Richard Ferguson

Chilliboy signs with Sharks


Written by Richard Ferguson (Richard Ferguson)

Posted in :Original Content, Sharks, Super Rugby on 30 Oct 2015 at 16:18
Tagged with : , , ,

The Sharks have just announced the signing of former Springbok hooker Chilliboy Ralepelle.

Chilliboy will join the Sharks in April 2016 when his current suspension finishes. The former Bulls hooker is currently serving a 24 month suspension for alleged doping.

In the press release from the Sharks, Director of Rugby Gary Gold has said how pleased he is to have acquired the services of such a seasoned hooker.

There is sure to be mixed feelings surrounding the signing especially as the Sharks as a brand do so much to show their support for anti-doping.



245 Comments

  • My personal opinion- i can never support the guy in a sharks jersey. Getting rewarded for cheating the game. I wonder how those that run the sharks anti doping campaigns feel? Hope they sue the Union

  • Comment 1, posted at 30.10.15 16:20:08 by SheldonK Reply
    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • How very very sad.

    “SharkSmart is encompassed by its motto: “Play Safe, Play Fair””
    http://www.sharksmart.co.za/about-sharksmart/

    Throwing away any backing the Sharks have for any anti doping drives.

  • Comment 2, posted at 30.10.15 16:20:43 by Seth101 Reply
    Valued Sharksworld Supporter Author
    NostrasethTeam captain
     
  • This is not smart

  • Comment 3, posted at 30.10.15 16:21:15 by Clayton(PJLD) Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 2) : I wonder if they gonna be selling Lance Armstrong Book- Its Not About the Bike at the Sharkcage now?

  • Comment 4, posted at 30.10.15 16:22:22 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • Now why the hell did they do that? How old is he? Must be in his 30′s already. And he’s been caught doping twice. Not a good signing at all. Worst one in a while!

  • Comment 5, posted at 30.10.15 16:23:30 by Dragnipur Reply
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  • @Clayton(PJLD) (Comment 3) : No. The signing is smart. The way they handled the announcement was stupid.

  • Comment 6, posted at 30.10.15 16:23:55 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 6) : Look I used to feel for Chilli, he really is a tragic story of a wasted talent but TWO dope tests? CAMAAAAAAN

  • Comment 7, posted at 30.10.15 16:24:53 by Clayton(PJLD) Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 6) :

    Their article on the Sharks site has no info regarding the suspension, as if they wanted to ignore it completely..

  • Comment 8, posted at 30.10.15 16:27:18 by Richard Ferguson Reply
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  • :shock:

  • Comment 9, posted at 30.10.15 16:28:10 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • He was cleared of his first doping issue. It was the infamous methylhexaneamine which probably shouldn’t even be on the list. Same stuff the comrades winner a few years ago tested positive for. He was cleared too. Second time he was injured and not playing. I suspect he took something to speed up his recovery, knowingly or not.

  • Comment 10, posted at 30.10.15 16:29:14 by The Quirk Reply
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    The QuirkVodacom Cup player
     
  • I don’t see what is smart about this at all. Is he good? Yea. But we got him because he was unwanted. It hurts the Sharks image, ruins their anti doping campaigns and all in the hope that he can perform at the level he used to…

  • Comment 11, posted at 30.10.15 16:29:44 by Seth101 Reply
    Valued Sharksworld Supporter Author
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  • @The Quirk (Comment 10) : It’s an I injectable steroid used for cutting, literally impossible to take unknowingly.

  • Comment 12, posted at 30.10.15 16:31:27 by Seth101 Reply
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  • If he performs for the Sharks, fans will forgive him quickly enough I imagine and laud the union for giving the player a second chance. All tge pressure’s on Chilli. Agreed on the announcement, could have been better.

  • Comment 13, posted at 30.10.15 16:39:07 by vanmartin Reply
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  • “there is sure to be mixed feelings surrounding the signing”

    im part of the “Not happy” camp unfortunately, What a downgrade from BDP. I wish him all the best and i hope that I am wrong but I’d love to know what possessed JS to get him; and i hate the way they worded their press release/handled this signing.
    I hope he proves us wrong but realllllllly, was never actually a fan of him…..ever [and its nothing to do with his doping offenses]

    Anyway, it will be beneficial to you to read a particularly interesting article on methylhexanamie on Ross Tucker’s “The Science of Sport” site.

    He ends by saying “Basson and Ralepele have been labeled as “drug cheats” by local media, and while this may well turn out to be true, it seems far more likely they are victims of a supplement industry that is rampant, uncontrolled and responsible for more harm that good.”

    http://sportsscientists.com/2010/12/drug-of-the-year-methylhexanamine-and-the-supplement-industry/

  • Comment 14, posted at 30.10.15 16:39:55 by Jeremiser Reply
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  • Look…we seriously need a hooker…like SERIOUSLY!!!!!
    I actually half dont mind it, hope he repays the faith

  • Comment 15, posted at 30.10.15 16:42:17 by Tintin Reply

    TintinSuper Rugby player
     
  • I am not too happy with the signing as he is way past his best, simply put will we end up chasing away the likes of Marais or Cooper for another pensioner?

    As for the Doping thing? remember we accepted Ackerman for the same thing? look how that turned out?

  • Comment 16, posted at 30.10.15 16:48:16 by sharks_lover Reply
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  • Oh hell no. WTF??

  • Comment 17, posted at 30.10.15 16:48:48 by JarsonX Reply
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  • @Tintin (Comment 15) : True but also, we need a hooker now :)

  • Comment 18, posted at 30.10.15 16:48:51 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @Tintin (Comment 15) : I’m with you on this one. I like the guy, but was disappointed by his action in relation to doping

    then again we all forgave Akermann

  • Comment 19, posted at 30.10.15 16:51:36 by revolverocelot Reply

    Team captain
     
  • Good player. Hope he’s learnt his lesson. I’m all for second chances.

  • Comment 20, posted at 30.10.15 16:58:30 by Letgo Reply
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  • Which one of you buggers put Chilli’s name down on the survey??? Lol…. like they will get our suggestions

  • Comment 21, posted at 30.10.15 17:02:19 by ebenp Reply

    Under 21 player
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 1) : He didn’t get rewarded for cheating. He got 2 years. He’s now being rewarded for staying clean and working hard in those 2 years. You’ve never made a bad decision?

  • Comment 22, posted at 30.10.15 17:02:32 by Letgo Reply
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  • Not a big fan of this, but desperate times call for desperate measures.

  • Comment 23, posted at 30.10.15 17:03:47 by Ben Reply
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  • @ebenp (Comment 21) : I put Burden

  • Comment 24, posted at 30.10.15 17:06:16 by Letgo Reply
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  • @Letgo (Comment 24) : Me too.

  • Comment 25, posted at 30.10.15 17:07:29 by Ben Reply
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  • He is 29 years old. For those who were wondering…

  • Comment 26, posted at 30.10.15 17:09:08 by Ben Reply
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  • To get a bit philosophical: If every person in the history of the world who made a mistake or even a deliberate dof thing (great word!) was not allowed to come back and contribute in the same area of life in which they made a mistake…well, the world would be a lot poorer for it! I’d want to see him show remorse, I’d want him not to do it again…but I would be prepared to give him a chance to contribute…

  • Comment 27, posted at 30.10.15 17:15:50 by pastorshark Reply
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  • Come on people….as I said before: the difference between Chilli and most other pro-sportsmen? He was caught.

    I’m no fan nor supporter of doping, but it is rife at school level already – stop expecting players to be brain-dead wall-bashing mules and coach some intelligence into their heads, and doping will become far less prevalent.

    I am genuinely interested to know what the difference between banned substances, and substances that are not banned is? Anyone know?

  • Comment 28, posted at 30.10.15 17:20:54 by FireTheLooser Reply

    Assistant coach
     
  • Everyone makes mistakes I just hope this lights a fire up his ass and plays his best rugby

  • Comment 29, posted at 30.10.15 17:22:03 by Poisy Reply
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    PoisyTeam captain
     
  • …the Sharks also contracted Ackerman…and he now coaches the most exciting team in SA – says something about 2nd chances, doesn’t it?

  • Comment 30, posted at 30.10.15 17:29:27 by FireTheLooser Reply

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  • @FireTheLooser (Comment 30) : Yup…

  • Comment 31, posted at 30.10.15 17:37:53 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @Letgo (Comment 22) : @pastorshark (Comment 27) : @FireTheLooser (Comment 30) : glad to read not everyone came carrying stones in their hadnds.

  • Comment 32, posted at 30.10.15 17:50:11 by 50shadesofshark Reply

    Team captain
     
  • @pastorshark (Comment 27) : Look I don’t think that is philosophical, it is in fact, very practical. As a man whose profession is to minister and counsel, you are spot on. He deserves a second chance, and I hope he grabs it with both hands and never has this problem again. At 29 and a Hooker, he has about 5 or 6 good years left, especially considering that he really has not had that much game time as a professional.

  • Comment 33, posted at 30.10.15 17:56:45 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • Sharks signings announced this week (by the union or other reliable sources ): robert kruger, curwin bosch , chilliboy ralepele , and possibly ruan botha.

