen has it all.”-premature . When Frans Steyn played at fh for the Sharks against Wp in the CC ,that game in the rain everyone said what is being said about Goosen.

  • Comment 74, posted at 11.11.11 08:42:39 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 69) : Good enough is old enough ,but sometimes good enough isnt ready enough…

  • Comment 75, posted at 11.11.11 08:47:20 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • One thing I cant stress enough is the cape produce rugby minds like Mark Keohane -uuuuggh,they believe in a utopian rugby where hookers who should be centers play 8th man ,to them all their players should be Springboks and the Springboks they do have are the best ever. Not a stab at you hendrik ,just a stab at some of what you have said here, all light hearted ofcourse :cool:

  • Comment 76, posted at 11.11.11 08:53:16 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Ben (Comment 64) : Yo! At the risk of invoking a friendly backlash from Culling Song, that was H-A-R-S-H man!!! :mrgreen:

    Is this whole Deysel experience of yours based on 1 game, 1 season or a few seasons? :mrgreen:

    What about game-plan?

    I’ve never been a huge fan of Deysel but there have been many times when he’s simply forced me to be grateful for his contributions to the team cause.

    I believe that Deysel at lock had more to do with trying to find place in the starting lineup for himself, Daniel, Kankowski and Alberts. Put another way, Plum placed a lot more value on having Deysel on the field than he did on having 1 of the other specialist locks aside from the inform Skeate. So the challenge to these other guys namely Marais, Bresler and Hargreaves is to take full advantage of the offseason training chances to change the coaches mind about their value. At the very least, they have to prove that they are as valuable an onfield asset as Deysel or Kanko. I say this coz I believe that Alberts is our best L/F and Daniel will be captain.

  • Comment 77, posted at 11.11.11 08:54:46 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 76) :

    Not sure what you’re talking about. Thinking a player from WP/Stormers is good, hardly means I’m in the ‘make the all Springboks’ brigade. That’s more of a Bulls thing anyway.

    You say Goosen isn’t ready, or unproven? How is he not ready when he’s playing outstanding rugby at CC level and looks to have all the tools? And how are Lambie or Jantjies in particular ‘proven’?

    Goosen is in the same boat as those two.

    As for hookers playing centre and so forth. The only 3 hookers I believe are ‘top notch’ in SA are Bissie, Chiliboy & Adriaan Strauss. I live for the day the Stormers get a bash-through-the-middle type hooker again.

    Can’t say Kankowski should still be thereabouts and Koster is a no-hope because of how he plays. Not saying you said that, but it appears to be the way a few people see it.

    And 8 is the one position in the forwards where you want a guy who plays as somewhat of a back. Has to drop back in defense & open things up. Don’t need a full-out enforcer in the position.

  • Comment 78, posted at 11.11.11 09:05:06 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • Spot on!

    If Plumtree plays Willem Alberts in any position but blindside, he’d have reason to be a tad angry.

  • Comment 79, posted at 11.11.11 09:07:02 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • Oh and with Francois Steyn.

    He played 99% of his rugby at Grey College as a 12 & 15.

    Just saying.

  • Comment 80, posted at 11.11.11 09:14:12 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 78) : those two both have man of the match in a cc final, Goosen has had a handfull of games for his senior side ,you cant compare Hendrik.
    Agree with you about hookers. Im not sure about Koster ,we will have to see.

    @hendrikp (Comment 80) : So what ,who cares …Kyle Cooper played flank most of his rugby career even moving into the center when they played against GC. Beast played most of his life at 8 and Craig Burden was a wing at school…just saying.

  • Comment 81, posted at 11.11.11 09:32:13 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 81) : Didnt JPP play lock at his school? :shock:

  • Comment 82, posted at 11.11.11 09:34:31 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 81) :

    No, I was explaining why I don’t see Goosen having the same problems at 10 that Frans had. He’s a 10 through and through.

