robdylan

Boks v England – player ratings


Written by Rob Otto (robdylan)

Posted in :Original Content, Springboks on 26 Nov 2012 at 10:33
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It wasn’t a great day at the office for the Boks, but at the end of it, they still did enough to hand England a defeat and finish the tour unbeaten. Let’s rate the individuals, giving some credit for the ridiculously long season they’ve endured.

1. Gurthro Steenkamp. His end of the scrum seemed to be a little more stable than the other, but it’s really splitting hairs. The Boks battled up-front in this test. Steenkamp’s defence was improved, though. 6/10
2. Adriaan Strauss. Another strong showing, particularly in the lineouts. 6/10
3. Jannie du Plessis. The doc came into the game with an injury and battled to hold his ground at scrum time. Perhaps a game too far? 5/10
4. Eben Etzebeth. Good (or rather great) in the lineouts, but appeared to take a step back physically against the English pack. 7/10
5. Juandre Kruger. Appeared disinterested for the first quarter of the match, before finding an extra gear and going to to contribute manfully, particularly no defence. 6/10
6. Francois Louw. A quiet game, marked more by plenty of tackles than by any meaningful work at the breakdown. 6/10
7. Willem Alberts. A huge contribution, with big tackles regularly driving the English back. The try was just gravy. 8/10
8. Duane Vermeulen. Anonymous in the first half, but came into his own in the second, with some great work on defence key to holding the English out late in the game. 7/10

9. Ruan Pienaar. Too many mistakes, but must be given credit for taking so much of the pressure on himself. 5/10
10. Pat Lambie. Composed and assured, he made all his tackles, kicked all his goals and also looked to vary play with a range of interesting kicks. 8/10
11. Francois Hougaard. His best game at wing for some time and showed what a battler he is, even played out of his natural position. 6/10
12. Jean de Villiers. Not a day in which the centres had much to do, but Jean kept the opposition busy and also led the troops well. 6/10
13. Juan de Jongh. Had nothing to do other than catch a cold. 5/10
14. JP Pietersen. A superb game from the world’s best winger, who showed that a complete wing needs to be a factor both with and without the ball. 7/10
15. Zane Kirchner. A very solid performance in atrocious conditions, with just one unfortunate knock-on blotting an otherwise outstanding copybook. 7/10

16. Schalk Brits. Not long enough to be rated.
17. Heinke van der Merwe. A decent cameo, with a good showing in the scrums despite being penalised once. 6/10
18. Pat Cilliers. The Bok scrum was much stronger in the second half, with Cilliers’ better fitness proving key in keeping Corbisiero and Vunipolo quiet. His best test showing yet. 7/10
19. Flip van der Merwe. Looked very eager and managed to control his discipline, albeit for only 10 minutes. 6/10
20. Marcell Coetzee. Huge defence, same as always. A big contribution towards the end when it was most needed. 7/10
21. Elton Janjties. Unused
22. Jaco Taute. Unused
23. Lwazi Mvovo. Unused



58 Comments

  • Congrats to the Boks! It was a hard-fought game in front of a very vocal crowd in tough conditions with a pretty average reffing performance. I’ll take the one point win!

  • Comment 1, posted at 26.11.12 10:47:08 by vanmartin Reply
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  • I would say that one break by tuilagi should have been Lambie’s tackle and he was handed of, so he missed the one tackle. But otherwise I agree, a very good game from Lambie, especially in the second half when Ruan gave him the ball a few more times.

    In the first half he got the ball 9 times.

  • Comment 2, posted at 26.11.12 10:48:17 by Letgo Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 1) : Average is a generous rating for the ref.

  • Comment 3, posted at 26.11.12 10:49:15 by Letgo Reply
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  • 5 is really generous to Ruan who in my opinion had one of his worse games for the Boks. I think SA scrumhalves need to get over the FdP impersonations, and play their own game.

  • Comment 4, posted at 26.11.12 11:08:09 by Bokhoring Reply
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  • @Bokhoring (Comment 4) : strangely enough, the English coaching staff were full of praise for Ruan and in their view, at least, he was one of the prime architects of the Bok victory.

    I didn’t see it that way myself and also thought he was poor, but it’s just interesting.