  • Comment 34, posted at 30.10.15 18:01:03 by 50shadesofshark Reply

    Team captain
     
  • The man made a mistake he was punished and served his sentence this means his debt is paid. What he does from now on is what he must be judged on not what he has.

  • Comment 35, posted at 30.10.15 18:04:32 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • Rob has been a busy little boy with all these signings. Just a week ago he was wondering what to write about next….

  • Comment 36, posted at 30.10.15 18:06:21 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • @coolfusion (Comment 36) : haha yes. The Sharks never fail to deliver :)

  • Comment 37, posted at 30.10.15 18:21:15 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 33) : Yup…

  • Comment 38, posted at 30.10.15 18:22:48 by pastorshark Reply
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  • As I said on Twitter for me it has nothing to do with his punishment and everything to do with the Sharks losing all credibility in their anti doping campaigns.

  • Comment 39, posted at 30.10.15 18:26:03 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 39) : wait and see .maybe he is used in a sharks anti-doping add.who knows?he could be used to talk to young players re : steriod use.perhaps it will carry more weight coming from him rather than a sports scientist or doctor or another player?

  • Comment 40, posted at 30.10.15 18:31:16 by 50shadesofshark Reply

    Team captain
     
  • @Seth101 (Comment 39) : So if you employ a convicted criminal who has served his time you can’t speak with credibility against crime? OK…

  • Comment 41, posted at 30.10.15 18:32:01 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @50shadesofshark (Comment 40) : @pastorshark (Comment 41) : Spot on, having a strong anti-doping stance does not mean you don’t have to give a player a genuine second chance. Where better a place for someone to get a second chance after a drug offence than the Union that has the strongest stance against doping. I am sure it is easier to stay clean at a union with a strong anti-doping stance vs a weak one.

  • Comment 42, posted at 30.10.15 18:53:11 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 41) : No. Especially when your a public brand that is followed by a lot of youngsters who are influenced by you and what to be part of the brand. How on earth can the Sharks go out and say ” you don’t need steroids to get ahead, we do not support the use of steroids”? They have no leg to stand on at all.

  • Comment 43, posted at 30.10.15 18:54:38 by Seth101 Reply
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  • Stevens had a Heroine addiction and came to us after “rehab”. ..chili …so I am all for giving a guy a 2nd chance but at least be smart about how and when you announce. ..after a great signing for example

  • Comment 44, posted at 30.10.15 18:54:54 by Sharkfinn Reply

    Under 21 player
     
  • @Sharkfinn (Comment 44) : coke, not heroin…. surely?

  • Comment 45, posted at 30.10.15 18:58:04 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 42) : I think you might just have written the pr the sharks need to put his signing (and ban) into perspective.

  • Comment 46, posted at 30.10.15 18:58:22 by 50shadesofshark Reply

    Team captain
     
  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 42) : Good stance!

  • Comment 47, posted at 30.10.15 18:58:36 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • Sharks van show that he can be rehabilitated. Would do wonders for reputation and the campaign.

  • Comment 48, posted at 30.10.15 18:59:51 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • @Sharkfinn (Comment 44) : exactly. They should have held this one and announced it together with the signing of Botha, for instance.

  • Comment 49, posted at 30.10.15 19:04:30 by robdylan Reply
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  • A strong compassionate stance on anti-doping. Now the key is to give him every bit of support to be successful both on the field and off, without drugs. Publicize all this and you have a success story to market your successful anti-doping program, that not only prevents players from using, but helps those caught to come back with out drugs. Seems positive to me, Ackerman being the first success story.

  • Comment 50, posted at 30.10.15 19:14:53 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @50shadesofshark (Comment 46) : not hard to do…. pity the Sharks opted not to give any thought to the PR angle when they did the release.

  • Comment 51, posted at 30.10.15 19:17:52 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 49) : I disagree, announce this in a positive way by itself. A hugely talented and experienced player who is looking for an opportunity to restore his career. The Sharks, as the union with the strongest anti-doping stance is committed to not only help prevent players from using illegal substances, but also to helping those who have used to recover in a positive drug free environment.

    I dunno, kinda sounds good to me, but I know I am not much of a marketing person. :mrgreen:

  • Comment 52, posted at 30.10.15 19:19:02 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 43) : I could hardly disagree with you more…I’ll tell you how they do it…they keep going out and saying, “you don’t need steroids to get ahead and we do not support the use of steroids,” then they say we only give Chilliboy a second chance because he has expressed remorse and is now clean…if he is ever not clean he is out of here…then they get Chilliboy to tell the kids what happens if you use steroids and you get him to underline the message. I absolutely disagree with the idea that giving someone a second chance when they have paid their dues undermines credibility…

  • Comment 53, posted at 30.10.15 19:19:16 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 49) : Fair comment…

  • Comment 54, posted at 30.10.15 19:21:44 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 50) : Absolutely…exactly like that…

  • Comment 55, posted at 30.10.15 19:22:33 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 53) : in fact, my respect for the Sharks GROWS, not shrinks, because of what they’re prepared to do for Chilliboy.

  • Comment 56, posted at 30.10.15 19:22:58 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 56) : Yup…

  • Comment 57, posted at 30.10.15 19:26:44 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 53) : well said

  • Comment 58, posted at 30.10.15 19:32:59 by revolverocelot Reply

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  • A PR campaign against doping is about as effective as a church drama group is against drinking. When kids see the first team coaches picking the big boys and Boks favouring the largest players all efforts go out the window. Chilli could actually prove useful – you get caught and your professional career gets put on hold in your prime and as penance you have to go play for the Sharks. That’ll scare ‘em good ;)

  • Comment 59, posted at 30.10.15 19:48:38 by vanmartin Reply
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  • Shocking!

  • Comment 60, posted at 30.10.15 19:50:56 by Honey Badger Reply

    Honey BadgerCurrie Cup player
     
  • Hope they do not make him captain. :roll: ;-) :| :shock:

  • Comment 61, posted at 30.10.15 19:52:42 by Honey Badger Reply

    Honey BadgerCurrie Cup player
     
  • @pastorshark (Comment 53) : But they neve did that at all, so far all they have do is keep completey quiet about it and act like it never happened.

  • Comment 62, posted at 30.10.15 20:11:56 by Seth101 Reply
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  • Is John Smith reading this site? Players on some of your wishlist have been signed. Lol

  • Comment 63, posted at 30.10.15 20:15:36 by sudhir Reply

    Vodacom Cup player
     
  • @Seth101 (Comment 62) : Patience…but I agree that the announcement and PR wasn’t handled well. That just still doesn’t mean the principal is wrong…

  • Comment 64, posted at 30.10.15 20:19:49 by pastorshark Reply
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  • Let’s give Chiliboy the benefit of doubt. Let him prove to us fans that he is rehabilitated and can add value to the team.

  • Comment 65, posted at 30.10.15 20:19:53 by sudhir Reply

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  • @sudhir (Comment 65) : Agreed…

  • Comment 66, posted at 30.10.15 20:20:16 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @sudhir (Comment 63) : :grin:

  • Comment 67, posted at 30.10.15 20:20:35 by pastorshark Reply
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  • Ja, I’m a sucker for second chance stories. I’ve been judgmental of the guy after I read about what he did previously. Sharks have done things like this before, with Chavanga and Paul Perez with mixed success. If he puts all the nonsense behind him and plays good rugga, I reckon we’ll adopt him. See you in the tank Chilliboy!

  • Comment 68, posted at 30.10.15 21:13:00 by SeanJeff Reply
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  • Hmmmm well I guess as a player, he wasn’t to shabby. Never in the same league as Bissy or Strauss. I will rather just play with what we have at the moment. Torsten isn’t a Bissy or a Strauss either, but he is as hard as nails, and does the basics well. He can mentor guys like Jacques du Toit, Huggett, and Neil Rautenbach. Even Joseph Dweba can grow.

    Sharks really could have rather bought a guy like Mark Pretorius or Malcolm Marx though.

  • Comment 69, posted at 30.10.15 21:22:42 by KingCheetah Reply

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  • Great move by the Sharks. Where Curwen is a long term investment Chiliboy is an awesome short term one.

  • Comment 70, posted at 30.10.15 21:28:03 by Morné Reply
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  • @KingCheetah (Comment 69) : Well, we’ll see…

  • Comment 71, posted at 30.10.15 21:29:18 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @Morné (Comment 70) : That’s kind of how I see it…and at 29 Chilliboy may develop into a medium term investment…

  • Comment 72, posted at 30.10.15 21:31:47 by pastorshark Reply
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  • You got to be kidding!!!!!!
    Has JS lost his mind???????
    How the fuck do you sign a player that’s serving a ban for doping?!?!?!?!?! Sorry I just can’t agree with this one!!!!!!!!

  • Comment 73, posted at 30.10.15 21:48:04 by JD Reply
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  • Wasn’t Herkie Kruger also resigned after coming back from a dope suspension? I’m shocked but not totally pissed with this signing, Cooper totally lost the plot and I’m not sure if Marais has reached his ceiling or not, so if we can get a solid two years out of Chillyboy and at the same time develop the next BdP then I will be happy.

