robdylan

Sharks player ratings v Stormers


Written by Rob Otto (robdylan)

Posted in :Original Content, Sharks, Super Rugby on 5 Mar 2012 at 08:00
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While Saturday’s game against the Stormers was a vast improvement on what we saw from the Sharks against the Bulls the week before, we are again unfortunately in the position of having to lament a narrow loss, rather than celebrate a victory. Let’s look at our totally subjective rating of the Sharks players.

1. Dale Chadwick. Seemed to really struggle at scrum time, which somewhat detracted from the strong defensive work he did all over the field, particularly in the first half. 4/10
2. Bismarck du Plessis. A much improved game in many areas from the burly hooker – certainly his lineout work was far better and he competed like a terrier at the breakdown. Still needs to work on his carrying technique, while indiscipline remains an issue. 6/10
3. Wiehahn Herbst. Achieved some form of parity at scrum time, but hardly the dominant performance we were expecting against a young opponent. Wiehahn will learn from this one and come back better. 5/10
4. Steven Sykes. A much better game and one that was reminiscent of Sykes at his best. He looked assured and confident and was probably the pick of the tight forwards on the day. 7/10
5. Ross Skeate. A real mixed back from the lanky former-Stormer. Skeate ruled supreme in the air in the first half and even managed to keep the highly-rated Stormers locks at bay in the first half. Some very poor discipline, including a yellow card offence which swung the momentum of the match, must count against him. 5/10
6. Jacques Botes. A very good showing from a player who consistently punches above his weight – and belies his age. Jacques was everywhere in the first half, but fell off a little towards the end of the game. 7/10
7. Marcell Coetzee. The best forward on the field, from either team. Marcell tackled like a man possessed and was always on hand to take the ball up strongly, often gaining valuable yardage in the process. 8/10
8. Keegan Daniel. An industrious effort all over the park, unfortunately marred by a shocking act of personal indiscipline right at the end that ultimately cost his side the match. A captain should know better. 6/10

9. Fred Michalak. Some very snappy service from the wiley Frenchman, although decision-making on attack could have been better at times. A far better outing that the Loftus nightmare, though. 6/10
10. Pat Lambie. Seems to be really struggling with the boot, both off the tee and out of hand. An early tough kick seemed to unsettle him a little, which is worrying for the usually unflappable Pat. Recovered well, though, to deliver some assured, if not outstanding, all-round play. 6/10
11. Lwazi Mvovo. A very good showing from a man who has come under fire for not getting involved enough. Lwazi seemed far more “present” on attack this week and the Sharks were so nearly rewarded with tries as a result. 7/10
12. Meyer Bosman. A dominant display, particularly on defence, where he was everywhere. Showed quick hands on attack and a real willingness to attack the advantage line, which is good to see. 7/10
13. JP Pietersen. Always looked dangerous at 13, but against far more experienced opposition, was also a little flummoxed on defence once or twice. This is a learning process, though, and JP was still pretty good over all. 6/10
14. Louis Ludik. Unfortunately had very few opportunities to show much of anything. Committed few errors, but was thoroughly contained on attack by the Stormers’ strong defence. 5/10
15. Riaan Viljoen. Another solid outing from Tjoppie, who was given more opportunity to run than was the case at Loftus. He’s solid at the back, while very exciting n the counter and we expect a lot more from him in the future. 6/10

16. Craig Burden. Unused again.
17. Jannie du Plessis. Made no noticeable difference when he came on – in fact, the scrum seemed worse. Jannie is the senior in the front row and needs to start showing it. 4/10
18. Anton Bresler. Not on long enough to be rated.
19. Tera Mtembu. A promising debut in which he contributed manfully, made his tackles and even carried the ball up a few times. Good work! 6/10
20. Charl McLeod. Concentrated well on the basics of his position and did what was required. 6/10
21. Marius Joubert. Looked somewhat pedestrian and predictable when coming on at inside centre and seemed to lack the spark that Bosman had brought to the position. 5/10
22. Paul Jordaan. Not on long enough to be rated.



128 Comments

  • Fair ratings me thinks.. Although I’d subract another for Ross…that’s just stupid from a senior player. I suggest less tweeting and more concentration..

  • Comment 1, posted at 05.03.12 08:12:55 by Ice Reply
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  • Oh, and if I compare these ratings to lastweek’s, I’d give Marcell at least a 9,5! :wink:

  • Comment 2, posted at 05.03.12 08:14:10 by Ice Reply
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  • @Ice (Comment 2) : haha…. what did I give Marcell last week?

  • Comment 3, posted at 05.03.12 08:16:15 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Ice (Comment 1) :
    Attend to agree with you ice, lets just hope they pick up so we can start wining again, don’t want a 2007 all over again not sure what year it was with like 7 loses along the way just counldn’t get the wining think started.

    But maybe our boys will peek just the right time :smile:

  • Comment 4, posted at 05.03.12 08:17:08 by chaz Reply

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  • @chaz (Comment 4) : it was 2010 and it was 5 losses :mrgreen:

  • Comment 5, posted at 05.03.12 08:18:44 by robdylan Reply
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  • Fair ratings..