  • Comment 5, posted at 26.11.12 11:16:57 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Bokhoring (Comment 4) :

    I’m hoping the likes of Groom, Hougaard, Reinach and Van Zyl really stop up during next year’s SR tourney!

  • Comment 6, posted at 26.11.12 11:35:12 by wpw Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 6) : and the Kings scrummie too, whoever he is :)

  • Comment 7, posted at 26.11.12 11:45:01 by robdylan Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 6) : Hopefully the Stormers give Groom more opportunities, and do not stick with Duvenhage again

  • Comment 8, posted at 26.11.12 11:46:12 by Bokhoring Reply
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  • Problem in SA is that for years now the scrumhalf has been the decision maker in the team. What the Boks need is to shift the decision making to the flyhalf(unless Morné plays) and just get a scrmmie that gets the ball to the flyhalf fast. The flyhalf must then decide whether to play back towards the forwards, kick or use the backline.

  • Comment 9, posted at 26.11.12 11:50:29 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 9) : Yip – the scrumhalf with his head down to pick up the ball is hardly the right person to sum up the field of play

  • Comment 10, posted at 26.11.12 11:52:01 by Bokhoring Reply
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  • Pienaar shouldn’t take soo much responsibility on himself. That first kick that was charged down could have been given to Lambie. I know Pienaar is more seniour but Lambie has nerves of steel. It just (to me) seems like not trusting Lambie with a clearance kick is a slap in his face.

  • Comment 11, posted at 26.11.12 11:53:30 by The Sharks Sharkie Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 5) :
    nothing strange in it. It,s quite obvious that Ruan was targetted by England. They made changes to the personel to nulify his strength. See http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2012/nov/22/england-south-africa-rugby-international
    Whenever I watched British tv Ruan was considered as the key player for Springboks and their brain, one of the best tacticians in rugby,When guys like Will Greenwood, Shaun Edwards, Robinson , Eddie Butler are Pienaar’s fans he must be the real deal. Even Stuart Barnes , who changes his mind depending on who actually wins) wrote that Ruan has more cell brains than the whole English backline combined. :lol:
    Only in SA Ruan is underrated. He is falsely considered as slow while the truth is he has so much time on the ball because he is so good and it looks like he is slow.

  • Comment 12, posted at 26.11.12 12:10:29 by tedanica Reply
     
  • Duane Vermeulen, best 8thman we’ve had since Danie Rossouw played 8 at the 2007 World Cup

  • Comment 13, posted at 26.11.12 12:39:47 by Ludz Reply

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  • @Ludz (Comment 13) : shows the extent to which our respective number 8s have underwhelmed.

  • Comment 14, posted at 26.11.12 12:47:37 by robdylan Reply
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  • My opinion on Ruan, he did well in the previous two tests he did what you would expect from a senior player, to take control and take pressure off your flyhalf, Pienaar is probably better suited to play with MS, Lambie needs quicker ball Hougaard would be a better option.

    Lambie showed HM on sat that he can think for himself on the field. Let’s hope hell get more opportunity next year.

  • Comment 15, posted at 26.11.12 12:53:33 by pierre_mackie Reply
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  • Firstly I think Nigel Owen’s management of the breakdown was shocking and I hope he was taken to task by the IRB ref panel as the laws of the rucks seem to be a free for all. It seems that as long as you are on ur feet you can stick ur hand in the ruck and pull the ball out! WTF!
    I thought the Bok forwards were pretty good again, they werent helped by the ref though. Scrums are still messy and I dont think we have our timing sorted out with the new calls.
    As for the Bok backline..there was a 15min patch in the 2nd half that I thought JDV and DeJong had left the field, didnt notice them do anything. I cant lay all the blame on DeJong though as JDV seems to have forgotten how to pass the ball??? If JDV isnt going to pass then we may as well play Alberts at 12!

  • Comment 16, posted at 26.11.12 12:54:54 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @tedanica (Comment 12) : I have a concern about the accuracy of Pienaar’s passing. The majority of his passes in the last two games seem too high and are on the player instead of in front of him. Makes it difficult for the player to run onto the ball and ultimately robs the backline of momentum. Having said that, I think Pienaar’s still the best kicking 9 we have available to us at the moment and thus best suited to the game Meyer wants the Boks to play.