  • Comment 74, posted at 30.10.15 21:49:48 by KingRiaan Reply

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  • @JD (Comment 73) : Breath…

  • Comment 75, posted at 30.10.15 21:49:57 by pastorshark Reply
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  • How many games tbefore he injured?!?! 5-6?!?!?! Just got over injury prone players like Hoffman, Psdt, Alberts now they sign him!!!!!!

  • Comment 76, posted at 30.10.15 21:56:03 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 76) : I have a Open Letter to John Smit, mate you had a fair chance but kak like this support the fact that things are not really working out. Maybe it’s time to spread your wings and find a real Job.

    For the sake of a team that served you well.

    Kind regards
    90% of Sharks Fans

    Ps-please take all the “key signings” with you.

  • Comment 77, posted at 30.10.15 22:04:59 by BoerSeun Reply

    BoerSeunCurrie Cup player
     
  • @pastorshark (Comment 75) : sorry but this on really piss me off!!!!!
    He has not played in two years but they still they sign him!!!! On what form was he signed?!?!?! Reputation alone!!!!!!

  • Comment 78, posted at 30.10.15 22:09:22 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 78) : this signing is a pot of shit!!!!

  • Comment 79, posted at 30.10.15 22:12:10 by BoerSeun Reply

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  • @BoerSeun (Comment 77) : ?

  • Comment 80, posted at 30.10.15 22:12:14 by JD Reply
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  • Wahahahaha Chilliboy – Fokken Rerig??? We must be VERY desperate or him and JS are best buddies?? I thought it was April fools for a moment..
    Never rated him and never will, but hey that’s just me #IdratherhaveScarra #SMIT&GOLDMUSTFALL lol

  • Comment 81, posted at 30.10.15 22:18:50 by RedSharkUtd82 Reply

    RedSharkUtd82Super Rugby player
     
  • @JD (Comment 73) : My thoughts exactly!!

  • Comment 82, posted at 30.10.15 22:21:13 by RedSharkUtd82 Reply

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  • @BoerSeun (Comment 77) : @JD (Comment 80) : @RedSharkUtd82 (Comment 82) : think it’s time to redo my questioner!!!!!!!!

  • Comment 83, posted at 30.10.15 22:26:44 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 83) : Wahahaha

  • Comment 84, posted at 30.10.15 22:37:52 by RedSharkUtd82 Reply

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  • For everyone who’s happy for giving a player a second chance and how he’s not rewarded for doping and all that shit let me make it clear for you: he was band for using anabolic steroids an should have been band for life!!!! All this does is let youngsters know that if I struggle to make it I can use steroids and get bigger and stronger if they catch me I serve my 2 years and carry on where I was as none of the “benefits” of doping was taken away or am I wrong do they confiscated the muscles an power you gained from using steriods?!?!?!?
    IF YOU USE STEROIDS YOU SHOULD BE BAND FOR LIFE THAT’S THE ONLY THING THAT WILL STOP PLAYERS USEING IT!!!!!!

  • Comment 85, posted at 30.10.15 22:54:23 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 85) : Anyone who doesn’t have a problem with this is clearly extremely ignorant to just how bad steroid use is in school boy rugby.
    I have to agree, performance enhancers should be a period ban, anabolic steroids should be a life time ban.

  • Comment 86, posted at 30.10.15 23:24:40 by Seth101 Reply
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  • Everyone who says this can be used for a good message… what message? That even if you use anabolic steroids you will get 2 years off and then a cushy job at a ‘top’ club?

  • Comment 87, posted at 30.10.15 23:25:47 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 87) : ja agree 100%!!!!!!!

  • Comment 88, posted at 30.10.15 23:45:11 by JD Reply
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  • Chilli might not be our first choice, but reality is, we need a proper hooker. Wasn’t always his biggest fan, but I definitely know we can use him now. Rules are rules, he paid his due and I am sure he learned his lesson. Welkom Chilli, gebruik jou tweede kans, hulle is skaars!

  • Comment 89, posted at 31.10.15 00:26:06 by HeinF Reply

    HeinFTeam captain
     
  • FYI his ban only ends half way through SR so he will not solve our hookers problem.

  • Comment 90, posted at 31.10.15 08:30:57 by Seth101 Reply
    Valued Sharksworld Supporter Author
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  • My apologies to all,my wishlist on the survey was Lood and Chili…. :shock: My question to Sharks management was ‘will you take anything on this survey seriously?’ :shock:

  • Comment 91, posted at 31.10.15 09:08:02 by BarendL Reply
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  • In all fairness,welcome Chili,make it count,I do believe this to be a good rugby decision,I reckon he will be a player wanting to prove himself and him only arriving April might just be the fire under Cooper’s ass to start playing some rugga again!

  • Comment 92, posted at 31.10.15 09:09:47 by BarendL Reply
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  • I’ll try and state my case differently. The ONLY way performance enhancing drug abuse will be discouraged will be by getting coaches and teams at all levels to reward and even praise the form and skills of players that are smaller in stature but just as good on the rugby field.

    There is even an argument to be made once again for having younger kids play according to weight divisions.

    Chilli’s signing is bad PR for the Sharks right now because of how it was communicated but won’t convince or encourage kids to do anything. They already have all the motivation they need. The kids smart enough to avoid it all together will be smart enough to see Chilli sitting without income for two years. They’ll see a player with his Bok dreams in tatters. They’ll see a player under constant scrutiny once he starts playing again. They’ll see a player pressured to constantly prove himself worthy again to the media and a public whose trust he’s lost. And if he performs some will always question whether he’s turned back to old habits. If that’s the kind of career any kid dreams of, the blame can be firmly layed at the parents door, not the Sharks.

  • Comment 93, posted at 31.10.15 09:34:01 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 93) : the only way to get steroids out of sport is for a life long ban!!!! The risk of a ban should totally out way the possible advantage of the steroids!!!! Two years is a joke and will do nothing to stop youngsters using this shit!!!!! If the powers that be is to shit to enforce this then the teams should do it by not signing players that used anabolic steroids!!!! Poor decision by the Sharks!!!

  • Comment 94, posted at 31.10.15 10:58:49 by JD Reply
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  • I read all the comments and I can see a valid points on both sides of the argument.
    But he is here, might as well except it and move on.
    This was always going to happen because of his ties with John Smit.

  • Comment 95, posted at 31.10.15 11:00:26 by YamYam Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 90) : and then how will his form be as he did not play for two years!!!!!!!!!

  • Comment 96, posted at 31.10.15 11:02:32 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 96) : That is the only point we should be debating.
    He has done his time and is legally allowed to play again,we do not ban drug cheats for life we give them suspensions he has done his.
    My only problem with this is that I hope who ever has signed him has taken into account why he had to use artificial enhancements in the first place.If it was because he was substandard without them we have bought another problem.
    I have always felt sorry for this guy he was shoved into the limelight and given great expectations at a very young age.a white kid of his calibre would never have been exposed to that pressure that young.
    What else must be taken into account is that the Bulls have always been a hot bed of drug abuse
    ever since JanLocke put his head through a locker door in the change room,to Bees Roux going medieval on a metro cop.
    Give this guy a chance in a kinder environment and hopefully he realise all that wonderful promise for us
    Worst thing is we could have another Pierre Spies before and after a life threatening mysterious disease.

  • Comment 97, posted at 31.10.15 11:19:49 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 97) : problem is the two year ban is a joke and he did not use steroids at the Bulls he used it in France!!!!!
    I know they only get a slap on the wrist but the only way to stop youngsters using this stuff is to ban players who use anabolic steroids for life.
    Yes the Sharks did not do anything illegal to sign him but don’t think it was mortally right as I believe big teams like the Sharks should have a zero tolerance on users of anabolic steroids and should not sign any player who ever used the stuff!!!
    He was not using cough medication it was serious stuff and kids will see it as OK so if they catch me I’ll do my two years and then I’ll go play for Sharks or who ever and still earn the big money!!!!
    With the lack of a serious enough penalty for using the stuff I believe it’s up to the teams to send a clear message to youngsters that if you use this stuff you will not play professional rugby anywhere!!!!!!
    Anyway everyone seems to be forgetting that this is not his first positive test. Eventually he was found to be innocent because the powers that be gave him the product to use but after such a close call he should have been extra carefull and should have stayed away from this stuff like Basson did!!!!!!

  • Comment 98, posted at 31.10.15 12:03:02 by JD Reply
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  • So eaxactly what advantage do steroiods give a user over a non-user? I know that steroids are bad because that is what I hear, I also know they have apparent detrimental health (mental and physical) aspects but Im focusing on how they actuely make a user a better player.

  • Comment 99, posted at 31.10.15 13:50:14 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 86) : How bad is steroid use amongst school kids?

  • Comment 100, posted at 31.10.15 13:52:16 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 98) : There is a lot of supposition in what you are saying,all that is factual is what he has been found guilty of ,and appropriately punished for.
    He has done his time,now if we were to outright ban everyone guilty of using performance enhancers ,Goosen wouldn’t have played after high school,and Ackermann you;don’t have won the Currie Cup.
    Give him a chance and judge him on the playing field.