  • Comment 6, posted at 05.03.12 08:22:03 by Richard Ferguson Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 5) :

    :smile:
    Thanks i just wasn’t sure what year it was and i don’t want that feeling to come backk again

  • Comment 7, posted at 05.03.12 08:24:18 by chaz Reply

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  • @chaz (Comment 7) : if you read the “Playing catch up” article you would know :)

  • Comment 8, posted at 05.03.12 08:25:28 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 3) : I think a 7…but if I compare it to the Rating Timmie got for his performance.. :wink: :lol:

  • Comment 9, posted at 05.03.12 08:28:18 by Ice Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 8) : :oops: ;-)

  • Comment 10, posted at 05.03.12 08:29:47 by chaz Reply

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  • Pretty much agree with all markings except for Keegan cost us a draw with a brain fart, and trying to keep the ball in in a reversing scrum last us possession and game over :evil: I would give him 5 certainly not the same marking as Pat,and Riaan!
    What an improvement from Sykes I gladly eat humble pie and wellcome back Sykes! Bissie was good in getting the ball and two of those calls against him were sketchy at best! Bryce Lawrences’ SA relative should stop wearing his anti Sharks underpants over his shorts! :evil: and the bad news he is again the ref against the Sharks this weekend :cry: how many warnings did the Stormers get in 1st half and noone sent off, Skeate not even warned and sent off :(

  • Comment 11, posted at 05.03.12 08:30:06 by Sharksmad - The Blog's Dudette Reply

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  • Can agree with most, but feel Ludik and Chadwick are lucky to score that highly.

  • Comment 12, posted at 05.03.12 08:33:22 by Big Fish Reply
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  • @Ice (Comment 9) : Timmy’s actions led directly to a try at Loftus… Only try scored in either game the Sharks have played in so far…

  • Comment 13, posted at 05.03.12 08:33:29 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Sharksmad – The Blog’s Dudette (Comment 11) : so when Bissie gets pinged, it’s a dodgy call… when Keegan gets pinged, he needs to be shot? :mrgreen:

    Both gave away very similar penalties in the last 10 minutes and I would say in Keegan’s case, he had a legitimate reason to believe that the ball was out. Bismarck quite clearly didn’t come from behind in his.

  • Comment 14, posted at 05.03.12 08:35:17 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Big Fish (Comment 12) : these things are always subjective, aren’t they?

  • Comment 15, posted at 05.03.12 08:36:04 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 15) :
    Absolutely.

    Just feel we are getting nothing on the right wing, whereas Movovo is causing jitters everytime the ball goes left, and Chadwick was poor in the scrums and got driven back every time he carried up.

  • Comment 16, posted at 05.03.12 08:42:10 by Big Fish Reply
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  • @Big Fish (Comment 16) : telling you now, I reckon Dale’s problem is a lack of leg strength. Hugely strong in the upper body, but worried about lower down

  • Comment 17, posted at 05.03.12 08:47:04 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Big Fish (Comment 16) : Lwazi was good, wasn’t he? Lovely to see

  • Comment 18, posted at 05.03.12 08:47:40 by robdylan Reply
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  • No Rob I’m uncertain about Bissie the two calls of playing the ball on the floor especially the last were really dodgy really! Also there were two good ocasions when Bissie’s stealing the ball completely broke any momentum the Stormers had. But his indiscretion in the last 10 does undo that good work thouh hence my uncertainty. Keegan however had his brain fart when he should have been telling his team to keep their heads and not give away a penalty. We always laugh at the Bulls’ Stegman, I just see Keegan as the Sharks’ Stegman ie Points to the oposition before the game has even started :(

  • Comment 19, posted at 05.03.12 08:48:42 by Sharksmad - The Blog's Dudette Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 13) : fair enough..then I’d go with the fact that he had 7 before and I reckon its at least 2.5 points improvemenent! :lol:

  • Comment 20, posted at 05.03.12 08:55:55 by Ice Reply
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  • This may be a bit harsh considering that fact that the first 2 games fo the season were tough away fixtures, but then again these guys are professionals and should be judged as such! 6 for Keegan and Bismacrk- is that for the number of points each give away each game? As leaders of the team they are shocking at the moment! Shocking is also a good description of Bismarck’s lineout throwing. Give Burden a run next week please Plum! Lambie has been super average at 10 this year BUT he has looked the business at 15! I know everyone wants to see him at 10 but to be honest playing the way he is, he is waving his Bok chance goodbye! Michalak looks like a pensioner at scrumhalf…play him at 10 or send him back to France. Coetzee had a decent game but needs to learn to pass! He does good work in defense though-something a few other could learn from. We have some exciting outside backs so please guys run the damn rugby ball- we play in black NOT light blue! A big concern for the Sharks is the fact that we very quickly getting the tag of “Light 5″ from the Stormers!

  • Comment 21, posted at 05.03.12 08:56:55 by SheldonK Reply

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  • Fair enough ratings but Bismark and Skeate deserve less.

  • Comment 22, posted at 05.03.12 09:08:11 by lostfish Reply
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  • These scrum penalties are really annoying. Should be free kicks at most —- if the ref can guess who is wrong.Stormers got a good hit on 1 st or 2 nd scrum but the penalty against Chadwick — walking around is BS. Sharks were dominant. What most refs know about scrumming is a lottery.

  • Comment 23, posted at 05.03.12 09:15:03 by Ernie Reply

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  • @Sharksmad – The Blog’s Dudette (Comment 19) : the last one was bang on… he was pinged for coming in from the side and that’s exactly what he did.

  • Comment 24, posted at 05.03.12 09:18:29 by robdylan Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 21) : Bismarck’s lineout work was actually very good this week.

  • Comment 25, posted at 05.03.12 09:18:58 by robdylan Reply
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  • @lostfish (Comment 22) : agree on Skeate, he gave away 3 crucial penalties and in the end the yellow card. real stupid mistakes. could not believe my eyes while watching the game.