  • Comment 83, posted at 11.11.11 09:36:15 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 80) : Im almost certain he played a large portion of his high school days as a 10…

  • Comment 84, posted at 11.11.11 09:36:47 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 77) : Yo! Bring on Culling Song. :mrgreen:

    My opinion is based on all the games he has played lock for the Sharks. For me he should be in the loose forwards and only there. Where exactly were I being harsh?

  • Comment 85, posted at 11.11.11 09:37:47 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 78) : “Can?t say Kankowski should still be thereabouts and Koster is a no-hope because of how he plays. Not saying you said that, but it appears to be the way a few people see it.

    And 8 is the one position in the forwards where you want a guy who plays as somewhat of a back. Has to drop back in defense & open things up. Don?t need a full-out enforcer in the position.”

    Quick to say that when its Koster being discussed and not Spies aren’t you? :mrgreen:

  • Comment 86, posted at 11.11.11 09:40:28 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 83) : Listen I rate him alot ,but young players need to find their identity in terms of senior rugby ,his is likely to be at 10 but things change coaches see things that we dont becuase of the one on one they have with players.

  • Comment 87, posted at 11.11.11 09:40:45 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 83) : any way ill entertain your point of views.

  • Comment 88, posted at 11.11.11 09:46:13 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 82) :

    -_- Man you talk a lot of rubbish.

  • Comment 89, posted at 11.11.11 09:46:22 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 78) : You have to be kidding by saying Goosen and Lambie are in the same boat right now. Come on Hendrik do you actually want people to take you serious? :???:

  • Comment 90, posted at 11.11.11 09:46:35 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 86) :

    Spies is a poor ball-carrier lately. Soon as someone gets their hands on him he gets manhandled. If he did it effectively, I’d have no problem.

    @Talent (Comment 84) :

    Pretty sure he didn’t, but maybe beet can enlighten us.

  • Comment 91, posted at 11.11.11 09:48:21 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Ben (Comment 90) :

    What has Jantjies done to be ahead of Goosen? Outside of being terrible during Super Rugby. I’d argue Goosen even outplayed him in the Currie Cup. Can’t blame Goosen for not playing for the Lions.

    Lambie probably is a little bit ahead but you can’t exactly say he’s a sure thing in the 10 jersey can you. Test versus Australia was inconclusive at best.

  • Comment 92, posted at 11.11.11 09:50:39 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 91) : What do you think will be the Stormers’ 1st choice loose trio for the S15 and what loose trio would you prefer?

  • Comment 93, posted at 11.11.11 09:51:23 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 92) : And put a Jantjies with a correct attitude ahead of Goosen right now. That was Jantjies’ biggest problem during the S15. He’s a much better player than what he put on display back then.

    In the 10 odd caps that Lambie have played for the Boks he hasn’t really done his chances any harm. I put Lambie well ahead of Goosen right now.

    Remember we are talking about right now. Present tense. So it doesn’t matter what you think Goosen is capable off, Lambie has proven his worth. Let’s see how Goosen kicks during some high pressure SupeRugby games. :cool:

  • Comment 94, posted at 11.11.11 09:57:31 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 93) :

    Probably 6 Schalk Burger 7 Nick Koster 8 Duane Vermeulen.

    They haven’t re-signed Pieter Louw. If they had, I’d have gone

    6 Pieter Louw
    7 Duane Vermeulen
    8 Schalk Burger
    19 Nick Koster. Rotation off the bench to start with.

    But now I would go:

    6 Schalk Burger
    7 Duane Vermeulen
    8 Nick Koster

  • Comment 95, posted at 11.11.11 09:58:59 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Ben (Comment 94) : Meant to say “I put a Jantjies with a correct attitude ahead of Goosen right now.”

  • Comment 96, posted at 11.11.11 09:59:52 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 95) : I’d also go with

    6. Burger
    7. Vermeulen
    8. Koster

  • Comment 97, posted at 11.11.11 10:01:43 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 94) :

    Fair enough.

    Not sure how you put Jantjies ahead of him based on his performances in Super rugby, but you’re entitled to your opinion! He did do well in the CC, I’ll give him that.

