robdylan

Bothma joins exodus


Written by Rob Otto (robdylan)

Posted in :Original Content, Sharks, Super Rugby on 30 Jun 2015 at 10:10
Tagged with : , , , , , ,

Renaldo Bothma is the latest Sharks Super Rugby player to announce a short-term Japanese stint at the end of the year, withe his agent confirming he will play for Toyota Verblitz after the World Cup.

Bothma will leave for Japan in November and return to Durban at the end of January, meaning he, too, will miss the bulk of the Sharks’ pre-season program.

While it’s a little pointless arguing against this model (since it seems to be the way of the world nowadays) I can’t help but feel for Super Rugby coaches, who are increasingly being forced to integrate large swathes of their first-choice team very late into the pre-season. From a Sharks perspective, all of Marcell Coetzee, Bothma, Ryan Kankowski, Jacques Potgieter, Frans Steyn, JP Pietersen and Willie le Roux now fit into this category – nearly half of a starting 15.

You’d also be rather naive to think that it isn’t going to get worse. How much longer will it be before the likes of Cobus Reinach, Pat Lambie, Beast Mtawarira and Lwazi Mvovo feel the pull of the strong Japanese economy, too?



68 Comments

  • Bad news

  • Comment 1, posted at 30.06.15 10:12:44 by Uli Boelie Reply
    Valued Sharksworld Supporter
    Uli BoelieTeam captain
     
  • I wish they would start the comp a month later. That will sort everything out

  • Comment 2, posted at 30.06.15 10:13:41 by West Indies Cricket Board Reply
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  • Hell at this rate the CC will be filled with U20′s at the rate the guys are going.

  • Comment 3, posted at 30.06.15 10:14:15 by Dragnipur Reply
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    DragnipurSuper Rugby player
     
  • The good thing with Pat doesn’t need the retirement plan with his grandfather.

  • Comment 4, posted at 30.06.15 10:16:13 by durbsguy Reply

    durbsguyAssistant coach
     
  • Are there any Japanese players in the Japanese league, and when will SS start broadcasting live matches? It’s starting to sound more attractive than Currie Cup!

  • Comment 5, posted at 30.06.15 10:17:05 by MikeN Reply

    Under 21 player
     
  • So Rob, correct me if I’m wrong, but will he now go back to the Pumas for CC, then Namibia for WC, then Japan, then back to us again?? :shock:

  • Comment 6, posted at 30.06.15 10:19:05 by Another Nick Reply

    Another NickSuper Rugby player
     
  • My concern is how many games will these players allowed to play in Super Rugby before a rest is demanded by the Bok management…..even though the Japanese league is of lesser intensity still there is little to no rest for these guys

  • Comment 7, posted at 30.06.15 10:20:05 by JustPlainSHARK Reply

    JustPlainSHARKCurrie Cup player
     
  • Hope he can learn to catch a ball in Japan.

  • Comment 8, posted at 30.06.15 10:21:39 by Ben Reply
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  • @JustPlainSHARK (Comment 7) : I think the resting of the Boks was only for this year for the WC.

  • Comment 9, posted at 30.06.15 10:27:51 by Uli Boelie Reply
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    Uli BoelieTeam captain
     
  • @Another Nick (Comment 6) : no, he’s not playing Currie Cup this year.

    so it’s to Namibia from now until the end of the World Cup, then Japan Nov-Jan, Sharks Feb 16 then Pumas for CC 16. After that, he is free and will either sign a new Sharks deal or (I guess) a new Japanese deal

  • Comment 10, posted at 30.06.15 10:29:22 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 9) : the players on SA Rugby central contracts will be restricted to 16 matches in total for their franchise per season.

    Since none of them will ever play Currie Cup anyway, that’s 16 matches in Super Rugby, out of a total of, what, 18?