  • Comment 101, posted at 31.10.15 14:06:27 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 101) : Also if you are found doing something stupid you could go the way of chilli lose a year or more lose out on being a bok lose your market worth. He is a cautionary tale. I think it’s about how you look at it.

  • Comment 102, posted at 31.10.15 15:25:48 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 99) : Steroid health issues are mostly blown waaaaay out of proportion. In a healthy adult if done correctly they have very little health risk and avoidable side effects.

    In teenagers and anyone up to the age of around 26 (depend when you hit maturity) they have a lot more risk.
    1) They can stop natural production of testosterone completely (even after you stop taking them).
    2) They close growth plates in your bones prevent your skeleton from growing.
    3) They can shut down HPTA (Hypothalamic-Pituitary-Testicular Axis) google for explanation.
    4) Oral steroids obviously effect your kidney and liver. All steroids effect blood pressure and can cause heart problems.

    The benefits are obviously drastic increase in size and strength (fat or muscle depending on if you do it properly or not). They general increase protein synthesis making your muscles grow much faster. Steroids like that which Chili took can help maintain strength and muscle density during cutting, or in his case during injury layoff.
    other steroids can help in fat loss, muscle endurance, skeletal muscle growth…

    You need to remember that steroids like Dianabol were developed for Olympic athletes back in the day so they are not some dodgy shit thrown together, they were literally designed in labs by the US and Russians to improve their athletes.

    @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 100) : There is not a big name school in KZN which does not have first team players taking steroids. I can name both Sharks and Bok players who I know without any doubt took steroids while at school. It is by no means all school boys, some people out there are gifted to be genetic freaks, but for those of you who think 18 year olds can weight upwards of 100kgs you are extremely ignorant.

    People also need to realize that there is a big difference between performance enhancers and anabolic steroids, caffeine in high enough doses is a banned performance enhance, but has nothing at all on actual steroids.

  • Comment 103, posted at 31.10.15 15:27:40 by Seth101 Reply
    Valued Sharksworld Supporter Author
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  • I just put thin in perspective for myself thus. This man was the starting hooker rated highly enough to square off against the likes of Bismarck and Strauss. This man made bok hooker and would probably have played. He was international. Now regardless of what he did his resume is Damn impressive. So if you ask me if I want a Kyle Cooper who can currently not even qualify for a weak vodacom cup side or this man. I say I will gamble on chilli getting back to form before Cooper.

  • Comment 104, posted at 31.10.15 15:29:03 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • The rest is water under the bridge time served…

  • Comment 105, posted at 31.10.15 15:31:08 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • Interesting that both Bismarck and Burden are at Montpelier now. Jake White will have his hands full to keep them both happy.

  • Comment 106, posted at 31.10.15 15:31:52 by Ben Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 99) : http://www.aworkoutroutine.com/steroids-vs-natural/
    A comparison between natural vs on steroids.

  • Comment 107, posted at 31.10.15 15:33:29 by Seth101 Reply
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  • Took a break from Sharksworld, break was meant to last 4 months or until John did something that really impressed me. Well, this move has really impressed and given me joy. Thanks and well done to John Smit. Chiliboy has always been a solid hooker and will give us a lot in both the tight and the loose. At least we will continue with the Sharks tradition of having the best hooker in the country. He has surely learnt his lesson and has done his time. We would have been stupid not to go for him considering the quality we have lost in the tight five. It’s a good rugby and business decision. Not to even mention that there is going to be huge pressure on unions to be even more representative in the next 4 years. Now to get a solid number 4 that takes no nonsense. Then an creative 12 and an explosive 13. Someone like Pat Howard has always excited me. Never understood why the stormers let him go.

  • Comment 108, posted at 31.10.15 15:40:27 by GreatSharksays Reply

    Assistant coach
     
  • @Seth101 (Comment 103) : My passion and knowledge for the subject come from the prospective of someone who regretfully used steroids as a school boy, because I never had anyone tell me just how bad they were or just what effects they can have. Or for that matter how to use them properly.

  • Comment 109, posted at 31.10.15 15:42:08 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 109) : interesting to share that here. Brave, certainly. Wise? Perhaps not. Anyway…. do you not think that maybe your closeness to the subject is blurring your reasoning?

    At the very least, I’d argue it makes you a hypocrite for wanting to crucify somebody else for doing exactly the same thing you admit to doing. Unless you can somehow convince me that the only reason you decided to take steroids is because a Bok role model of yours (Chiliboy or someone else) did it?

  • Comment 110, posted at 31.10.15 16:07:25 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 110) : I am not ashamed to admit to it. I would think my experience as someone who has made this mistake, and who has recently seen how bad the use is in schools gives me better prospective of just how this will influence school boys to come.

    No I am not. One, I was not a professional sportsman, nor was I competitive in school (I never played rugby during and after using). I used it out of ignorance. All I knew at the time was that it was something that all the rugby players were using and that it would make me get bigger faster, other than that I was completely ignorant to effects of it.
    Chiliboy used it knowing exactly what it was for, as a professional sportsman trying to get an edge.

  • Comment 111, posted at 31.10.15 16:19:30 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 111) : As I have said many times on these article, my problem is not with his punishment, but with the Sharks signing him and losing all backing for their anti steroid campaigns.

  • Comment 112, posted at 31.10.15 16:30:05 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 111) : so what was your motivation for wanting to get bigger?

  • Comment 113, posted at 31.10.15 16:30:49 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 112) : Don’t you think the Sharks consulted the sponsors before this move? Maybe part of the campaign will involve Chiliboy going to schools and speaking against and discouraging the use of steroids.

  • Comment 114, posted at 31.10.15 16:39:29 by GreatSharksays Reply

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  • @Seth101 (Comment 112) : Set, I think you need to just take a breath here and wait to see what they say next week.

    They completely fucked up this announcement. There is a plan to turn Chiliboy into a serious “force for good” in this area, a strong ambassador for drug-free rugby. They just (for whatever stupid reason) chose not to include any of that in the announcement.

    Apologies if I came across as judgemental earlier. That’s not my place.

  • Comment 115, posted at 31.10.15 16:40:29 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 115) : Rob I do not have a problem with Chiliboy going to schools and telling school kids not to use steroids and band stuff what I have a problem with is the fact that the punishment for using these stuff is pathetic and will not stop a youngster from doping as after two years you’re bigger and stronger than your age group guys and will then be “rewarded for cheating”! Chiliboy had a close call with a previous positive test so should have know better but he still opted to cheat! Sorry bud but I don’t want players like that wearing the Black and White nor Green and Gold!

  • Comment 116, posted at 31.10.15 17:20:36 by JD Reply
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  • @GreatSharksays (Comment 114) : knowing the Sharks these days I must say no they most probably did not consulted with them before signing Chiliboy.

  • Comment 117, posted at 31.10.15 17:24:08 by JD Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 101) : Boet there stuff like cough medication that inhance performance and there’s steroids! Punishment should be in line with the crime, using anabolic steroids, etc should carry a life ban other stuff like cough medication less but the fact is if punishment is kept as it is now more and more schoolboys will be using this to get an edge as there is no long term (career) punishment!
    If they have to start regular testing of schoolboys I think some schools might be in some deep shit!!! As for me I think that people and teams like the Sharks should start asking SA rugby why there is no meaningful regular testing of schoolboys?!?! If we ignored it long enough it wouldn’t go away folks it will get worse and worse!!!

  • Comment 118, posted at 31.10.15 17:35:42 by JD Reply
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  • If you are not a professional sportsman use it if you want.

    If you are a pro and use steroids you are mentally weak and a cheat.

  • Comment 119, posted at 31.10.15 22:11:18 by Honey Badger Reply

    Honey BadgerCurrie Cup player
     
  • If doping is common among school boys in SA, then we know that most top level players playing today did it at some point in the careers and it is seriously hypocritical to want to crucify the one guy who got caught whilst hero worshipping the plenty who got away with it.

    Look in the mirror a little. If you are truly against doping, then why are you still watching rugby?

  • Comment 120, posted at 31.10.15 22:26:49 by fyndraai Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 118) : I think you are trying to retrospectively change the rules.

    Perhaps doping in rugby should carry a life ban? If it did, then we wouldn’t be having this discussion. I agree with Martin, though…. as long as coaches keep picking big kids and ignore skill, the incentive will be there for players to take short cuts. It’s one thing to say a life ban will stop anyone ever doing it, but the reality is, it probably won’t. You need to weigh up the risk of getting caught against the benefits and as I said, if you can’t get picked without the bulk this stuff gives you, lots of players will still do it.

    So change the system, change the rules, by all means, but don’t retrospectively crucify somebody under new rules you implement.

  • Comment 121, posted at 31.10.15 22:28:16 by robdylan Reply
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  • Who still watches the Tour de France?
    To me it was a hell of a lot more exciting back in the Armstrong days.

  • Comment 122, posted at 31.10.15 22:28:35 by fyndraai Reply
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  • If SA rugby ever effectively root out doping the Boks will permanently drop to 5th spot or lower in the rankings.