  • Comment 98, posted at 11.11.11 10:02:38 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 98) : Well at least Jantjies has played SR! ;)

    Not what I said. What I said was I put the Jantjies with the correct attitude ahead of Goosen.

  • Comment 99, posted at 11.11.11 10:05:10 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 99) :

    I get that, but I don’t see how a correct attitude would make him any better, skill-wise.

    If we forget about Jantjies terrible Super Rugby campaign… just pretend it never happened.

    Then Goosen still outplayed him in the Currie Cup. So if you were to include the Super 15, then Goosen is WAY ahead.

    I guess only time will tell :mrgreen:

  • Comment 100, posted at 11.11.11 10:10:13 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 100) : Okay let’s say they were even in this year’s CC. Which I think is the case.

    Have you forgot about Jantjies’ CC season in 2010. He had a very decent one. Kicking at goal was brilliant especially. So that puts Jantjies ahead! :)

  • Comment 101, posted at 11.11.11 10:15:18 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 85) :
    Jokes Ben. I was looking for the slightest reason to have a dig :mrgreen:
    But if you read it back, it does leave out huge chunks of good work that Deysel has done. I know because when I’ve watched games on the tellie with mates, I’m usually always on his case and more often than not Deysel has done things to shut me up :mrgreen:

    Ben says:
    *Deysel doesn’t seem interested in cleaning out the rucks.
    *All he wants to do is stand next to Alberts at 1st receiver and take the ball up.
    *And when he does attend to the rucks he seems to fly into it like a wreckless wrecking ball.
    *But not only that, he is one of our slowest players out there. *Might be why he can’t get to the rucks.

  • Comment 102, posted at 11.11.11 10:15:28 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 100) : I know stats don’t always tell the full story but look at the stats you posted.

    Elton Jantjies
    Minutes played ? 745
    Runs ? 57
    Tackles bust ? 19
    Offloads ? 10
    Linebreaks ? 5
    Linebreaks create ? 8
    Tackles ? 62
    Tackles missed ? 24

    Patrick Lambie
    Minutes played ? 1106 (some not at flyhalf, but majority was)
    Runs ? 53
    Tackles bust ? 17
    Offloads ? 4
    Linebreaks ? 5
    Linebreaks create ? 3
    Tackles ? 133
    Tackles missed ? 16

    Elton’s season wasn’t THAT bad. Defense pretty woefull. But just look at Lambie’s tackle stats! :cool:

  • Comment 103, posted at 11.11.11 10:19:14 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 100) : I agree with what you said earlier. Based on pure talent, Johan Goosen is a player who has the potential to become the best in the world and go down in history as being one of the best ever.

    Jantjies has had 2 wonderful CC campaigns in a row. He is a kingpin in the Lions team. I hope he can translate this impressive local form into success at the more competitive SR level, esp away from home. I believe that’s where it will count most for me. To see him stamp his authority on a game away from the comforts of Cokellis Park

  • Comment 104, posted at 11.11.11 10:21:14 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 102) : The brutal Truth. In other words, my opinion. :)

    I’m not saying he’s useless. I’m saying lock doesn’t suit him and he should stick to the loose forwards. And imo he aint shifting Daniel, Alberts or Kanko. So the bench it should be for Deysel for my liking.

  • Comment 105, posted at 11.11.11 10:24:08 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 100) : As far as what I’ve seen for Grey College and when he joined the Sharks juniors, Frans Steyn played flyhalf. But info sharing wasn’t as good back then as it is now, so he could well have played 12 & 15 as well. Eg I have only ever seen Jan Serfontein in a 12 and 13 navy blue jumper but I know that he’s played wing for a long spell as well in 2010.

  • Comment 106, posted at 11.11.11 10:24:40 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 104) : I think Jantjies is going to have a very decent S15. I think Mitchell has sorted out his attitude problems.

  • Comment 107, posted at 11.11.11 10:28:06 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 103) :

    His error rate was also through the roof.