  • Comment 26, posted at 05.03.12 09:21:43 by VanWilder Reply

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  • @Sharksmad – The Blog’s Dudette (Comment 19) : agree on the Daniel topic. when the stormers made Bruger their captain last year, i thought it could be a mistake, as he was mr walking penalty at the time, but the captaincy helped him to start being a leader in that department. i wish Keegan could rip that page out of Schalks book.

  • Comment 27, posted at 05.03.12 09:24:45 by VanWilder Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 24) : no Rob sorry I didn’t mean last infringement, I meant the last time he was penalised for wrestling the ball off Kolisi, it was clearly wrestled free off the ground – not playing it on the ground.

  • Comment 28, posted at 05.03.12 09:26:40 by Sharksmad - The Blog's Dudette Reply

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  • @VanWilder (Comment 26) : I got the feeling he was helping his old team…

  • Comment 29, posted at 05.03.12 09:28:32 by lostfish Reply
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  • @lostfish (Comment 29) : thats maybe pushing it abit :lol: , but he really needs to work on it. In fact, most of our guys need to. But if my captain is not setting an example, why should they?

  • Comment 30, posted at 05.03.12 09:30:32 by VanWilder Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 25) : Was it someone else I was watching throw in then…Sharks didnt win half their lineouts. Watch the replay if you can and see how slowly Bissie throws the ball in compared to Liebenberg and other hookers. That is why teams are able to compete against our lineout easily. At the moment Chilliboy is the best hooker in the country based on form.

  • Comment 31, posted at 05.03.12 09:31:02 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 31) : the only lineouts we lost were when Skeate was in the sinbin…

  • Comment 32, posted at 05.03.12 09:33:05 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Sharksmad – The Blog’s Dudette (Comment 28) : agree, that was a shocking call. But that was on attack in the Stormers half. We can’t ignore his blatant indiscretion in our own 22

  • Comment 33, posted at 05.03.12 09:33:41 by robdylan Reply
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  • @VanWilder (Comment 27) : I remember when I first joined this site Keegan was referred to as “yellow card Keegan” then he cleaned up his act and he even made a Bok call up. I wasn’t sure on him as Captain but now it seems as our Captain his game is becoming ill disciplined once again :( . In that Bissie is just as bad!

  • Comment 34, posted at 05.03.12 09:33:45 by Sharksmad - The Blog's Dudette Reply

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  • Quick question, when Skeate went off his feet, over the ruck, covering the ball, (the yellow card offense) had any Sharks player been warned about that type of play? Also, shouldn’t the first offense be penalised? Because I saw two tacklers laying on the ground, holding for dear life! Skeate was clearing one of them out when he went down.

  • Comment 35, posted at 05.03.12 09:41:58 by Die Kriek Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 32) : thank you I was starting to think that I had been watching the wrong game :) I also thought our lineouts went well especially against giraffe and wunderkind Estebeth :)

    @robdylan (Comment 33) : agreed!

  • Comment 36, posted at 05.03.12 09:42:49 by Sharksmad - The Blog's Dudette Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 33) : Any update on the alberts situation, will he be back this w-end?

  • Comment 37, posted at 05.03.12 09:44:34 by RuckingFun Reply

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  • @Die Kriek (Comment 35) : problem was, Skeate had just been penalised at the last movement too…

    But I think you’re right… the Sharks weren’t on a “team warning” for killing the ball. Then again, the ref did state that he was going to the pocket because of where it was on the field, not necessarily because of prior infringements.

    Very little consistency, though, if you consider that the Stormers were allowed to give away 3 offside penalties on their line in the first half with no card.

  • Comment 38, posted at 05.03.12 09:44:45 by robdylan Reply
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  • @RuckingFun (Comment 37) : dunno, but I assume he will

  • Comment 39, posted at 05.03.12 09:46:33 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Sharksmad – The Blog’s Dudette (Comment 34) : his al-round game is quite good IMO, but if i`m a mananger, and i keep pitching up at work drunk, i cant expect the rest of the guys to listen to me when i repremand them for the same offence.

    Im not having a go at Keegan the person, i feel he`s a great player, but he`s just not featuring in the Captain department for me. I did not see him once having a go at the players for giving away silly penalties in either the Bulls or stormers games.

  • Comment 40, posted at 05.03.12 09:48:45 by VanWilder Reply

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  • Just an aside on the penalties…the commentators made the point during the game and ive noticed it a lot in the last year, teams seem to get penalised at the breakdown a lot more when they are on attack than when defending. Yes the Sharks gave away a few silly penalites on defense as they always do but the vast majority of the penalties against the Sharks were when they were on attack. Now surely the IRB needs to look at that! Surely the interpretation has to be in favour of the attacking team??

  • Comment 41, posted at 05.03.12 09:55:47 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 41) : i dont agree. If you take other teams, they manage to stay on their feet after cleaning a ruck. Take the Bulls for example, they did it perfectly against the Cheetahs.

  • Comment 42, posted at 05.03.12 10:03:48 by VanWilder Reply

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  • Ai! :sad:

  • Comment 43, posted at 05.03.12 10:22:03 by JarsonX Reply
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  • An area that concerns me at the moment is our inabilty to cope with the high ball whether its an up and under or from the kick off, i mean there was even a kick on saturday that no one even competed for. although there were sharks players all around, it was left for Gio Aplon to take without a hand even being laid on him. How many kick offs are we immediately under pressure, ultimately giving away a penalty, yet our own kick offs are so deep we never get to apply pressure on the opposition and the ball is duly returned to our own half and we start to play from there again, surely this is something the coaching staff should be picking up and dealing with ?