  • Comment 11, posted at 30.06.15 10:30:23 by robdylan Reply
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  • ca we ask for a bye in the first week. Is it not usually a problem getting these guys back in time for the first game. So we def wont have a well drilled and co-ordinated team for next years super rugby. def makes for a very tricky challenge as a coach as you cannot work on anything in preseason with your core team.

  • Comment 12, posted at 30.06.15 10:30:53 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • Pick your poison gentlemen. It’s Japan or Europe.

  • Comment 13, posted at 30.06.15 10:33:10 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 10) : Or both. Thanks Rob.

  • Comment 14, posted at 30.06.15 10:35:55 by Another Nick Reply

    Another NickSuper Rugby player
     
  • @West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 2) : I know it’s not a new sentiment but I honestly wish we could just be done with Super Rugby considering the new format. Only playing NZ teams every second year sounds so dull.

  • Comment 15, posted at 30.06.15 10:43:06 by vanmartin Reply
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  • Kankmowski!? :mrgreen:

  • Comment 16, posted at 30.06.15 10:48:20 by Culling Song Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 11) : mmm I wasn’t aware that it applied to non WC years. interesting

  • Comment 17, posted at 30.06.15 10:57:10 by Uli Boelie Reply
    Valued Sharksworld Supporter
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 15) :
    Competition format[edit]
    The 18 teams will be grouped geographically. There are two regional groups, each consisting of two conferences: the Australasian Group, with five teams in the Australian Conference and five teams in the New Zealand Conference and the South African Group, with six South African teams, one Argentinean team and one Japanese team split into a four-team Africa 1 Conference a four-team Africa 2 Conference.[2]

    In the group stages, there will be 17 rounds of matches, where each team will play 15 matches and have two rounds of byes for a total of 135 matches.

    The fixture schedule is still to be confirmed, but each team will play at least one match against all the other teams in their conference. They will also play one round of fixtures against all the teams in the other conference in their group, as well as games against one of the two conferences in the opposite group.

    The top team of each of the four conferences will automatically qualify to the Quarter Finals. The next top three teams in the Australasian Group and the next top team in the South African group will also qualify to the Quarter Finals as wildcards. :???: :???: :???: The conference winners will be seeded #1 to #4 for the Quarter Finals, in order of log points gained during the group stages, while the wildcards will be seeded as #5 to #8 in order of log points gained during the group stages.

    In the Quarter Finals, the conference winners will host the first round of the finals, with the highest-seeded conference winner hosting the fourth-seeded wildcard entry, the second-seeded conference winner hosting the third-seeded wildcard entry, the third-seeded conference winner hosting the second-seeded wildcard entry and the fourth-seeded conference winner hosting the top-seed wildcard entry.

    The Quarter Final winners will progress to the Semi-Finals, where the highest seed to reach the Semi-Finals will host the lowest seed and the second-seeded semi-finalist will host the third-seeded team.

    The winner of the Semi-Finals will progress to the Final, at the venue of the highest-seeded team.

  • Comment 18, posted at 30.06.15 11:04:06 by Uli Boelie Reply
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  • New structure means we will play substandard teams and not be ready when we play Oz and nz teams again. Which means we produce less international standard boks which means…. thank you sanzar you always have SA rugby best interests at heart.

  • Comment 19, posted at 30.06.15 11:08:10 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 18) : How the hell did SARU sign off on this mess? :roll:

  • Comment 20, posted at 30.06.15 11:10:56 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 18) : Can they make it more complicated please….

  • Comment 21, posted at 30.06.15 11:11:10 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @Dragnipur (Comment 3) : luckily the lions team will still be full strength :mrgreen:

  • Comment 22, posted at 30.06.15 11:11:39 by Zibbie Reply
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  • There could be an argument for dropping CC completely, or having it overlap with SS… or, inviting the Japanese league to integrate with the CC. Send our top three teams over to them one year and they send their top 3 teams over to us the next.