  • Comment 17, posted at 26.11.12 13:33:37 by vanmartin Reply
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  • Maybe inaccuracy of passing depends on the recievers? Playing for Ulster Ruan passes quite deep behind the gainline as players run onto the ball with high speed and often skipasses the nearest player. I sometimes have got impression that there is not always good understanding the pattern play between Boks , in Scotland bok mates ran too flat thus Ruan,s ball were behind them and in England game Ruan gave flatter passes as a result.

  • Comment 18, posted at 26.11.12 13:54:33 by tedanica Reply
     
  • @tedanica (Comment 18) : Only too a degree. A scrummie learns to anticipate where players will run to and pass the ball into that space as a result. It also doesn’t explain why so many of his passes were too high.

  • Comment 19, posted at 26.11.12 14:18:20 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 19) : Honestly I prefer Ruan at flyhalf than at scrumhalf ,I love watching him playing at 10 and for me he should have stayed there. He is so good with exploiting space nad moving things around. I don’t know why he prefers scrumhalf playing halfbent most of the time :roll:

  • Comment 20, posted at 26.11.12 14:33:06 by tedanica Reply
     
  • @tedanica (Comment 20) : Interesting! Earlier in his career (being a confidence player) I doubt he had the necessary maturity to play flyhalf but I wonder if those same opportunities were given to him now how he would perform? Definitely food for thought.

    P.S. I’m a Pienaar fan and I’m not looking to critisise him unnecessarily. I do however find the debate around his performances very interesting. I reckon he’s the sort of player that needs very specific coaching to unlock the best in him. Not too dissimilar from a player like Matt Giteau perhaps?

  • Comment 21, posted at 26.11.12 14:46:17 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 21) : That,s true I think he excells if he is given power and freedom to play his way and support of coaches and teammates . When he feels unloved and marginated he will not deliver. His best games fo Ulster and Boks were when he was given almost exclusively decion making power with kicking to lines and for goals. Thus he is not evrybody,s scrumhalf who just deliver balls to his flyhalf .He plays like a 9 and a half or a hybride between 9 and 10.
    I am curious how he finds himself in Ulster this year as they have a new young flyhalf nad a new coach and Ruan played only 3 full games this season for Ulster – in two as flyhalf.

  • Comment 22, posted at 26.11.12 15:12:09 by tedanica Reply
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 14) : yeah definitely, but he’s definitely going to grow into an even better 8thman now

  • Comment 23, posted at 26.11.12 15:19:41 by Ludz Reply

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  • @Letgo (Comment 2) : and this kick off straight into touch late in the game was a bit shaky, specially with English scrum being so dominant.
    Mallet was saying in one of the post-match commentaries with reference to Morne Steyn and various forwards standing in the flyhalf channel that flyhalf should impose himself and not let them take his ball, perhaps this could bear reference to Lambie too.
    Lambie had by far the best game in the 3 outings but I am not sure that it was enough to leapfrog Goosen.

  • Comment 24, posted at 26.11.12 15:30:35 by rekinek Reply
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  • @rekinek (Comment 24) : Goosen is certainly naturally very talented, but unless he has a better season injury wise I think Lambie still has a pretty good chance. Goosen had 3 injuries (2 quite serious) this year already – physically he may just not be up to top level rugby yet.

    I do actually feel sorry for Goosen – the typical SA savior complex has built a lot of hype around him. Problem is when he stuffs up, those same fans will turn on him and vilify him.

  • Comment 25, posted at 26.11.12 15:44:31 by Bokhoring Reply
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  • @Bokhoring (Comment 25) : Johan Goosen is turning into the heir to Gaffie du Toit’s throne…

  • Comment 26, posted at 26.11.12 15:56:13 by Culling Song Reply
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  • If Goosen is pushed into bok team next year he will be the next gaffie/chilliboy hybrid – no confidence for half of the season and injured for the other half. Pienaar was s l o w e r than a sloth on Saturday but then again no 9 in SA is faster. Almost all the 9′s in SA think they’re traffic officers waving their arms and bitching to the ref instead of passing the ball.

  • Comment 27, posted at 26.11.12 16:34:00 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 27) : Actually Groom, Van Zyl and Reinach (at times) provided snappy service. They all a bit young and inexperienced though.