    @beet (Comment 106) :

    He definitely played a lot of games at 12 & 15 for Grey :mrgreen:

  • Comment 108, posted at 11.11.11 10:29:45 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Ben (Comment 103) : It wud be nice to match these stats against Carter and Cooper.

    You’re right stats don’t tell the whole story.

    Interesting that Pat spent 361min (6hrs) more time on the pitch than Elton. Stats would have been way different if things were evened up in time.

  • Comment 109, posted at 11.11.11 10:31:15 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 106) :

    Grey producing them so quickly, seems they like playing their matric centres on the wing the year before!

  • Comment 110, posted at 11.11.11 10:31:16 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 109) :

    I can grab Cooper & Carter if you like? Gimme 5 mins.

  • Comment 111, posted at 11.11.11 10:32:05 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 110) : Ja. This is exactly what happened. I first saw Jan at Kearsney in 2010. He played excellently at 13 outside Linde, Goosen and Jordaan (not too difficult to do well outside these guys). The opportunity only came along coz Small-Smith had burst his appendix. As soon as WSS got back, Jan was pushed out to wing.

  • Comment 112, posted at 11.11.11 10:34:39 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Ben (Comment 107) : @hendrikp (Comment 111) : What do you guys think of Doppies at 13. Will he be able to stand his ground?

    I was wondering if the Lions should swap their centres around but you don’t want to fix something before it breaks.

  • Comment 113, posted at 11.11.11 10:36:44 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 113) : Doppies is solid. Think he would even stand his ground if he had to play 4. :mrgreen:

    I rhink he will be fine but I agree with you. Would also prefer him at 12.

  • Comment 114, posted at 11.11.11 10:40:05 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • Daniel Carter
    Minutes played – 955
    Runs – 70
    Tackles bust – 26
    Offloads – 11
    Linebreaks – 4
    Linebreaks create – 10
    Tackles – 96
    Tackles missed – 20

    Quade Cooper
    Minutes played – 1428
    Runs – 107
    Tackles bust – 55
    Offloads – 41
    Linebreaks – 15
    Linebreaks create – 28
    Tackles – 53
    Tackles missed – 28

    They had Cooper down as having made 39 errors. Carter with 14. Elton Jantjies only 12 (I take that back, not as bad as I thought).

  • Comment 115, posted at 11.11.11 10:40:42 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 112) :

    Damn. I had a burst appendix as well a few years ago. Worst pain I’ve ever had by far. Felt like death, and I’ve had a stick go through my leg :lol:

    Definitely prefer Doppies as a 12. Think the Lions may struggle a bit to open things up if they don’t bring Waylon back in at centre, or find someone with some pace and strength on the outside.

  • Comment 116, posted at 11.11.11 10:43:15 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 115) : Haha doesn’t Cooper tackle? :shock:

  • Comment 117, posted at 11.11.11 10:43:44 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 115) : Will you agree now that Elton is ahead of Goosen? :grin:

  • Comment 118, posted at 11.11.11 10:45:57 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 117) :

    Nope. They try move him out of that channel on defense because he’s so bad at it. Makes Andrew Mehrtens look like he should be a defense coach.

  • Comment 119, posted at 11.11.11 10:46:20 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 119) : A lot like Danny Cipriani! Man that guy can’t tackle!

  • Comment 120, posted at 11.11.11 10:48:25 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 117) : Cooper misses 35% or 1 out of every 3 tackles.

    I think this actually underlines his true strengh as an all out attacking player. The defensive lapses are forgiven.

  • Comment 121, posted at 11.11.11 10:48:26 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 119) :

    In fact, Anthony Fainga’a is near the top for tackles made by a backline player. Beaten only by Wynand Olivier, Morne Steyn (obviously target that channel versus the Bulls) & Tom Carter.

    @Ben (Comment 118) :

    Nope. Goosen is going to win the Springboks the RWC 2015 in the 10 jersey. If he’s not ignored of course. He’s that good.