    If Japan is where the money lies and SA is where the talent lies, surely there is a negotiation that will benefit both parties, somewhere to be found?

  • Comment 23, posted at 30.06.15 11:16:52 by Letgo Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 15) : So basically we only able to ever have two teams in the finals

  • Comment 24, posted at 30.06.15 11:21:03 by Uli Boelie Reply
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  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 18) : I can hardly read that without getting tired never mind contemplating following it.Willing to bet interest in this competition starts to rapidly wain.These greedy people at SARU and SANZAR have killed the golden goose.
    We should never have gone past Super 12 that was a manageable competition from the players and the fans point of view.

  • Comment 25, posted at 30.06.15 11:22:26 by The hound Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 20) : total mess

    @SheldonK (Comment 21) : Cant believe how dumb these okes are. We would be much better off playing in the Heineken cup.

  • Comment 26, posted at 30.06.15 11:22:57 by Uli Boelie Reply
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  • How on earth must a coach prepare for super rugby if almost all the players are in Japan during the pre-season?

  • Comment 27, posted at 30.06.15 11:23:30 by Bokhoring Reply
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  • @Letgo (Comment 23) : I don’t like the idea of messing with the traditions of the CC but I have to admit it’s not a bad idea if it means our players can stop taking these Japanese deals. It will however also mean one would need to change the timing of the CC to later on in the year.

  • Comment 28, posted at 30.06.15 11:23:31 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @Letgo (Comment 23) :

    I don’t know the Japanese league well enough to have any idea how this would work, but surely there must be a way.

    They have 14 teams (I think) though, so I don’t know where SA teams would fit in. We already have to many CC teams, but I can’t help but think that this is the best way forward. Strike up a massive deal with the Japanese. Even if CC has to fall away completely. That will just mean more of our local guys would be available to them to choose from and maybe we can move CC to where VC is now. Something of this sort.

    I haven’t thought it through.

  • Comment 29, posted at 30.06.15 11:25:34 by Letgo Reply
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  • @Bokhoring (Comment 27) : One can only arrive at one conclusion – don’t expect SA Super Rugby champions very often. South African teams now face at least three distinct disadvantages going forward in Super Rugby:
    1. Travel
    2. Inadequate preseason for key players in SA teams
    3. A competition format that guarantees more Australasian teams in the playoffs

    Then we have not even touched on referee and sanctioning biases within Super Rugby. I agree with The hound, can’t see the public staying interested.

  • Comment 30, posted at 30.06.15 11:30:00 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 26) : Which would probably have us produce a higher calibre of player and game style anyways.

  • Comment 31, posted at 30.06.15 11:36:27 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • Problem is sa ru is run by imbeciles compared to nz and Oz boards. They have been shafts us for years and using sanzar to keep us underdeveloped overpenalized depleted and losing talent. Of course we did our part to help. The sooner we get out of sanzar and ho compete with NH clubs the better.

  • Comment 32, posted at 30.06.15 11:39:39 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • @vanmartin (Comment 30) : so the best solution…revive Currie Cup rugby and restore it to its former glory by making it earlier in the year and ditching super rugby.

    Make sure preseason is during Feb…start in mid-march, end by start June. Voda cup can run during the current CC slot.

  • Comment 33, posted at 30.06.15 11:41:07 by FireTheLooser Reply

    Assistant coach
     
  • @FireTheLooser (Comment 33) : Yes or in the “off” years dedicate your talent to cc and use supers to grow your juniors. Reverse of current thinking. Maybe even join Heineken cup in the years we play the lesser unions

  • Comment 34, posted at 30.06.15 11:56:14 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • @vanmartin (Comment 28) :

    I must say that without all the Boks and the Top SA players playing in Japan, CC has become nothing more than VC in disguise. The tradition of CC definitely is long gone already. If you can’t see the two best SA teams compete at their best in the final, then what is the point.