  • Comment 44, posted at 05.03.12 10:26:18 by SharkED Reply

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  • @VanWilder (Comment 42) : I think the Bulls game is more the exception than the norm if u look at games over the weekend in Super rugby and 6 Nations. Yes obviously guys cleaning need to stay on their feet but sometimes it is just not possible and is not done delibrately but is just a result of the contact and it doesnt really affect the outcome of the breakdown. I just feel refs need to think before the apply the letter of the law and see whether the players action influence the outcome of the ruck/maul or not.

  • Comment 45, posted at 05.03.12 10:37:42 by SheldonK Reply

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  • Can’t really argue with any of the ratings. I thought Bismarck was great on the deck. Constantly stifled the opposition’s momentum and really seemed to get into their heads. Would like to see McLeod given a start in the next game.

    Really want to see more unpredictability from the Sharks on attack (not just referring to the backline here). I suspect we spread the ball wide far too quickly. Hopefully we’ll see improvements in the coming games.

  • Comment 46, posted at 05.03.12 10:53:22 by vanmartin Reply
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  • Marcell had a brilliant game and it feels a bit unfair that he knocked on the ball loosing the Sharks’ last possession :|

  • Comment 47, posted at 05.03.12 10:58:15 by rekinek Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 10) : no Rob I agree I am just angry this morning, and I couldn’t offer him Bissie he isn’t from the EC. Believe me I am just as mad at Bissie! You would have noticed that I did call for his demotion from captain too :oops:

  • Comment 48, posted at 05.03.12 10:59:06 by Sharksmad - The Blog's Dudette Reply

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  • One of those games. I really wonder how we lost despite the Stormers (especially Joe Peterse’) best efforts to keep us in the game :roll: Once again penalty count but also the inability to utilise the possession dominance. Is Stormers’ defence really that good?

  • Comment 49, posted at 05.03.12 11:00:50 by rekinek Reply
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  • @rekinek (Comment 47) : Likewise for Keegans indiscretion, he had a really good game until that point.
    Marcel Coetzee though was head and shoulders ahead of anyone on the pitch. It really pissed me off to see Nick Koster getting the MOM awardl, I can only assume it was that WP biased Mathew Pearce thatmade the judgement. Shamful.

  • Comment 50, posted at 05.03.12 11:23:06 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • All the points in this game were scored by KZN boytjies.

  • Comment 51, posted at 05.03.12 11:24:34 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @Salmonoid (Comment 50) : It’s round two and already Koster has been touted as a bok number 8 this year.

    Well he got the man of the match because it’s simple he is the Bishops wonderkind the press in the cape expect Koster to be the new Ninzan Brooke.

    You know how the media in the cape is bro. ;-)

  • Comment 52, posted at 05.03.12 11:27:43 by Muzi Reply

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  • @rekinek (Comment 49) : Well it is the same defence that the Boks use. At least the Sharks did try to counter it (the rush) by trying chip and grubber kicks which unfortunately did not come off. On another day, one, or some of them could have worked.

  • Comment 53, posted at 05.03.12 11:28:15 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @Muzi (Comment 52) : Damn unfair to the guy that played his heart out and played bloody well while doing it.

  • Comment 54, posted at 05.03.12 11:30:36 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @Sharksmad – The Blog’s Dudette (Comment 48) : great I battled to post this comment now it posts in the wrong thread :oops:

  • Comment 55, posted at 05.03.12 11:37:40 by Sharksmad - The Blog's Dudette Reply

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  • Agree with most of the ratings…
    Marcell had a brilliant game so he definitely deserves his 8!

    But Keegs should get two points deducted for discipline issues, and not setting the right example! Cmon.. The other guys have to respect him, and then he goes and gives away silly penalties.

    Bismarck had a good game, best he played in a while, but still discipline is a big concern. For the vice-captain also not a good example.

    I think our line-outs and scrums did alright, until late in the second half where they started dominating those aspects.

  • Comment 56, posted at 05.03.12 13:05:14 by SharksRTB Reply

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  • @SharksRTB (Comment 56) : Agree regarding Keegan.

    I get the feeling sometimes that the sharks are playing without a captain on the field.
    How I miss John Smit.

  • Comment 57, posted at 05.03.12 13:14:59 by Original Pierre Reply
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  • Sorry guys, excuse my confusion, but who is Craig Burden…
    My Stormers mates were ragging me about a “Springbok” prop who they call Tannie Du Plessis. They say is overrated and the new meisie in rugby… Unfortunately his performance didn’t help the cause and I endured 80 minutes of agony…
    If Joe Pietersen had landed his penalties – different scoreboard folks. Discipline is a concern. We haven’t leaked any tries yet, this has to be a positive, and we looked far more composed – and had we not been shagged at the breakdown, more momentum wouldve come our way.

  • Comment 58, posted at 05.03.12 14:10:20 by DarkDestroyer Reply

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  • @DarkDestroyer (Comment 58) : U being serious about Burden?