  • Comment 123, posted at 31.10.15 22:31:17 by fyndraai Reply
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  • @fyndraai (Comment 120) : I think there is a huge amount of truth in what you say.

    I think if you really start to dig, you will find that more than 50% of pro rugby players in the country have had something to help them at some point.

    Not to point fingers in any one direction, but 130kg of muscle at 18? Ja, right….

  • Comment 124, posted at 31.10.15 22:31:32 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 124) : we have had this discussion before,any decent coach should know if his players are taking performance enhancers.
    The coach should be monitoring the players performance levels.That is his or the conditioning coach’s responsibilty.
    Most dopers are doing it with the coach’s sanction.
    The coach should be held responsible for his players and should a player be found guilty the coach should be censured.That is the only way you are going to control it.
    Make it the coach’s responsibility.

  • Comment 125, posted at 31.10.15 23:03:29 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 125) : True. It’s bullshit that pro coaches don’t know. If not, why not? Are the medical and performance staff there to cover for them?

  • Comment 126, posted at 31.10.15 23:20:59 by Spirit of Rugby Reply
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  • This conversation has been fascinating to date, thanks for some really insightful contributions. Next question, how do school boys afford steroids in the first place?

    I know a bodybuilder who uses (but it’s hardly a secret in that field, all the pros do) and the costs are astronomical!

  • Comment 127, posted at 01.11.15 13:31:46 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 127) : Stop asking such relevant questions.

  • Comment 128, posted at 01.11.15 13:44:01 by GreatSharksays Reply

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  • Just to be very clear, Seth is right about a lot he wrote about Dianabol, and the widespread use among olympic athletes in the late 60s. However, the drug was not developed for this purpose, it was originally developed in the 1950s by Ciba as a possible treatment for severe burn victims and severely injured people to help promote tissue regrowth. The US decision to administer Dianabol to its weightlifters was a direct response to the obvious use by the Soviet lifters.

    @vanmartin (Comment 127) : Dianabol has been around for a long time and is cheap, it is available online without prescriptions, and countries like Mexico do not even require a prescription so you can purchase from companies in Mexico and have shipped to SA or anywhere else and it does not cost much.

  • Comment 129, posted at 01.11.15 14:20:54 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • Interestingly, it seems like the widespread use by high school athletes in SA is about what it was in the USA about 35 years ago when I was in high school. Believe me, it was easy to get then, and quite cheap. Finding a doctor to prescribe it and use health insurance to purchase was also easy to do. Then we saw the huge influx of HCG (Human Growth Hormone) in high school kids, and the negative side effects of steroids are almost negligible when compared to the side effects of HCG on growing humans. When that use got out of hand, the US really started to crack down on the use in high schools. However, I assure you, anything you want is still available from the sleazy weightlifter at the gym where you work out.

  • Comment 130, posted at 01.11.15 14:26:34 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • The crazy part is these kids in high school knew how to use these drugs effectively for their sport, knowing how to cycle properly, use of female hormones to increase and maintain testosterone production during and especially after completion of a cycle, etc. It was nuts to see, they were all experts, so someone was teaching them all this stuff, there was no internet back then. It is truly unbelievable when I look back, I had some personal experience, and believe me, none of these people or coaches care about these kids future, they only want to use what talent they can get out of them right now, it is horrible.

  • Comment 131, posted at 01.11.15 14:31:36 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 131) :

    I think the truth is that anyone who really cares about a kid would never encourage him to play professional rugby or football. With or without performance enhancers, the health hazards are obvious.

  • Comment 132, posted at 01.11.15 14:43:41 by fyndraai Reply
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  • Sometime ago there was a thread on this blog where everyone were posting personal messages of support to Pieter-Steph du Toit because of him being injured.

    “We love you Pieter. Get healthy soon!”

    Events since, have shown that the posters actually cared about Pieter-Steph the Sharks player much more than Pieter-Steph the person.

  • Comment 133, posted at 01.11.15 14:50:16 by fyndraai Reply
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  • @fyndraai (Comment 133) : Look, while I think that is true of some of the posters, there are many that expressed frustration that he went back on his verbal word in the newspaper article, but still wished him well in his future at WP and the Boks. I think there are many posters here (not all) that do indeed care about the person.

  • Comment 134, posted at 01.11.15 15:08:14 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 134) :

    I formed my opinion on this one at the time. Long before he signed for WP.

    Think about it. A guy gets a serious injury whilst playing rugby. The reason we wish him to get well soon, is so that he can play again, where he most likely will get injured again. Is that rational behavior if we cared about the person? No! We would have urged him to quit the activity that led to the injury.

    The reaction after he signed for WP, served only to highlight a truth that already existed. Whatever we like to believe, WE FANS care only about the players as players, not as persons.

    Coaches and trainers have much more invested in them as players than us.
    Not saying that anyone is pro-drugs. Probably they would all rather do without it, if only they could be certain everyone else will do the same.

  • Comment 135, posted at 01.11.15 16:20:23 by fyndraai Reply
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  • I also share the sentiments of some on here. I was never a fan (Even before the doping scandal) but I think he might just add value in a position we are seriously lacking. Hope his past does not haunt him and that he actually goes out to prove to everyone what he is capable of.

  • Comment 136, posted at 01.11.15 16:52:04 by Farlington Reply

    FarlingtonSuper Rugby player
     
  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 129) : Can’t be what this guy I know is using if that’s the case. Two years ago it cost him over R40000 for a six week cycle. He hasn’t mentioned recent costs but I was surprised how expensive it was.

  • Comment 137, posted at 01.11.15 18:27:56 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 129) : I stand corrected, thanks I didn’t know that. HGH is also used at school here, it’s just far more costly so far more uncommon. It’s mainly the cheap easy to get steroids that guys use. an entire course of Dbol (5-10kgs of muscle) will set you back R650.

    @Dancing Bear (Comment 131) : In my opinion it’s almost verging on something similar to teach abstiance vs sex ed, in a way it would almost be better to teach kids how to do it properly and safely. Since they are going to do it regardless.
    Right now there is no where near big enough consequences to prevent kids using. One out of 100s of thousands of rugby players gets caught and a two year ban (and straight after a new club with a bi salary) that’s hardly going to make you worry about using.

    @vanmartin (Comment 137) : No idea what that guy is using, even HGH which is by far the most expensive is only a couple of thousand.
    Your every day cycle of Testosterone and dianabol for 12 weeks would be around R2k.

    The problem currently is while there is theoretically a system in place to test school boys it barely ever happens, this is because; one the tests are expensive and two there is so much red tap. A school rugby player who gets tested, even if a random test, is allowed to request that not only his parents be present but that a lawyer be present too.

    Another big problem is that schools actively seek the biggest players and give them scholarships, why would they be proactive about testing them when it could hurt their investment?

    @robdylan (Comment 113) : For me it was looks. It’s a ripple effect, the pro players take them to get big, the school boy players take it so the can make into pro rugby, and then you have everyone else looking at the big ‘cool’ first team players and it’s very easy to think “o I want to look like that too”.

    @robdylan (Comment 124) : 50% is low balling it.

    @robdylan (Comment 115) : Hopefully they do something, but at the end of the day I highly doubt he was hired with that in mind. A struggling team saw the opportunity to sign a ex big name player and grasped at it, dealing with the publicity fallout would have been an after thought.

    Completely fine, I just shared my experience to show my prospective on the subject.

  • Comment 138, posted at 01.11.15 20:06:22 by Seth101 Reply
    Valued Sharksworld Supporter Author
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  • Another in the not happy camp. Fizzle and pop signing after Bismarck and his background with doping leaves a sour taste in the mouth. Not very clever by the Sharks but it speaks volumes about the competence of the current management.

  • Comment 139, posted at 02.11.15 00:41:00 by Gold_Must_Go Reply

    Gold's MemberTeam captain
     
  • Interesting that people want to give him a second chance as he made a mistake. He didnt make a mistake- he deliberately cheated the sport. If we condone this cheating what other forms are we happy with, match fixing ok? And giving him a second chance is rewarding him and showing youngsters that its ok to take steroids…IF you get caught, the worst is a possible 2yr ban but dont worry you will still get a contract after that. Sorry ive seen frost hand the rampant steroid use in schools and clubs because of the pathetic punishments handed down and guys like this being rewarded. I will never support him in a sharks jersey

  • Comment 140, posted at 02.11.15 08:09:31 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @Seth101 (Comment 138) : I did a little googling and came across this article on pro bodybuilders. Seems that the numbers I mentioned may even be on the more conservative side: https://www.t-nation.com/steroids/steroids-what-pro-bodybuilders-are-really-using

    Looks like bodybuilders play in a whole other league.

    By the way, thanks for sharing Seth. Your story certainly brings a relevant perspective to the whole debate.

  • Comment 141, posted at 02.11.15 08:13:05 by vanmartin Reply
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  • My apologies for forgetting who but someone on this site was going to undertake an in depth study on this issue of steroids and perhaps he can shed some updated light on his findings but my concern ,I’m not going into the steroid thing ,is that this chap is a discard and hasn’t played in two years and the Sharks sign him up,really,is it now a case of bottom feeders signing a bottom feeder,eish

  • Comment 142, posted at 02.11.15 08:54:05 by benji Reply
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  • @fyndraai (Comment 132) : Aint that the truth.