    I love CC and think there is still room for that tradition, but not as long as the Boks and the rest of our top players aren’t involved. I’d rather create a type of IPL thing with Japan.

    My thinking, since the conference system and SA teams playing each other twice in SR, has been to score CC points during these derby matches. Have B teams run out against the 2/3 teams not involved in SR and schedule a CC knock out for 2 weeks after SR, before RC. I thought if you did this you could make the knock outs 3 weeks.

    Week 1: Quarter Finals: Game 1 – 1 vs 8, Game 2 – 2 vs 7, Game 3 – 3 vs 6, Game 4 4 vs 5.
    Week 2: Semi Finals: Game 1 – Winner of Game 1 vs Winner of Game 4, Game 2 – Winner of Game 2 vs Winner of Game 3.
    Week 3: Finals: Winner of Game 1 vs Winner of Game 2

  • Comment 35, posted at 30.06.15 12:06:02 by Letgo Reply
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  • @Letgo (Comment 35) : Interesting idea (well it would make Super Rugby more interesting at the very least)

  • Comment 36, posted at 30.06.15 13:09:19 by vanmartin Reply
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  • all the ideas are all good and well, but it would never materialize with the money hungry dictators who run the country.

  • Comment 37, posted at 30.06.15 13:13:29 by Uli Boelie Reply
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  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 37) : Agreed also Hoskins and Co have never showed any signs of intelligence or strategy why would they start now?

  • Comment 38, posted at 30.06.15 13:15:00 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • @The hound (Comment 25) : I feel the same way. Super 12 was the best format as it allowed all the teams to be at their competitive best. We don’t have enough players to field 6 teams.

  • Comment 39, posted at 30.06.15 13:17:43 by Farlington Reply

    FarlingtonSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Farlington (Comment 39) : Strength vs Strength always the best for the game.

  • Comment 40, posted at 30.06.15 13:22:51 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • I agree with the sentiments of most – SR will die from next yr as it’s so watered down and interest will fade quickly. Will be interesting to see what the bunch of crooks do when they see their Super 18 failed. Abandon the whole concept and start CC earlier and let the players play in Eur or go back to Super 12 or 15??

  • Comment 41, posted at 30.06.15 13:46:58 by RedSharkUtd82 Reply

    RedSharkUtd82Super Rugby player
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 10) : Or both…

  • Comment 42, posted at 30.06.15 13:55:40 by pastorshark Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld Administrator
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  • @Another Nick (Comment 14) : Haha…you already said that…

  • Comment 43, posted at 30.06.15 13:58:27 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 15) : I’m with you…

  • Comment 44, posted at 30.06.15 13:59:13 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 18) : :shock:

  • Comment 45, posted at 30.06.15 14:02:39 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 24) : Huh? There are always only two teams in a final? :mrgreen: Or did you mean quarterfinals? In that case we can have 3…

  • Comment 46, posted at 30.06.15 14:05:03 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @FireTheLooser (Comment 33) : Interesting idea. How much revenue would we lose from the Super Rugby setup, though (TV, ads, sponsors, etc.)? I have no idea…it is a genuine question…

  • Comment 47, posted at 30.06.15 14:09:29 by pastorshark Reply
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  • I have no idea where to put this…but here goes…
    The final has been awarded to Jaco Peyper…
    http://www.superxv.co.za/46875/1/super-rugby-match-officials-grand-final#.VZKI9XwaK9s

  • Comment 48, posted at 30.06.15 14:20:14 by pastorshark Reply
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  • Just make SR knockout. Like Wimbledon. Then you can have 64 teams and finish the whole thing in 6 rounds.

  • Comment 49, posted at 30.06.15 14:42:40 by Letgo Reply
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  • @Letgo (Comment 49) : Imagine… all that excitement before the tournament starts just to see your team bow out the very first round. :lol:

  • Comment 50, posted at 30.06.15 15:13:32 by Farlington Reply

    FarlingtonSuper Rugby player
     
  • @pastorshark (Comment 47) : Now that number I don’t know.