  • Comment 28, posted at 26.11.12 16:52:02 by Bokhoring Reply
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  • @rekinek (Comment 24) :
    What happened to the rekinek from your avatar? :shock:

  • Comment 29, posted at 26.11.12 17:00:56 by tedanica Reply
     
  • @Bokhoring (Comment 25) : I guess as long as Goosen is injured he can’t do anything wrong :lol:

    @tedanica (Comment 29) : Rekinek will be back before Christmas, just needed to go through some diet before the next photo-shoot :mrgreen:
    I don’t suppose one will see much of Pienaar at 10 for Ulster for serious Heineken cup games.

  • Comment 30, posted at 26.11.12 18:02:34 by rekinek Reply
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  • Rekinek got porky ? :shock: :mrgreen:

  • Comment 31, posted at 26.11.12 20:16:07 by tedanica Reply
     
  • So you give the MOTM a 7 and Lambie an 8? Not biased at all Rob lol.

  • Comment 32, posted at 26.11.12 20:36:17 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 32) : how the fuck Duane got MOTM is beyond me.

  • Comment 33, posted at 27.11.12 00:48:35 by robdylan Reply
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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 32) : Why are you guys still surprised when we rate Lambie highly? You know that we know he’s the best thing to happen to Springbok rugby since Gary Teichman. ;-) :lol:

  • Comment 34, posted at 27.11.12 07:33:29 by FireTheLooser Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 33) : Never been a Duane fan and I dont think he had delivered in any games on tour ,he has contributed with a few poaches and thats all.

    In the final game vs NZ this year it was his poor defense that lead to a soft AB try. However he is much better than Spies and in those northern hemisphere fields he was probably the right choice…

  • Comment 35, posted at 27.11.12 11:13:54 by Talent Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 33) :

    Easy – it was awarded to the player who performed best during the match & not on whether he plays for the Sharks! :twisted:

  • Comment 36, posted at 27.11.12 11:20:46 by wpw Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 36) : and the fact that he plays for WP has nothing to do with your standing up for him? Pot/kettle etc.

  • Comment 37, posted at 27.11.12 11:57:48 by robdylan Reply
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  • Not a Vermeulen fan, never was, and doubt ever will be, but I also called him for man of the match award.

  • Comment 38, posted at 27.11.12 12:05:12 by Salmonoid Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 37) :

    Not at all Rob.

    I honestly thought he had his best game yet for the Boks on Saturday and I guess the MOTM adjudicator agrees! :twisted:

  • Comment 39, posted at 27.11.12 12:55:59 by wpw Reply
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  • @wpw (Comment 39) : I have to admit to not being a big Duane fan, but having him at 8th man for the Bokke has been a breath of fresh air; he may be half the athlete that Pierre Spies is, but he’s twice the player. He also combines well with Flo, which is an added bonus. Saw too little of the game to give an opinion on the MOTM award, but unless someone like Kanko makes a compelling case through his standard of play next year, I would stick with quasi-metrosexual Vermeulen

  • Comment 40, posted at 27.11.12 13:09:30 by Culling Song Reply
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  • Duane has been good for Boks, better than anything Spies or Kanko or any 8thman has done over the last 4 odd years

    Shark or not give the oke his dues

  • Comment 41, posted at 27.11.12 14:55:59 by Ludz Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 33) :

    Oi, this is a family site young man!

    And he got it because, when the English were pushing us around in the second half he was like a brick wall.

    Nothing to do with WP bias; I even thought Kirchner has a great game!

    Lambie was okay; much better in the second half than the first. He made mistakes and at times looked a wee bit hesitant, but then he got rubbish service (again) and the conditions were atrocious.

    The little dab kick of his was genius and his goal kicking was spot-on, so hats off.

  • Comment 42, posted at 27.11.12 14:57:42 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @Culling Song (Comment 40) :

    Its been a breath fo fresh air because he’s a man’s man. Like the Bok eightmen of old, he is tough and brutal, not pretty and useless as we’ve had for the last few years.

  • Comment 43, posted at 27.11.12 14:59:40 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 33) : @robdylan (Comment 37) :

    Go back to your sabbatical Rob!