  • Comment 122, posted at 11.11.11 10:49:26 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 121) : What does that make M.Steyn? An all out kicking player?

    All out wuss sound good to me! :lol:

  • Comment 123, posted at 11.11.11 10:51:26 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 122) : Yet again you jump to the future. Present tense please. :)

  • Comment 124, posted at 11.11.11 10:53:16 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 123) :

    Near the top of the tackle count. He just isn’t strong in the tackle. Not a wuss like Cooper though, no way.

  • Comment 125, posted at 11.11.11 10:54:00 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Ben (Comment 124) :

    Like I said. If you’re good enough, you’re old enough.

    Him ‘not being ready’ isn’t right IMO. Looks pretty ready if you ask me.

    Still ahead of Jantjies.

  • Comment 126, posted at 11.11.11 10:55:26 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 125) : Top 3 wussies ion SR has to be Cipriani, Steyn and Cooper.

  • Comment 127, posted at 11.11.11 10:56:48 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 123) : I guess the important tackles are the one on ones that potentially result in linebreaks and point scoring opportunities if you miss them.

    In traffic, if a flyhalf holds a guy up or just get in his way long enough to slow him down and allow for a cover tackler to get there he can get away with being weak on D and not costing the team to dearly.

    A flyhalf’s value on attack is far greater. Cooper like M.Steyn have been match winners and held the SR trophy.

  • Comment 128, posted at 11.11.11 10:57:21 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 126) : Entitled to your opinion. :cool:

  • Comment 129, posted at 11.11.11 10:58:08 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 127) : What about that wing for the Rebels. He must surely have topped the chart for missed tackles and errors made. He might not look like a wuss tho.

  • Comment 130, posted at 11.11.11 10:58:53 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 128) : Fair enough.

    Still think he’s a wuss.

  • Comment 131, posted at 11.11.11 11:00:26 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @beet (Comment 130) : Can’t recall who you are talking about.

  • Comment 132, posted at 11.11.11 11:02:16 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 108) : oh ya :roll: life according to hendrikp

  • Comment 133, posted at 11.11.11 11:02:28 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 130) :

    Yep Cooper Vuna came 2nd for missed tackles. Only behind Nick Phipps (also Rebels). 3rd Stephen Brett. 4th Sarel Pretorius.

  • Comment 134, posted at 11.11.11 11:04:00 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 122) : Hes not a Maritzburg College boy ,dont ignore history.

  • Comment 135, posted at 11.11.11 11:04:18 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 133) :

    Not sure what you mean but I like this emoticon :roll: :mrgreen:

  • Comment 136, posted at 11.11.11 11:06:17 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 133) : Hope you enjoy that little victory! :)

  • Comment 137, posted at 11.11.11 11:06:37 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 134) : Thats him Cooper Vuna.

    How many errors did he make?

  • Comment 138, posted at 11.11.11 11:07:38 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Ben (Comment 137) : Ofcourse :evil: no im not that pathetic ,ahahahaha boom hendrikp your wrong

  • Comment 139, posted at 11.11.11 11:08:36 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 134) :

    Missed tackles for backline players I mean.

    Ashley Johnson topped the missed tackles for forwards. Followed by Nasi Manu and then Pierre Spies.

  • Comment 140, posted at 11.11.11 11:09:14 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 138) :

    Only 5, it says. I’m not sure what they count as an error though. Guessing just knock-ons & things like kicking out on the full or passing the ball to no-one. Things like that.

    Leaders for errors were: 1 Quade Cooper 2 Stephen Brett 3 Charl McLeod 4 Kurtley Beale 5 Bryan Habana 6 Rene Ranger 7 Zac Guildford 8 Sarel Pretorius.

  • Comment 141, posted at 11.11.11 11:13:48 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 140) : Ja but lets be honest, to miss many tackles as a wing is far harder to achieve than guys who are closer to the breakdown and fringes.