    What I do however know is that sanzar determined that local derby’s were the real money makers…

    CC rugby would effectively encompass that whole theme…

    Sponsors are looking at local advertising (I can’t see Cell C sponsoring the Sharks with the aim of breaking into the OZ or kiwi market, same goes for the other sponsors)…

    And at last count, SA still brought the majority TV revenue to SR, I can’t see why that would change when Currie Cup rugby is restored to its former glory.

  • Comment 51, posted at 30.06.15 15:23:05 by FireTheLooser Reply

    Assistant coach
     
  • @Letgo (Comment 49) : :mrgreen:

  • Comment 52, posted at 30.06.15 15:57:14 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @FireTheLooser (Comment 51) : I don’t know whether the “market” would be prepared to pay the same for the different product, particularly in terms of TV…but then, what do I know…

  • Comment 53, posted at 30.06.15 15:59:30 by pastorshark Reply
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  • So half our team wont take part in pre season training. This is getting ridicules.

  • Comment 54, posted at 30.06.15 17:03:44 by JarsonX Reply
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  • @Letgo (Comment 49) : short season for Sharks then!!!!

  • Comment 55, posted at 30.06.15 17:20:39 by JD Reply
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  • @JarsonX (Comment 54) : well at least the other half could have team meetings in Japan!!! Get one of the assistant coaches over there or coach by skype!!!!

  • Comment 56, posted at 30.06.15 17:22:27 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 56) : Brilliant! You available for Sharks head coach? :)

  • Comment 57, posted at 30.06.15 19:51:59 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 46) : You correct I got confused with the conferences and the groups…. haha
    so we have 3 teams in the finals series. 2 through the conference system and then 1 extra wildcard.

  • Comment 58, posted at 01.07.15 08:41:42 by Uli Boelie Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 57) : always available for the Sharks!!! :lol:

  • Comment 59, posted at 01.07.15 11:11:47 by JD Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 42) : Some CT updates for you….I know you enjoy the noise coming out of the Mother City…

    Allister Coetzee gee Stormers raad: ‘Haal die tjekboek uit’

    Deur Stephen Nell Woensdag 01 Julie 2015 11:39

    Steven Kitshoff: “Vervang hom met ’n senior loskop.”

    Marcell Coetzee: “Die Stormers kort ’n flank soos hy.”

    KAAPSTAD. – ’n Bewese loskopstut, nr.?5-slot, oopkantflank, ’n losskakel en twee vleuels.

    Nogal ’n mondvol, maar dís volgens die Stormers se uittredende afrigter, Allister Coetzee, wat benodig word vir die Kaapse Superrugby-span om die volgende vlak te bereik.

    Coetzee het vanjaar grootliks met onervare kalwers geploeg. Toe Duane Vermeulen en Schalk Burger boonop nie fiks was vir die uitspeelwedstryd teen die Brumbies nie, is die Stormers se rug geknak.

    “Steven Kitshoff was puik as loskopstut, maar verlaat ons. Die Stormers kan nie aanstaande jaar in sy afwesigheid op ’n jong speler se nommer druk nie. Ons móét ’n senior loskop bykry,” het Coetzee aan Die Burger gesê.

    ?

    “Manuel Carizza verlaat die Westelike Provinsie, wat beteken daar is ook ’n leemte op nr.?5-slot. Ruan Botha is die enigste een wat oorbly.”

    Coetzee het bygevoeg dat die leemte wat Vermeulen en Mi­chael Rhodes onder die losvoorspelers laat, ook gevul moet word.

    “Dit moet verkieslik iemand wees wat bal toe speel, soos Heinrich Brüssow of Marcell Coetzee.”

    Coetzee meen ook dis belangrik om Demetri Catrakilis met ’n gehalte-losskakel te vervang.