  • Comment 143, posted at 02.11.15 08:57:17 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @fyndraai (Comment 133) : As we would say when I was growing up….Durrrr hey. This is a Sharks website not a Mother Teresa fan page.

    Have a close look at my avatar to try and understand the final sentiment expressed to PSdT on here.

  • Comment 144, posted at 02.11.15 09:02:31 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 140) : Has steroid use come to a grinding halt since Chillipip was caught and banned?

  • Comment 145, posted at 02.11.15 09:14:57 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 141) : Do these guys privates really shrivel up and become useless?

  • Comment 146, posted at 02.11.15 09:16:20 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 103) : Thanks for the explanation.

  • Comment 147, posted at 02.11.15 09:17:42 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 145) : Most definitely not. The fact that there are now 3 guys in the sharks squad known to have taken shows youngsters that there are benefits to doping.

  • Comment 148, posted at 02.11.15 09:44:21 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 140) : agree with you 110% but seemingly some people think it’s as if he just made an innocent little mistake almost like taking one spoon of cough medication!!!
    With the current penalties there is almost no real longterm penalty for using steroids! Use it get bigger and stronger than the players not using it and if you test positive you first claim you did not know and if they don’t buy it do your 2 years and get rewarded with a contract!!!!!!

  • Comment 149, posted at 02.11.15 09:48:27 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 149) : Im def with you on this. Im just wondering what other forms of cheating would be condoned? Match fixing?, Bribing officials? Breaking the law and cheating the game should result in a lifetime ban. I just feel for those guys that put that hard work into the Sharks anti-doping campaigns for it to all be worthless now

  • Comment 150, posted at 02.11.15 09:52:30 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @vanmartin (Comment 141) : O yea if you looking at the pros then that is a completely different story, there is a single drug used in the off season for cyclists called AICAR (http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/01/science/sci-couchpill1) which will set you back “thousands of dollars a day” buying it from research labs.

  • Comment 151, posted at 02.11.15 09:52:42 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 146) : Not really, during cycle your body stops producing testosterone so yes your balls shrink, but once finished if done correctly and safely your body restarts natural production and they go back to normal.

  • Comment 152, posted at 02.11.15 09:54:48 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 149) : Your point is taken,but you miss the main point.According to the law the Sharks are entitled to sign him,he has done his time.
    Maybe the law should be different and then anyone guilty of taking performance enhancers,should be banned for life.Goodbye Ackerman,goodbye Goosen, goodbye Chilli,but its not the case.
    Judge him on the field.

  • Comment 153, posted at 02.11.15 09:56:49 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 153) : Lol you say those names like we should feel bad and change our minds? Yes good bye, cheating is cheating and should result in you being banned for life.

    And you’re correct the are allowed to sign him, doesn’t mean they should have. They are a desperate team happy to lose credibility in attempt to improve, nothing more.

  • Comment 154, posted at 02.11.15 10:01:01 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 140) : @JD (Comment 149) : I’m not going to repeat what I have already said…but if you will read my comment again, you will see that I don’t think it was an innocent mistake…I believe the high technical and academic term I used was “deliberate dof thing”…read my comment 27 again and you will see what my philosophical and theological view is…and if that is my philosophical and theological view I will always try to let it guide my practice…

  • Comment 155, posted at 02.11.15 10:01:48 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 153) : Also Goosen wasn’t banned for steroids, he was banned for 3 months for a ‘stimulant’. You do realise there is a difference right?

  • Comment 156, posted at 02.11.15 10:06:30 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 149) : @SheldonK (Comment 150) : I actually agree with your point about the punishment being to light…but then the target of your passionate cries for change should not be Chilliboy or even his signing…your target should be the lawmakers in rugby. The fact is Chilliboy has served his time…I would expect him to show remorse, change his ways and be involved in anti-doping programmes. If that doesn’t happen, I’m with you guys…if it does, I’m very much not with you guys…

  • Comment 157, posted at 02.11.15 10:06:40 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 148) : Who are the 3.

  • Comment 158, posted at 02.11.15 10:10:25 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 155) : I saw what you read and you fully entitled to want to give the guy a second chance as its your belief that he has made up for what he has done.
    Its just my belief that signing him shows every young player out there that taking steroids will get you ahead even if in the slight chance you get caught. So sorry but personally i cannot support this as its not the message id want to send my kids or even those i coach.

  • Comment 159, posted at 02.11.15 10:10:38 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 145) : @SheldonK (Comment 148) : with a pathetic 2 year ban it will never stop.

  • Comment 160, posted at 02.11.15 10:11:26 by JD Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 158) : haha now i dont think i should be sharing that as its not my story to tell. But yes there are definitely now 3 guys in the squad that have taken before. Probably more i dont know about.

  • Comment 161, posted at 02.11.15 10:11:53 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @pastorshark (Comment 157) : Yes the bans should be longer. And yes i can moan to the law makers. My unhappiness is that a team that i support and a team that has an anti-doping campaign went and signed a guy that is a two time offender and is still serving his ban. It doesnt matter who the player is- its the message it sends to the youth particularly in Durban and SA that i totally disagree with.

  • Comment 162, posted at 02.11.15 10:14:03 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @The hound (Comment 153) : yes the Sharks did nothing legally wrong point is because it is legally right does not make it mortally right!!! Message it will sent to others is OK do your time and we will sign you!!!!
    Just tell me on what form he was signed?!?!?!?! Form of April 2014 or shall we just call it reputation!!!!!!!!!!

  • Comment 163, posted at 02.11.15 10:14:32 by JD Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 161) : I can name names over and above your 3, but I won’t. Most of these guys have no choice, they wouldn’t be at the level they are without them and we as a country would be a lot worse at rugby.

  • Comment 164, posted at 02.11.15 10:15:48 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 159) : With exactly the same set of facts you are talking about, the message I would give my kids (by talking to them and not just letting them watch the news) is very different to the one you describe…

  • Comment 165, posted at 02.11.15 10:16:36 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 155) : not you but some others seems to think it was a little innocent mistake.

  • Comment 166, posted at 02.11.15 10:17:10 by JD Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 162) : I guess the Sharks feel stronger about recreational drug use as apposed to professional drug use. ;)

  • Comment 167, posted at 02.11.15 10:17:54 by FireTheLooser Reply

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  • @Seth101 (Comment 164) : So do we just accept, move on and hand a kid a needle? Genuinely asking cos its become a lot more socially acceptable and the ease of access is improving

  • Comment 168, posted at 02.11.15 10:18:45 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @JD (Comment 163) : I think you mean morally…we would want this to be mortal… :mrgreen:

  • Comment 169, posted at 02.11.15 10:19:30 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 156) : You are arguing against the law, ,and there are different sentences for breaking the law in different ways players cheat,but no law that bans players for life,for performance enhancing.
    Are you are saying the law must be changed for Chilli and he must be the first player banned for life,because that is what it sounds like.

  • Comment 170, posted at 02.11.15 10:19:42 by The hound Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 165) : haha talking is great but they will laugh at you and say the proof is there- take steroids to get a step ahead and you will be rewarded. No amount of talking can change those facts

  • Comment 171, posted at 02.11.15 10:19:53 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 161) : Presuming Chilliboy is one of them, do you also wish the other 2 to be axed from the squad.

  • Comment 172, posted at 02.11.15 10:21:17 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 165) : It’s got nothing to do with the message you attempt to give and everything to do with how it is perceived by the kids.

    And at the end of the day no matter what you or the Sharks or anyone says to them, it’s not going to change the fact that for a lot of people it is a requirement if they want to play at that level.

  • Comment 173, posted at 02.11.15 10:21:32 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 161) : Are you also not supporting those three guys?

  • Comment 174, posted at 02.11.15 10:21:41 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 164) : I’d rather lose honestly than win by cheating!!!!! Anyway it’s not as if we are winning a lot of games so not only are they cheating they’re fucking failing at cheating as well!!!!!

  • Comment 175, posted at 02.11.15 10:21:43 by JD Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 141) : Quite an insightful article – have you read the article about “natural bodybuilding”?

    One quote from it kind of puts doping doping by pro sportsmen into perspective:

    “Lance Armstrong, the most drug tested athlete in history, never failed a drug test and now admits to using performance enhancing drugs. These guys and gals are competing in sports with a whole lot of money and fame on the line, and they’re beating the “gold standard” of drug testing procedures.”

  • Comment 176, posted at 02.11.15 10:23:14 by FireTheLooser Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 171) : Actually, they won’t…but maybe that just says something about the power of building good relationships with those you’re trying to teach something…

  • Comment 177, posted at 02.11.15 10:23:30 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 169) : maybe maybe not?!?!?! Hahaha ja missed that one, just a little innocent mistake! ;-D

  • Comment 178, posted at 02.11.15 10:23:34 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 178) : :mrgreen:

  • Comment 179, posted at 02.11.15 10:23:54 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 170) : I am saying the law should be changed for everyone who takes STEROIDS. Their should be a tier system in performance enhancers, tier one 2 years, 2 3 years,….