  • Comment 59, posted at 05.03.12 14:24:27 by Ice Reply
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  • @Ice (Comment 59) : definitely a little sarcastic with that one… Feel for him, imagine how Hadebe and Kyle Cooper must feel – the dark shadow of hooking superstars… But that’s the game. Burden still earns 46000 per “game”

  • Comment 60, posted at 05.03.12 14:40:03 by DarkDestroyer Reply

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  • @DarkDestroyer (Comment 58) : Darkdestroyer = Plumtree !! :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

    How else do we explain Burden`s continued absence in spite of all the penalties Bismarck concede?
    Maybe his rulebook fell in the Dam Dam ? :mrgreen:

  • Comment 61, posted at 05.03.12 14:47:47 by Original Pierre Reply
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  • @DarkDestroyer (Comment 60) : Phew! :lol:

  • Comment 62, posted at 05.03.12 14:53:57 by Ice Reply
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  • :twisted: Eish! It was gut wrenching to see us lose another game that we should have won. It was not that we played badly but we played as a team in the first half and fell of the cart in the second when everyone seemed to play for TV status. I agree with most of the ratings but would give Skeate a lot less for costing us the game. We lost this game because of ILL DISCIPLINE. I would have liked to know if there is a definite call on chastising players within the Shark’s structure when the blatantly do ignorant stuff to the likes of Skeate and Herbst?
    I failed to see Daniel or Bisi getting in those guys faces and bringing the team back to order? I just need to vent this!!!
    As for Pat, he is now going through the dip which all flyhalfs go through. If he pulls himself out (mentally) he will be great. Thanks, i feel a bit better!:twisted:

  • Comment 63, posted at 05.03.12 15:23:33 by KILLER SHARK Reply
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  • I have seen in a few blogs now how many ppl are saying that JPP should be back at wing where he has more space and time. I don’t get this … him being on the right wing for the Sharks always provides him with loads of time – to stand around watching the game. Sharks play doesn’t invariably get to the right wing anyway – so I reckon seeing him at centre and giving him as much ball as possible is the way fwd. His footwork is outstanding, great pace, straightens the line – by far our best attacking midfielder. Defence organisation will come with experience. But still no-one got past him. Our alternative is to go back to Bosman/Joubert midfield!! OH NO!!
    Jordaan is too small and light for midfield at present so keep JPP there and bring Ndungane/Sithole into wing. Ludik is not a wing in my opinion – too slow and not enough footwork to beat someone one-on-one.

  • Comment 64, posted at 05.03.12 18:38:36 by Sharks_UK Reply
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  • @Sharks_UK (Comment 64) :
    Agree! And at 102kg, JPP is big enough to break through tackles too – big hand-off on Habana on Saturday.

  • Comment 65, posted at 05.03.12 18:44:52 by Big Fish Reply
    Author
    Big FishAssistant coach
     
  • @Sharks_UK (Comment 64) :

    Agreed, JPP needs to be closer to the ball to have a bigger impact on the game.

    And his defence has been good so far.

  • Comment 66, posted at 05.03.12 18:57:51 by Richard Ferguson Reply
    Friend of SharksworldCompetition Winner Administrator
    Richard FergusonCoach
     
  • @Richard Ferguson (Comment 66) : there was literally only one occasion where de Jongh got right past him… only to be properly nailed by Bosman a split second alter.

  • Comment 67, posted at 05.03.12 19:14:10 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • You know sometimes I feel hendrikp comes across for a bit of unfair criticism on here. While he did point out that Nick Koster might be the leading candidate to take the Bok no.8,am sure he didn’t mean that Koster was all but guaranteed the Bok no.8 jersey,he was merely pointing out that Nick in that game potrayed all the attributes that in all probability would be required of the Bok 1st choice 8thman. While this certainly is a Sharks website,we don’t always expect objectivity from the bloggers,Marcell was probably the best player on the field,the general rule is always give the best player from the winning side the MotM award,unless the best on the losing side was so exceptional that overlooking him would not be justified despite his side losing,which I feel simply was not the case on Saturday. Koster was right up there with Marcell,so please get over it people and taking cheap shots at Koster just to make your points is rather childish and unneccesary.

  • Comment 68, posted at 05.03.12 19:29:40 by Ludz Reply

    LudzSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 68) : Seriously….?

  • Comment 69, posted at 05.03.12 19:40:42 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • @Ice (Comment 69) : what more can I say to get the point across?

  • Comment 70, posted at 05.03.12 19:53:20 by Ludz Reply

    LudzSuper Rugby player
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 67) :

    Bosman has certainly worked on his defence!!

  • Comment 71, posted at 05.03.12 19:54:25 by Richard Ferguson Reply
    Friend of SharksworldCompetition Winner Administrator
    Richard FergusonCoach
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 70) : I have seen before that the losing team gets MOTM…and I guess you are in a way right…I simply do not think Koster was better than Marcell, being in the winning team or not. But yeah, being SW, I guess you can call me bias..

  • Comment 72, posted at 05.03.12 20:03:02 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • @Richard Ferguson (Comment 71) : Bosman is slowly becoming one of my dependants…

  • Comment 73, posted at 05.03.12 20:05:19 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • @Ice (Comment 73) : Slow down Ice.
    Bosman had his year in which we won nothing, give Whitehead the same chance, he won`t disappoint. ;-)

  • Comment 74, posted at 05.03.12 20:20:54 by Original Pierre Reply
    Author
    Original PierreSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Ice,Koster certainly wasn’t better,while I feel Marcell Coetzee was the best player,Koster wasn’t far behind. Actually like Sharksworld because of the bias on here,it’s enjoyable arguing with you guys on here,but some people were starting to sound ridiculous with everyone bashing Nick Koster labelling him as overrated.