    I bet that as a % Vuna comes first. Highest percentage missed tackles in SR overall. :mrgreen:

  • Comment 142, posted at 11.11.11 11:14:13 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 139) : :mrgreen:

  • Comment 143, posted at 11.11.11 11:15:07 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 141) : I think some of these stats should be looked at as percentages to make comparisons easier to make.

  • Comment 144, posted at 11.11.11 11:15:42 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • Leaders for errors in the forwards.

    Willem Alberts & Pierre Spies tied for number-1. And then Victor Vito just 1 behind.

    Not many errors the difference between the forwards though so wouldn’t consider this one to matter much.

  • Comment 145, posted at 11.11.11 11:16:32 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • Final thought Good enough is old Enough but he is still on trial and will be untill he proves himself in a pressure match or over a season or two like the rest .Cheers all have a good day

  • Comment 146, posted at 11.11.11 11:18:07 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet (Comment 142) :

    You’re right. He missed almost half his tackles. Very bad.

    I work it out as percentages in preparation for my fantasy team next year. Divide it all by the minutes they spent on the field etc. but not going to do it for everybody :lol:

  • Comment 147, posted at 11.11.11 11:18:57 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 146) :

    Not what Frans Steyn had to do, but okay :mrgreen:

    Have a good day.

  • Comment 148, posted at 11.11.11 11:20:37 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 148) : wasnt first choice in 06 or 07 ,two years where he played second to the likes of Butch ,JDV and Percy. If it wasnt due to injury we would have had Jdv at 12

  • Comment 149, posted at 11.11.11 12:17:25 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 148) : also played an entire super rugby season and in a super rugby final and he still wasnt an incumbent.

  • Comment 150, posted at 11.11.11 12:19:11 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 150) :

    Incumbent or not, he played in every single test from when he made his debut in the 2006 EOYT (where he started all 3), except when Jake sent a weaker side to Australasia.

    Started 4 from 8 tests before the World Cup.

  • Comment 151, posted at 11.11.11 12:24:37 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 151) :

    Came on as a sub against Australia to kick 2 late drop goals in 2007 also.

    If you’re good enough, you’re old enough. He may not have been seen as ‘the incumbent’ but he was very very highly thought of, and probably would’ve or should’ve been ahead of Percy if not for goalkicking.

    Luckily Johan Goosen is probably up there as one of the very best goalkickers in SA, if not the world.

  • Comment 152, posted at 11.11.11 12:26:50 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 152) : The difference is he wasn’t deemed good enough to hold down a position ahead of those stalwarts, only through injury he was chosen to start. Good enough is old enough is such a poor term actually, how do you know a player is good enough to make the step up unless he is tested in similar situations to that of test rugby.
    I realise I may sound hypocritical here because the other day I said Arno Botha WOULD be a Springbok. Johan Goosen, good as he may be has steep competition from young accomplished players such as Jantjies and Lambie never mind Butch James and Morne Steyn.

  • Comment 153, posted at 11.11.11 12:38:13 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 152) : If Butch James ,Morne Steyn ,Pat Lambie and Elton Jantjies are all injured then maybe its justified to put him straight in there.

  • Comment 154, posted at 11.11.11 12:49:35 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • A

  • Comment 155, posted at 11.11.11 12:49:54 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • At this point in time atleast

  • Comment 156, posted at 11.11.11 12:50:20 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @beet: do you now if chris cloete has been included in the sr training group?

  • Comment 157, posted at 11.11.11 13:44:18 by bergshark Reply

    bergsharkSuper Rugby player
     
  • @bergshark (Comment 157) : You get quicker answers to those sorts of questions if you ask Rob directly.

    I will be very surprised if he’s named in the preliminary SR group to be honest but I expect that he’ll see a fair bit of Vodacom Cup action in 2012.

  • Comment 158, posted at 11.11.11 15:06:01 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @bergshark (Comment 157) : I’m not aware that the Sharks have actually announced a super rugby training group yet… at least, none of my sources have said anything about it.