  • Comment 180, posted at 02.11.15 10:23:57 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 166) : Fair enough…

  • Comment 181, posted at 02.11.15 10:24:45 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 180) : And no the law can’t retroactively be changed, it should be changed for future offenders.

  • Comment 182, posted at 02.11.15 10:25:13 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 172) : @pastorshark (Comment 174) : Yes they should be axed. And yes i wont support any guy i know to have taken. If you happy to live with it thats your choice. I just personally dont condone cheating.

  • Comment 183, posted at 02.11.15 10:26:21 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @FireTheLooser (Comment 176) : There is no such thing as natural bodybuilding, even the natural competitions are a complete farce.

  • Comment 184, posted at 02.11.15 10:27:06 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 162) : @Seth101 (Comment 164) : Wait a moment here. Chilli has been banned for almost 2 years and in this time players have still been useing, but now that he has been signed by the Sharks (or any other team) for that matter the wrong message will be sent to the users. That doesnt make any sense to me, it would if use had dropped off dramatically because of him being banned but that is clearly not the case so I dont think it actually sends out any message to the youngsters.

    I get the moral issues and standpoint and also what the drugfree drivers must be thinking.

  • Comment 185, posted at 02.11.15 10:28:29 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • On the complete other end of the scale, maybe any and all performance enhancers should be legal and we can turn rugby into a thunderdome like sport :mrgreen: :lol:

  • Comment 186, posted at 02.11.15 10:28:47 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 185) : Well exactly the point, who is going to be scared by the very unlikely possibility of getting a two year ban?

  • Comment 187, posted at 02.11.15 10:30:03 by Seth101 Reply
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  • So it seems a lot of the opinion here is that steroid use is fine as long as you serve your time.
    So im just curious…
    If a sharks player is caught match fixing and intentionally throwing games how long a ban would you be happy with till he is hundreds to play again?
    What about bribing officials?
    What about a guy playing kzn u19 thats actually 25?
    If 1 cheating guy gets a chance then they all should if we being fair

  • Comment 188, posted at 02.11.15 10:30:22 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 171) : How exactly has he been rewarded for cheating? He has lost major income, lost his spot and probably future as a Bok, I bet it’s had a personal impact. Signing him now is no reward for cheating. I agree that those who do cheat gain an unfair advantage and get a reward that way…and I absolutely think efforts to catch guys should be improved and punishments increased so that they whole setup inckudes much more effective deterrence

  • Comment 189, posted at 02.11.15 10:30:34 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 180) : Well morally there is no difference cheating is cheating,legally there is a difference and it is in place.But very often players are found guilty for the minor offence because they have used the more lenient substance to mask the more serious one.
    I agree there should be one punishment for any form of cheating a life ban,and that goes for the coach as well,but its not the case and this boy is now legally free to play according to the law .
    Judge him on the field.

  • Comment 190, posted at 02.11.15 10:31:27 by The hound Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 185) : So because others have been using adding 1 more doesnt make a difference? what about 3 more? 6 more? As ive said, if you condone it then thats on you. i dont

  • Comment 191, posted at 02.11.15 10:31:48 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @Seth101 (Comment 187) : Why did he only get two years, whereas that fellow at the bulls (former Tuks captain) received a 5 year ban?

  • Comment 192, posted at 02.11.15 10:32:12 by FireTheLooser Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 171) : How exactly has he been rewarded for cheating? He has lost major income, lost his spot and probably future as a Bok, I bet it’s had a personal impact. Signing him now is no reward for cheating. I agree that those who do cheat gain an unfair advantage and get a reward that way…and I absolutely think efforts to catch guys should be improved and punishments increased so that the whole setup includes much more effective deterrence. I think, though, that the amount that Chilli has lost is real and should be used in actively discouraging people from doing this…

  • Comment 193, posted at 02.11.15 10:32:32 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 189) : Can very easily argue that he never had a future with the boks since he wasn’t being picked anyway. And Tank threw out a figure of R1.5 million P.A, so he is not hurting for money if that is true.

  • Comment 194, posted at 02.11.15 10:33:12 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 189) : im sorry but getting a sharks contract is rewarding a guy. i really dont know how else to see it.

  • Comment 195, posted at 02.11.15 10:33:35 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 188) : How can you interpret what we are saying as “it is fine to use steroids?” Come on, that is not what we are saying at all…

  • Comment 196, posted at 02.11.15 10:33:53 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @FireTheLooser (Comment 192) : Well that is a very good question. Perhaps SARU punishment vs IRB punishment?

  • Comment 197, posted at 02.11.15 10:34:05 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 150) : Do teams and players not cheat all the time – Nick Groom (and most other scrumhalves) cheat a few times in every game they play by putting the ball under their locks feet at scrumtime – a minor offence when compared to shooting up. And what about the refs that dont blow the transgression – they too are cheating.

  • Comment 198, posted at 02.11.15 10:34:25 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 195) : Well, then let’s leave it there and agree to disagree…

  • Comment 199, posted at 02.11.15 10:34:39 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 183) : Again…at no stage have I said that I condone cheating or that I am in favour of those guys you know about to do what they do…so please get off that particular horse…

  • Comment 200, posted at 02.11.15 10:37:04 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 198) : Well that’s why punishments should scale to the crime. And my argument is that a 2 year ban is nowhere near enough for steroid use.

  • Comment 201, posted at 02.11.15 10:37:29 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 198) : That is a shocking comparison. That fact that you use that just says everything. We can disagree no problem.

  • Comment 202, posted at 02.11.15 10:39:18 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @Seth101 (Comment 201) : Agreed…

  • Comment 203, posted at 02.11.15 10:41:18 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 197) : …could also be the type of substance used…and I’d still like to know what exactly makes these substances illegal, vs. the legal powders and shakes and vitamins etc.

    For instance, I read on that link that vanmartin posted that the bodybuilders use insulin as a performance enhancing drug – so a guy like Kyle Cooper would seemingly have an unfair advantage because he uses insulin.

    Where and why is the line drawn?

  • Comment 204, posted at 02.11.15 10:42:24 by FireTheLooser Reply

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  • @pastorshark (Comment 196) : u say you dont condone it but u back the sharks contracting a guy who is a 2 time offender. Thats condoning it. And fair enough if you and others wish to. I just never will.

  • Comment 205, posted at 02.11.15 10:42:25 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @FireTheLooser (Comment 204) : Well that is a huge debate, is someone who has a particular deficiency and uses to supplement a deficiency then getting added benefits? I’d argue no, if you are using it at the level that you are prescribed to supplement your deficiency and not more then fine. If you then start taking more than prescribed you are cheating.

    Natural ‘powders’ do very different things depending on what they are, but there are huge gulfs between their benefits and benefits of banned substances, as well as huge gulfs in side effects.

  • Comment 206, posted at 02.11.15 10:47:35 by Seth101 Reply
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  • Can I just try and explain what I am trying to say by using a completely different example:
    I know a guy who was bust for financial fraud…did some jail time, had (and probably still has to) pay a fine, lost his job, lost pretty much everything. His crime was deliberate and it was stupid. He paid the price. I am involved with an organisation that, several years ago, made the decision to employ this man. We did it because he showed genuine remorse, undertook not to do it again and was prepared to be subjected to rigorous and regular checks and balances to ensure that he did not do the same again. He has built up his life again, has been a brilliant employee and we in no way regret having appointed him. At the same time, neither this organisation nor its trustees in any way condone fraud. The fact that we employed this man means we were prepared to give him a second chance, not that we condone what he did. And we communicated that clearly and well to the organisation and to its clients/stakeholders. We have a course that employees and others can attend about honesty in the work place and he has contributed to it.
    What I am saying about Chilliboy is that it should be possible to treat him in exactly the same way:
    - I maintain that anyone deserves a second chance.
    - I would insist that there must be remorse.
    - I am not so naive as to think that expressed remorse itself is either necessarily real or enough…therefore the person must be prepared to submit themselves to the necessary checks and balances to ensure they don’t do what they did before.
    - And I would always look for ways to use them in “preventative programmes”…
    That is what I would be prepared to do with Chilliboy. It is also the reason why I think the Sharks stuffed up the whole announcement. But I think they can still do something about that. I would expect all of the above to be applied by the Sharks in Chilliboy’s case.
    That is how I see it. It’s fine if others see it differently, but please don’t belittle my position by superficially referring to it as simply condoning the crime…

  • Comment 207, posted at 02.11.15 10:55:52 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 187) : I thought the point was that by signing him it would send the wrong message to the youngsters – but this is clearly not the case beacuase they are already using and couldnt give a damn if we signed him or not.

  • Comment 208, posted at 02.11.15 10:56:33 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 207) : I see where you are coming from, the big difference is that man was not a public figure which many young people see on TV and aspire to be like. His crimes were his own, a professional sports man has not only himself, but his public reputation and influence to think about.