  • Comment 75, posted at 05.03.12 20:28:55 by Ludz Reply

    LudzSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 75) : Ok – I wont go as far though! ;-)

  • Comment 76, posted at 05.03.12 20:50:38 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • @Original Pierre (Comment 74) : Its MARCH dude, what were we suppose to win? :mrgreen:

  • Comment 77, posted at 05.03.12 20:55:33 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 68) :
    Help me understand this statement:
    ” While he did point out that Nick Koster might be the leading candidate to take the Bok no.8″.

    Leading candidate for the no 8 jersey? Based on what? 2 solid games after years of being on the fringes of provincial selection?

    SW IS a Sharks site, and it is natural that the bias to the Sharks runs very strong here, but please disavow yourselves of this delusion that you guys represent the views of the objective here, because it clearly isnt the case.

    If you want healthy debate, then by all mean, do engage. But don’t expect any firmly held opinion to be treated as gospel just because you REALLY BELIEVE in what you are posting.

  • Comment 78, posted at 05.03.12 22:25:11 by Big Fish Reply
    Author
    Big FishAssistant coach
     
  • Really I didn’t say he was all but guaranteed a Bok spot at 8,just as I said if you would read my post,that he potrayed all attributes that would in all probability be required of the Bok 8thman. By all means stick to your Sharks bias,actually doesn’t bother me,but the constant attacks on Koster are uncalled for and are utterly childish. So please don’t give me that crap that we think we the objective few here,we knew that we were signing up on Sharksworld and there are plenty objective Shark fans on the site.

  • Comment 79, posted at 06.03.12 01:01:31 by Ludz Reply

    LudzSuper Rugby player
     
  • wtf?
    Do I read a debate about Nick Koster and some other dude and the Bok number-8?

    Get real.

    There are Burger and Smith and Brussouw and Alberts and Spies and there are only 3 places.

    Then there are about half a dozen dudes playing in Europe.

    Then there are about another half a dozen locals. Some who have been Boks before and some with wild facial hair.

    Then we have Koster.

  • Comment 80, posted at 06.03.12 02:10:21 by fyndraai Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    fyndraaiTeam captain
     
  • This is the kind of bullshit I’m talking about,people bashing the poor lad,no one said he would come into the Bok picture,but what was merely pointed out is that if you were to select a Bok 8thman tommorrow and you were looking for all those attributes hendrikp was talking about earlier,you would look no further than Koster,particularly if you saw the way he played on Saturday. While Nick Koster was in matric,he was a schoolboy extraordinaire,hell I knew about him and I was just a grade 8 boy in Queenstown. When he was selected for SA Schools no one was surprised,I having watched him for WP at Craven Week thought he’d be a Bok within two years of leaving schoolboy,he was just that good. To this day I am yet to see an 8thman as good as Koster was as a schoolboy. Koster deserved all the plaudits he got as a schoolboy and naturally we all had our expectation of him,so call him overrated if you want,but he was too good as a schoolboy to go unnoticed and not be hailed as the next big thing. Injuries have hampered his progress in the game,but if he were to touch the ceiling of the potential he showed as a schoolboy,he’d probably be the best 8thman in world rugby

  • Comment 81, posted at 06.03.12 03:17:06 by Ludz Reply

    LudzSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 81) : that’s just the thing though, lad… for every one player who “touches the ceiling of the potential they show as a schoolboy” there are about 100 who don’t. Hence the general reluctance here to accept that *any* player, regardless of school or province, is a “definite Bok” based on school or junior rugby credentials. There’s a much bigger pudding that needs to be eaten first.

    I will stick my neck out and say that I don’t feel Koster, on the whole, has made a great fist of his opportunities in senior rugby.

  • Comment 82, posted at 06.03.12 06:21:45 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @Ice (Comment 73) : :shock: Does your husband know that you are adopting him? Or are you guys only taking over gaurdianship.

  • Comment 83, posted at 06.03.12 07:20:02 by KSA Shark © Reply

    KSA Shark ©Head Coach
     
  • :lol: at this thread in general. :grin:

  • Comment 84, posted at 06.03.12 07:24:53 by KSA Shark © Reply

    KSA Shark ©Head Coach
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 68) :

    People are going to leave themselves open for critizism when a player is touted as a Bok as a matter of fact.
    Ive been watching rugby long enough to know that a couple of games hell in some cases even 1 good season does not make a Bok.

    I remember when Koster came onto the scene ..sure he is talented but so are many other players that have been around. Rassie playing him on the wing stunted his growth as a forward imo.

    The list is VERY long of young players showing promise and NEVER getting a Bok call.

  • Comment 85, posted at 06.03.12 07:40:17 by csb Reply

    csbSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 79) :
    Did you read the quotation I put in there just for you? “Leading candidate”? I asked you to explain how Koster became the leading candidate; nothing mentioned about a “all but guaranteed a Bok spot”.

    Calm down and give it a think.

    @Ludz (Comment 81) :
    @robdylan (Comment 82) :
    Exactly. People like Koster, Lobberts etc should be a sober example of why you don’t go around proclaiming each junior star aa the next great Bok.

  • Comment 86, posted at 06.03.12 07:42:37 by Big Fish Reply
    Author
    Big FishAssistant coach
     
  • To me it’s simple.

    Did a lot of people rate Koster to be the next big thing or to be a Bok by now? ……. Yes.

    Has he achieved that?…….. No.

    So by regular logic he has been overrated.