  • Comment 159, posted at 11.11.11 15:32:21 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @beet (Comment 158) : I’m with you… Daniel, Botes and probably Kleinhans will probably be the options at 6 for the Sharks… not that any of them can play the ground game like Chris, but that’s neither here nor there. Will take at least another year of getting turned over regularly by the likes of Pocock, Brussow, Minnie, etc before our coaches figure that one out…

    Still expecting to see Deysel employed as a 6 sometime next season too. The thought of Deysel and Alberts on the pitch at the same time just gets Plum’s man-bits far too agitated for him to not keep trying it.

  • Comment 160, posted at 11.11.11 15:35:41 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • According to the Weekend Witness the Sharks are currently signing some new players “to fill the gaps” in Bashford’s words. Don’t know whether to be happy or be terrified :shock:

  • Comment 161, posted at 12.11.11 08:47:41 by Sharksmad - The Blog's Dudette Reply

    Sharksmad - The Blog's DudetteSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Sharksmad – The Blog’s Dudette (Comment 161) :
    “Don’t know whether to be happy or be terrified” ha,ha. :mrgreen:

    Positive thoughts now…mmmmmmm Fransie, Fransie

  • Comment 162, posted at 12.11.11 09:54:23 by Salmonoid Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    Salmonoid the SubtleAssistant coach
     
  • @Sharksmad – The Blog’s Dudette (Comment 161) : they will have to make many signings or one big one, becuase the gap to fill in the midfield is huge.

  • Comment 163, posted at 12.11.11 10:02:51 by BR Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    Currie Cup player
     
  • @BR (Comment 163) : that is the only gap I want to fill and maybe lock

  • Comment 164, posted at 12.11.11 10:06:19 by BR Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    Currie Cup player
     
  • @( hope they bring back kockott as well( though i read he has signed a deal with castres till the end of the french season).that his coaches at the sharks couldn’t get his passing game up to standard is beyond me??

  • Comment 165, posted at 12.11.11 11:11:30 by bergshark Reply

    bergsharkSuper Rugby player
     
  • Imho the only signing that was very unexpected,was the one of marius joubert.
    Meyer bosman has qualities that we can do with .
    Same goes for the signing of jl potgieter.( Perhaps playing at 13 wouldve been the better option for the sharks,in hindsight).
    The loss of both sykes and mostert are huge though.don’t know how the coaching staff and management intend on filling those gaps.( A team with sykes.mostert,skeate and bresler,jandre marais looks impressive ).
    We can also do with a 7/4 player in forwards ( thought this where the sharks couldve looked to keep a mihael rhodes on the books ).

  • Comment 166, posted at 12.11.11 11:19:14 by bergshark Reply

    bergsharkSuper Rugby player
     
  • Has the superrugby fixtures list for 2012 been released yet?

  • Comment 167, posted at 12.11.11 11:34:17 by bergshark Reply

    bergsharkSuper Rugby player
     
  • Still need a fetcher( ground player).
    And a backline coach,skills coach.

  • Comment 168, posted at 12.11.11 11:41:20 by bergshark Reply

    bergsharkSuper Rugby player
     
  • @bergshark (Comment 166) : Which part of the JLP signing don’t you understand?

  • Comment 169, posted at 12.11.11 13:22:08 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @bergshark (Comment 166) : Let me rephrase. Why was the JLP signing unexpected to you?

  • Comment 170, posted at 12.11.11 13:33:18 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • bafana just scored a own goal against ivory coast

  • Comment 171, posted at 12.11.11 16:09:35 by BR Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    Currie Cup player
     
  • and the equalizer

  • Comment 172, posted at 12.11.11 17:07:56 by BR Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    Currie Cup player
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 160) : What`s the use of Deysel and Alberts on the pitch at the same time when we`ll have zero possession?

    The only way to accommodate something like that is by moving Alberts to 8 and Deysel to 7 so we can start Botes.

  • Comment 173, posted at 13.11.11 10:07:57 by Original Pierre Reply
    Author
    Original PierreSuper Rugby player
     
  • Is Campo still in KZN and involved with the Sharks? Just saw him on tv being interviewed, he had on a Sharks’ top (granted -the interview could have been done ages ago)? We need a backline coach that understands manipulation of defense systems. Pointless having all these guys and not having a descent backline coach that will take them to the next level.