  • Comment 209, posted at 02.11.15 10:58:58 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 206) : You are very judgemental in your attitude,and basically you are basing your premise on the fact that all performance enhancement has a common base..
    But the problem exists on two levels mental and physical.
    Lots of schoolboy steroid abuse has its roots in mental insecurity and is an actual mental condition bigorexia,the need for size.
    A lot of professional abuse is a medical one,where injured players use steroids to heal quicker,Chilli was randomly tested while out injured.
    I still maintain who ever was supervising his physical rehab must have been aware that he was using,and if they weren’t what kind of a job were they doing.

  • Comment 210, posted at 02.11.15 11:00:48 by The hound Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 208) : Ever hear the saying “adding insult to injury”? I am sure you have. Yes it is currently bad, and this move will add to the belief that there is no reason not to.

  • Comment 211, posted at 02.11.15 11:01:32 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 191) : I havent read a single comment here where a blogger condones doping.

  • Comment 212, posted at 02.11.15 11:02:52 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 210) : Getting big for sport or to look good are two very diferent things. But as I mentioned above the one drives the other. When you have school boy rugby players getting big to do well you have others getting big to look as good as those rugby players.

    You might be right, it is very possible the coaches and team doctors know, but it is also possible they don’t. The steroid that chilly took will not necessarily make you gain or lose a lot of weight, it will help you maintain muscle mass. So unless they did muscle density scans and saw his muscle mass not changing, they could have just assumed that he was maintaining wait because muscle was converting to fat.

  • Comment 213, posted at 02.11.15 11:06:04 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 209) : I’m not going to say more about this. My position is clear. I will add, though, that you are making an assumption about this guy that is just not true. Just because you don’t know him, doesn’t mean that no one else does, that he has no influence and that his crimes were his own. I would also think that the more public the figure, the more effective the “preventative programme” could be…

  • Comment 214, posted at 02.11.15 11:06:07 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 202) : You mentioned the word cheating, Im pointing out cheating that takes place openly game in and game out. Is cheating right or wrong regardless of the scale that it takes on. Is it not sanctimonious to bleat about one form of cheating while ignoring other forms no matter how small they are.

  • Comment 215, posted at 02.11.15 11:09:11 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 214) : Seeing someone getting caught and harshly punished is far scarier than someone telling you not to do something, even if they did it themselves and regret it. Why on earth would I listen to someone telling me not to do something when they did it and currently have a good job with a huge salary? Hardly a deterrent.

  • Comment 216, posted at 02.11.15 11:10:48 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 207) : Well good for you hiring him. Did you have to fire anyone to hire him? As with the sharks case a hooker will probably be let go. Also did you know that having committed fraud he is no eligible to serve as a director of the company- there is a reason for that. If another of your employees commits fraud will you hire him back? I have no problem with you giving guys a second chance. But at the same time you cant complain if others then do the same offense, and you should also give them a chance.

  • Comment 217, posted at 02.11.15 11:12:30 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 215) : I think he was right in saying the are completely incomparable on the scale of cheating, and trying to compare them shows a lack of compassion for just how serious the steroid issue is. Technically you are right though, but as I said, punishments should fit the crime.

  • Comment 218, posted at 02.11.15 11:13:18 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 215) : You compare putting the ball in skew at a scrum to doping. Come on man i cant take you seriously doing that.

  • Comment 219, posted at 02.11.15 11:15:02 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 217) : give the pastor a break man,he bases his whole life on giving people second chances,it is the essence of his chosen ethos.
    You on the other hand are a very hard man and I hope you live by your own rules,pay your T,V licence,your traffic fines,and you would go down well in Saudi,where its forty lashes for drinking a hand for stealing

  • Comment 220, posted at 02.11.15 11:20:22 by The hound Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 216) : @SheldonK (Comment 217) : Both of you are being patronising and are making ill-informed comments based on assumptions which are untrue. Rather don’t do that…

  • Comment 221, posted at 02.11.15 11:24:08 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 221) : Look I understand that we can’t agree due to a difference in belief and I respect that. I don’t mean to be patronizing, and I am sorry if I come across that way.
    I obviously have very strong feelings on the subject, as someone who has first hand experience.

  • Comment 222, posted at 02.11.15 11:26:11 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 220) : By no means am i perfect but i do try not to be dishonest and break the law or cheat at the game i play. Im all for people giving others a second chance when they have been dishonest and broken the law and cheated. But those same people must not turn around when others do exactly the same and want a second chance. Funny those that want to give Chilliboy a second chance after he was caught doping are the same people that want a public hanging of Gary Gold as his team lost a few games. Just interesting

  • Comment 223, posted at 02.11.15 11:27:07 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 219) : Are they both against the laws of the game or not, are they both cheating knowingly or not. Cheating is cheating. Once again I did not enter the word into the conversation and ask what form of cheating the bloggers will next condone or not.

    BTW putting a skew ball in a scrum may be a minor cheat but it did cost the Lions the Currie Cup last year.

  • Comment 224, posted at 02.11.15 11:27:59 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 222) : No worries…

  • Comment 225, posted at 02.11.15 11:29:11 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 223) : Ummm…I hardly think you can accuse me of being prepared to give Chilliboy a second chance but not others…I try to be consistent in what I say and practice. I am certain you won’t be able to find an example where I have acted contrary to that. And in the only example you gave in that comment, Gary Gold, you know very well that I have been one of the few guys to back you up on that…I have been beaten black and blue for trying to say some objective things against the ” GOLD OUT” brigade…

  • Comment 226, posted at 02.11.15 11:33:29 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 223) : You are wrong on the Gold thing, both Seth and Gold Must Go, his biggest detractors, are firmly in your corner on this one.

  • Comment 227, posted at 02.11.15 11:44:54 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 227) : Thanks…

  • Comment 228, posted at 02.11.15 11:47:18 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 224) : Again if u comparing a scrum feed to doping we arguing on different levels

  • Comment 229, posted at 02.11.15 11:47:48 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @Seth101 (Comment 228) : ;-) :mrgreen:

  • Comment 230, posted at 02.11.15 11:48:10 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 229) : Im focusing on the word you introduced, it fully encompasses both – cheating.

  • Comment 231, posted at 02.11.15 11:50:54 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 227) : u missing the point. they want to Gold and Chilliboy out- thats consistent so happy with that. Those that want Chilliboy to be given a chance but then want Gold out are the ones that arent consistent.

  • Comment 232, posted at 02.11.15 11:51:43 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 231) : I hope the next player that gets caught doping also uses the defense that scrumhalves put the ball in skew so they should be let off too.

  • Comment 233, posted at 02.11.15 11:54:16 by SheldonK Reply

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  • FYI I don’t give a damn about Gold, he is useless but we can’t do better so it’s a lose lose, might as well keep him.

  • Comment 234, posted at 02.11.15 11:54:52 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Seth101 (Comment 228) : @SheldonK (Comment 229) : You guys are clearly passionate about this subject and also clearly in the know about what and who is using – have you in any way taken it to another level in trying to get it stopped? Genuine question.

  • Comment 235, posted at 02.11.15 12:06:59 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 235) : Nope i hav not taken it to another level. Im not on the Sharks rugby board so i dont get a say there. Nor do i get a say in World Rugby and the doping offences sentences handed out. All i can do is tell the guys that i coach that if i find out any are using id never pick them. I also make my stance clear to guys that i do know that use and play club rugby.

  • Comment 236, posted at 02.11.15 12:14:23 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 235) : What by naming names and maybe getting one or two people caught? No. The only way it will change is if the consequences are bad enough to scare people away from doing it. And there is very little I can do about that.

  • Comment 237, posted at 02.11.15 12:14:57 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 232) : Well Im not a fan of either Gold or Chili but I think it would be folly to get rid of Gold without being able to replace him with anyone better – that would go for any coach. As for Chili, he will have served a sentence and will be free to ply his trade anywhere in the world and that will be at the Sharks. By then it will be in the past and he will try and move on with his life, hopefully with remorse and able to contribute in a positive way to stopping lighties with dreams of playing top level rugby and insecurity issues to reach their dreams in a drug free way.

  • Comment 238, posted at 02.11.15 12:15:33 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 233) : That may just work. :twisted:

  • Comment 239, posted at 02.11.15 12:18:12 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 236) : @Seth101 (Comment 237) : Not necessary to name names but surely campaigning, petitioning the authorities etc would be a way of getting the message across.

  • Comment 240, posted at 02.11.15 12:22:06 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 236) : Its May 2016, Chiliboy pitches up at your club for practice, what do you do?

  • Comment 241, posted at 02.11.15 12:23:21 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 236) : Can you tell if any of the guys you coach are taking performance enhancers? At what level do you coach?

  • Comment 242, posted at 02.11.15 12:23:47 by The hound Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 240) : Possibly, although neither the IRB nor SARU have ever been all that receptive of criticism or advice.

  • Comment 243, posted at 02.11.15 12:27:51 by Seth101 Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 241) : Ask him why the water bottles are filled…

  • Comment 244, posted at 02.11.15 12:29:03 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @The hound (Comment 242) : its school boy club level so at that age its easier to tel when performance spikes etc. At the top level its a lot harder to tell as the margins are smaller.

  • Comment 245, posted at 02.11.15 12:30:04 by SheldonK Reply

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