    Simple really, but then unfortunately there is nothing common about common sense. :wink:

  • Comment 87, posted at 06.03.12 07:47:28 by KSA Shark © Reply

    KSA Shark ©Head Coach
     
  • man, this is frustrating… ever since the demise of ruggastats, thre simply isn’t anywhere on the web you can get even basic statistical information about things like who gave away penalties…

  • Comment 88, posted at 06.03.12 07:56:57 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 87) : succinct, oubaas… I like it :)

  • Comment 89, posted at 06.03.12 07:57:19 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 88) : rugbystats.com.au

  • Comment 90, posted at 06.03.12 07:58:41 by KSA Shark © Reply

    KSA Shark ©Head Coach
     
  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 83) : Players I can depend on.. :lol:

  • Comment 91, posted at 06.03.12 08:00:22 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 90) : This is one for Rich.

    Not sure of the link now but if you go to the official SR website on the left there is a link to Foxsport stats or somerhing similar and they give some “non-regular” stats there that make for some interesting reading.

  • Comment 92, posted at 06.03.12 08:02:04 by KSA Shark © Reply

    KSA Shark ©Head Coach
     
  • @Ice (Comment 91) : Oh you mean “dependables”. (as in staatmaakers) :wink:

  • Comment 93, posted at 06.03.12 08:03:53 by KSA Shark © Reply

    KSA Shark ©Head Coach
     
  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 90) : DUDE! That is awesome!

  • Comment 94, posted at 06.03.12 08:09:11 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 94) : That’s what I’ve been using all along I thought you knew.

    you won’t like their number for this past weekend. :wink: Daniel, Bismarck and Skeate gave away 3PKs each.

    Please remember that these are the guys who list Turnovers as bad things (giving the ball away) and Pilfers as good things (winning the ball) :)

  • Comment 95, posted at 06.03.12 08:13:59 by KSA Shark © Reply

    KSA Shark ©Head Coach
     
  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 95) : check again… Daniel only 1 penalty.

  • Comment 96, posted at 06.03.12 08:15:55 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 87) : The voice of reason cutting a clear path through the jumbled forest of emotion and hyperbole. Kudos to you, sir! :lol:

  • Comment 97, posted at 06.03.12 08:28:57 by Culling Song Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    Culling SongTeam captain
     
  • @Culling Song (Comment 97) :

    How’s the holiday CS?

  • Comment 98, posted at 06.03.12 08:38:53 by Pokkel Reply
    Friend of SharksworldCompetition Winner Author
    Assistant coach
     
  • @Pokkel (Comment 98) : Awesome! Kate’s even been sleeping later than usual, most mornings we’re only up at 06h30!

  • Comment 99, posted at 06.03.12 08:45:46 by Culling Song Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    Culling SongTeam captain
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 96) : Sorry Chadwick was the other to give away 3. :oops:

  • Comment 100, posted at 06.03.12 08:47:30 by KSA Shark © Reply

    KSA Shark ©Head Coach
     
  • @Culling Song (Comment 99) :

    :cool: :cool:

  • Comment 101, posted at 06.03.12 08:50:15 by Pokkel Reply
    Friend of SharksworldCompetition Winner Author
    Assistant coach
     
  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 93) : net daai een!

  • Comment 102, posted at 06.03.12 08:54:58 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • I just want to give my opinion on the whole Koster debacle. One thing is for certain. if Francois Louw was still playing for the stormers, Koster would have been playing off the bench. now that in itself doesnt justify a bok spot for him.

  • Comment 103, posted at 06.03.12 09:01:15 by VanWilder Reply

    VanWilderCurrie Cup player
     
  • @KSA Shark © (Comment 100) : ja…. I saw that

  • Comment 104, posted at 06.03.12 09:03:21 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 75) : who is Nick Koster? Surely not that kid from that Cape Town School whose lineout call was Koster, Koster, Koster 22…? If it is then that’s sad… That kid was overrated. Lived off the smoke blown up his arse… Surely not the same kid – if it is, watch him choke in a big match and throw an intercept pass or something…

  • Comment 105, posted at 06.03.12 11:34:38 by DarkDestroyer Reply

    RichardCurrie Cup player
     
  • @DarkDestroyer (Comment 105) : The big match has come and gone, Stormers won.

  • Comment 106, posted at 06.03.12 11:59:54 by Original Pierre Reply
    Author
    Original PierreSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Original Pierre (Comment 106) : ja, but who is Nick Koster ;-) Ludz; shame. But like all rugby fans the passion is there… Koster hasn’t played big rugby, when big names have played well against him. Far from a first choice for me, be interesting see him play a Sharks pack that was not so depleted. And my reference to the intercept was Nick’s pass against the ‘saders in semi last season… And the comment was totally said in jest OP.

  • Comment 107, posted at 06.03.12 13:10:29 by DarkDestroyer Reply

    RichardCurrie Cup player
     
  • Hang on now,

    I never said Koster was the leading candidate. Only said he will make his Springbok debut this season.

    And hey, he got off to a good start.

  • Comment 108, posted at 06.03.12 14:31:26 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 68) :

    Generally get my head bitten off if I suggest anything that some supporters here don’t agree with… heck there is even a running joke now about me saying the Stormers had more ‘Super 15 ready’ loose-forwards (or the term I used being depth). KSA Shark to this day holds a grudge.

    Or suggesting Coenie is any good has resulted in Rob labelling me a fool.

    Or saying the Sharks would finish 3rd among SA teams, or lose to the Bulls in Round 1 (early season, but they look destined for 3rd no?) had a few jumping in telling me I’m just a kid who knows nothing.

    Take it all in stride, have a bit of a laugh.

    And then Rob decides to take it up a notch. Oh well.