    Die gebrek aan ’n behoorlike fisieke teenwoordigheid op die vleuels moet ook aandag kry deur spesialiste in te span.

    Dillyn Leyds, ’n talentvolle maar tengerige heelagter, en die jong senters Johnny Kotze en Pat Howard, is vanjaar as vleuels aangewend.

    “Ons het die seisoen sonder ’n spesialis-linkervleuel afgeskop en het toe maar vir Dillyn gekies,” het Coetzee gesê.

    “Jy kan nie volhard met só min fisieke teenwoordigheid in jou agterste driehoek nie.

    “Jy kom te staan teen spelers soos Julian Savea, Waisake Naholo en Nemani Nadolo. Dis vreesaanjaend.”

    Coetzee het daarop gewys dat Bryan Habana en Gerhard van den Heever nog nie as vleuels vervang is sedert hulle die WP verlaat het nie.

    “Die WP het vir Kobus van Wyk, maar moet nóg twee vleuels kontrakteer.”

    Hy het benadruk dat die visier op ervare spelers móét wees.

    “As jy kyk na die spanne in verlede jaar se eindstryd – die Waratahs en die Crusaders – was daar onderskeidelik 18 Wallabies en 19 All Blacks in hul 23-talle.

    “Die WP vaar goed in die Curriebeker-reeks omdat sy junior strukture sterk is.

    “In die Super-reeks is dit belangrik om ’n goeie balans te hê tussen spelers van wêreldgehalte en jong manne.”

    Coetzee hou duim vas dat die WP sy teikens – die Haaie-duo van die slot Pieter-Steph du Toit en die flank Marcell Coetzee, sowel as die Cheetahs-vleuel Cornal Hendricks en Racing Métro se Springbok-losskakel, Johan Goosen – sal kan kry.

    Vir Coetzee en Du Toit is die Bok-slot Eben Etzebeth se teenwoordigheid in die WP ’n groot trekpleister. Coetzee en Etzebeth is baie goed bevriend, terwyl Du Toit en die WP-yster ’n slotkombinasie sal wees wat Suid-Afrika vir jare kan dien.

    ??Intussen sal die Pumas-vaskopstut Vincent Koch aanstaande jaar na die Stormers terugkeer. Hy het aan Die Burger gesê dat sy Superrugby-kontrak in die Kaap vir twee jaar strek.

    Koch speel egter Curriebeker-rugby vir die Pumas, waar hy tot die einde van aanstaande jaar gekontrakteer is.

  • Comment 60, posted at 01.07.15 12:34:56 by grant10 Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 58) : Yebo yes…

  • Comment 61, posted at 01.07.15 13:17:09 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @grant10 (Comment 60) : Sorry, say that again…all I heard was noise! :mrgreen:

  • Comment 62, posted at 01.07.15 13:19:35 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @grant10 (Comment 60) : I sure as hell hope that Marcell doesn’t just base his decision on joining his mate Eben…

  • Comment 63, posted at 01.07.15 13:20:26 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @grant10 (Comment 60) : Unfortunately it is still wait and wait and wait…aaaaaand…see…

  • Comment 64, posted at 01.07.15 13:21:08 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 62) : LOL…..I am sure clarity will be obtained soon.

  • Comment 65, posted at 01.07.15 13:24:32 by grant10 Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @pastorshark (Comment 63) : bearing in mind that I have no doubt Eben will be off to Europe end of 2016…

  • Comment 66, posted at 01.07.15 13:28:00 by grant10 Reply

    Super Rugby player
     
  • @grant10 (Comment 66) : Come on, Marcell! Please don’t leave…
    I still say he is the guy we can least afford to lose!

  • Comment 67, posted at 01.07.15 13:33:54 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 67) : Brussow would be my first choice…..I know a couple of years back it was virtually a done deal….then Toyota came in and killed it for the Stormers….

  • Comment 68, posted at 01.07.15 13:49:43 by grant10 Reply

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