  • Comment 174, posted at 13.11.11 12:26:22 by GreatSharksays Reply

    Assistant coach
     
  • Really scared of the Bull’s 2012 bacline. Is Tim Whitehead a number 12 or 13 cause our problems are at 13?

  • Comment 175, posted at 13.11.11 12:28:53 by GreatSharksays Reply

    Assistant coach
     
  • Oh my word what a finish to the Glasgow vs Bath match.

    World Cup winner Stevie D slots a 78th min pen that does not need editing – it looks like a miss – to give Bath a 21-19 lead.
    Then Glasgow win back the ball from a lucky bounce when the kickoff wasn’t fielded by Bath. Then push fwd, go thru the phases but can’t get good enough field position, get desperate and attempt an ambitious and poorly set drop goal to win the game. The effort is partly charged down and lands wide and short, however the wicked spin caused by the charge down wrong foots FB Nick Abendanon and sits up perfectly for an unstoppable lock Ritchie Gray to run onto and score the winner under the sticks after the 80min are up. Glasgow wins.

  • Comment 176, posted at 13.11.11 16:51:04 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • Solly Tyibilika murdered ,poor guy.

  • Comment 177, posted at 13.11.11 18:29:40 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Talent (Comment 177) :
    Just heard sumthing about a shooting of a former Shark ans Springbok. Didn’t quite hear who it was and thought to ask around here.
    He was playing for Border last?

  • Comment 178, posted at 13.11.11 19:24:19 by JustPlainSHARK Reply

    JustPlainSHARKCurrie Cup player
     
  • @JustPlainSHARK (Comment 178) : Ya think he was playing for border
    http://www.sport24.co.za/

  • Comment 179, posted at 13.11.11 20:04:23 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • pictures of him playing for villagers in ct

  • Comment 180, posted at 13.11.11 20:12:18 by Talent Reply
    Author
    TalentCurrie Cup player
     
  • I feel bad about Solly.
    I do not have any words for this country.

  • Comment 181, posted at 13.11.11 20:33:13 by Honey Badger Reply

    Honey BadgerCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Honey Badger (Comment 181) : you know you’re not allowed to go there, so please don’t.

  • Comment 182, posted at 13.11.11 20:50:35 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 182) : Ok sorry

  • Comment 183, posted at 13.11.11 20:54:28 by Honey Badger Reply

    Honey BadgerCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Honey Badger (Comment 183) : :)

  • Comment 184, posted at 13.11.11 21:24:56 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @beet: richie gray 2.05m 128kg and still young.
    The next b&i lions tour is to australia in 2013?

  • Comment 185, posted at 13.11.11 22:31:22 by bergshark Reply

    bergsharkSuper Rugby player
     
  • @beet: was the brive game televised this weekend?if so.did you watch it? ( I think you know the next question lol).

  • Comment 186, posted at 13.11.11 22:33:28 by bergshark Reply

    bergsharkSuper Rugby player
     
  • @bergshark (Comment 186) : No apparently Brive are in the Amlin Cup this year so it’s unlikely that any of their Euro games will be televised. They beat the Sale Sharks 26-18.

    Cooke wasn’t even in the matchday 22.

  • Comment 187, posted at 13.11.11 23:34:54 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     
  • @bergshark (Comment 185) : Yeah. I really like Ritchie Gray. I just wish Scotland could be more consistent. Every so often they appear to be building towards something good in the season to come and when that season does arrive it seems like instead of delivering, they disappointingly take a few steps back in progress and have to start all over again. Just watch. There’s a bit of Scottish rugby optimism around at the moment but guaranteed that as soon as the 6N rolls around they’ll lose to Italy and claim the wooden-spoon.

  • Comment 188, posted at 13.11.11 23:41:06 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beetCurrie Cup player
     

Add Comment

You must be logged in to post a comment.