  • Comment 44, posted at 27.11.12 15:23:27 by Pokkel Reply
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  • I would have picked Duanne as MOTM too! :roll:

  • Comment 45, posted at 27.11.12 15:25:49 by Pokkel Reply
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  • As much as I dont rate Duane ,and think he has been average this tour ,I could say the same for Willem Alberts…

    If we chose on form this year(non internationals);

    Coetzee/Kriel/Daniel/Kolisi and Kanko are the top performers.

  • Comment 46, posted at 27.11.12 15:44:16 by Talent Reply
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  • @Talent (Comment 46) : Non international games*

  • Comment 47, posted at 27.11.12 15:45:28 by Talent Reply
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  • I’m not sure how Alberts and Duane could start ahead of Coetzee, man for man he was better than both of them this season…… and no it’s no cause he plays for the Sharks it’s because he was best loose forward this year.

  • Comment 48, posted at 28.11.12 00:30:26 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 48) :

    I’m not sure how Alberts and Duane could start ahead of Coetzee

    They dont play the same position?

  • Comment 49, posted at 29.11.12 17:25:04 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 49) : coetzee is a blind side and can also play 8, what positions did Alberts and Duane play if they don’t play the same positions?
    Don’t be fooled at were meyer played Coetzee just remember he played a 9 on the wing in place of two very talented young wings.

  • Comment 50, posted at 29.11.12 20:44:42 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 50) :

    Coetzee has been used as a ball-carrying openside over the Autumn Internationals, Alberts a blindside and Vermeulen an eighthman.

    Meyer doesnt seem to think they play the same position.

  • Comment 51, posted at 30.11.12 11:58:25 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 51) : yes meyer thinks a lot of things but not all of them is true, like thinking morne is a good flyhalf and that hougaard is a wing. Coetzee is a blindside or eighthman and if you don’t believe me go ask Plum. Coetzee only played 6 for Sharks to make place for Alberts, he did not play openside that job was done by Bismarck

  • Comment 52, posted at 30.11.12 14:19:19 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 52) :

    Lol, youre funny dude.
    And fair dues. But he’s not a better eighthman than Vermeulen… :mrgreen:

  • Comment 53, posted at 30.11.12 20:02:51 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • I cannot believe it, the Blitzbokke playing the same brand of brain dead rugby the Springboks played :roll:

    Never offloading in the tackle, all the big boys wanting to run through or over the opposition and failing miserably. :x

    It just emphasises the problem with our rugby – the big boys are still not being coached to play intelligent rugby and to avoid the collision, or when you take contact you make sure you put a team mate in a better position and GIVE HIM THE BALL!

    Only in the second half against Russia (in the battle of the ultimate losers Bowl qtr. final) did we realise that brain dead rugby might be HM’s fantasy, but it means nothing on the sevens world stage. And only when we started throwing the ball around did we get the better of Russia (ja, even Russia knew how to play against stampkar rugby :shock: ).

    And Phillip Snyman, what an utter waste of a sevens player he’s turning out to be, how they gave him a 2 year contract with the Blitzbokke before seeing him play a single game is beyond me.

  • Comment 54, posted at 01.12.12 09:32:38 by FireTheLooser Reply

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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 53) : He is a better loose-forward :grin:

    @FireTheLooser (Comment 54) : Jordaan ,Sithole & Rhule should have gone and played for them…

  • Comment 55, posted at 01.12.12 12:22:08 by Talent Reply
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  • England’s white jersey is the toilet paper on which NZ flushed their whole year’s achievements down the toilet.

    At least we didn’t lose to England this year :twisted:

  • Comment 56, posted at 01.12.12 18:22:42 by FireTheLooser Reply

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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 53) : glad i can make you laugh. Problem I have with Vermeulen is (like Keegan) he tend to wander in the games he play for the bokke (sometimes brilliant and sometimes totally missing). Don’t get me wrong I think both Vermeulen and Keegan are great players in super rugby and currie cup but don’t know why if they put on the green and gold it seems as if they can’t perform on that same level. Maybe Gameplan at their super rugby and currie cup level is a better fit to them than the bok gameplan.

  • Comment 57, posted at 01.12.12 20:51:52 by JD Reply
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  • @FireTheLooser (Comment 56) : me thinks the team from the “long white cloud” thought their last game would be easy christmass feast and all they had to do to win was run onto the field…… BIG mistake!!

  • Comment 58, posted at 01.12.12 20:55:53 by JD Reply
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