    I’ll just stay away from the petty insults thank you very much :mrgreen:

  • Comment 109, posted at 06.03.12 14:38:09 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • Lets be real – the Bok coach is Hyneke Meyer not PDV or Rudolf Stauli… Pierre Spies will be the Bok 8, Morne Steyn the Bok 10 with Hougaard the Bok 9. Its as simple as that folks…

  • Comment 110, posted at 06.03.12 14:41:59 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 110) :

    Fourie du Preez will be the Bok 9. It’s a done deal.

  • Comment 111, posted at 06.03.12 14:43:02 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 111) : If Meyer gives it to him, he’s a stupid fool. There is no better scrummie in SA than Hougaard..

  • Comment 112, posted at 06.03.12 14:49:31 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • I have no idea why people are waxing lyrical over the wonderkind Koster as a bok number 8 :roll:

    Heyneke Meyer will select Albers,Burger,Spies,Marcell,Arno and CJ before this guy.

    The Koster fan club needs to take chill i wonder how Koster would have looked against alberts,and Deysel..just saying.

  • Comment 113, posted at 06.03.12 14:51:00 by Muzi Reply

    MuziVodacom Cup player
     
  • @Ice (Comment 112) :

    Can’t agree with that. Hougaard gives his all, and he’s a better ball carrier yes.

    But Fourie du Preez is a tactical genuis. Has IMO been the best player in the world over the last 4 years.

    And he’s not as bad elsewhere as people make out either.

    Heck if he’d held onto the ball against Australia instead of dropping it over the line, would we be having this discussion?

    I wouldn’t be willing to end the career of probably the best scrumhalf ever, or at least best to ever play for the Springboks (yes, he’s better then Joost) for a knock-on.

  • Comment 114, posted at 06.03.12 14:52:43 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 113) :

    How many Super rugby games has Arno Botha played?

    CJ Stander has 2 appearances off the bench.

    Come on muzi, I expect more from you.

    Stand back for a minute, then think what does Koster have or not have? Yes, he’s taken some time to mature, and I’m not suggesting he’s the finished article, but he’s got the right attributes to make a big impact as a number-8.

  • Comment 115, posted at 06.03.12 14:55:50 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikpCurrie Cup player
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 113) : Koster didn’t even look particularly good against Marcell Coetzee…

  • Comment 116, posted at 06.03.12 15:02:39 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • I would’nt be surprised if Marcell,Carr and Botha become better number 8′s than that kid Koster.

    The cape media screwed up with Koster hyping the poor kid up since grade 3.

  • Comment 117, posted at 06.03.12 15:04:17 by Muzi Reply

    MuziVodacom Cup player
     
  • @DarkDestroyer (Comment 107) : Sorry man, didn`t go through the whole thread. I tend to skip things regarding the stormers from time to time. :lol:

  • Comment 118, posted at 06.03.12 15:06:45 by Original Pierre Reply
    Author
    Original PierreSuper Rugby player
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 116) : Marcell Coetzee is the best junior number 8 in this country he has everything height,skills,grunt,power,speed.

    Arno Botha yes he is friggin huge but last year in the under 20 world cup he lacked vision and skills to be a complete number 8 he struggled to link up with the backs.

    Stander is impressive BUT i struggle to see why Bulls supporters are in love with the guy he lacks height and he has a tendancy to run straight at players one day someone will nail the shit out of him then he will learn to run into space.

    Koster is well koster i mean like the cape media said he is the next great thing sigh… :roll:

  • Comment 119, posted at 06.03.12 15:11:18 by Muzi Reply

    MuziVodacom Cup player
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 116) :

    Generally young Bulls number 8′s like arno and cj are programmed :mrgreen: to use speed,power and brute force to go over the gainline.

    Coetzee and Carr are your modern day number 8′ they have power,speed,brute force and a rugby brain.

    That is what spies,botha and stander do not have a rugby brain.

  • Comment 120, posted at 06.03.12 15:17:50 by Muzi Reply

    MuziVodacom Cup player
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 120) : Muzi, did you know that the Bulls didn’t want Marcell so he went and signed with the Sharks.

  • Comment 121, posted at 06.03.12 15:55:15 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • Nope :evil: i thought he signed for the sharks straight after school

  • Comment 122, posted at 06.03.12 15:58:12 by Muzi Reply

    MuziVodacom Cup player
     
  • For what it’s worth I enjoy your opinions,don’t agree with all,but they are generally well thought out and are backed up with great technical knowledge

  • Comment 123, posted at 06.03.12 16:05:30 by Ludz Reply

    LudzSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 122) : He went to the Bulls 1st. They said no thanks so he went to the sharks. Last year Meyer phoned him and said he wants him. So Marcell said its too late now. They didn’t want him back then so they can’t have him now. He was a Bulls supporter in his younger days.

  • Comment 124, posted at 06.03.12 16:05:37 by Ben Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Author
    BenAssistant coach
     
  • @Ben (Comment 124) : But a thorougbred Shark now! :grin:

  • Comment 125, posted at 06.03.12 16:10:17 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner IceAssistant coach
     
  • @Ice (Comment 125) : Well untill Deysel and Alberts comes back at least. :twisted:

  • Comment 126, posted at 06.03.12 16:12:18 by Original Pierre Reply
    Author
    Original PierreSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Original Pierre (Comment 126) : geez spoiler alert guy haha

  • Comment 127, posted at 06.03.12 16:24:01 by Muzi Reply

    MuziVodacom Cup player
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 127) : :evil:

  • Comment 128, posted at 06.03.12 16:27:37 by Muzi Reply

    MuziVodacom Cup player
     

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