Richard Ferguson

The start of the big slide?


Written by Richard Ferguson (Richard Ferguson)

Posted in :All Blacks, Argentina, Original Content, Springboks, The Rugby Championship, Wallabies on 12 Sep 2016 at 15:31
Tagged with : , , , , , , , , , ,

The Springboks have slipped to fourth on the IRB World Rankings after their loss to Australia at the weekend. Is this the beginning of the end?

The team replacing the Springboks is the same Wallabies team, funnily enough, who themsleves have won only once in their last 7 encounters. Let that just sink in…

The Springboks are now supposedly the fourth best team in the World, and can count themselves lucky that no other International teams are in action at present. They lie ahead of the Welsh in fifth, who gave the All Blacks their only true test so far this year, during the June Internationals. Ireland are in sixth with the ever improving Argentinians in seventh. They still have to face Australia home and away and could very well make up some places over the next month.

There should be very little movement in Rankings until the end of the year, when all the Southern Hemispere teams visit Europe, and depending how those European teams do, the Springboks could very well find themselves in a much lower ranking come the new year.

Wales face Australia, Argentina, Japan and South Africa – a few wins there, especially against the Springboks, could very well culminate in them leapfrogging the Boks.



112 Comments

  • Somber moments and times indeed

  • Comment 1, posted at 12.09.16 15:35:23 by Henkb Reply
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  • Enough with all the doom and gloom….

  • Comment 2, posted at 12.09.16 15:37:22 by Sharkfinn Reply

    Under 21 player
     
  • The Boks used to be good at lineouts, driving mauls, and pretty solid at scrum time. They played a limited game plan but executed it accurately and smashed teams in the tackle and rucks and mauls. The Boks won a lot of games playing this way. Suddenly all that is chucked out the window for a new expansive attacking game plan we need to embrace and as a result the Boks look completely clueless at doing anything. All that was needed was tweak to the gameplan that included a good scrum, lineout,driving maul and territory game. A complete overhaul was not needed but public and press pressure called for a change and well this is the result…

  • Comment 3, posted at 12.09.16 15:40:28 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @Sharkfinn (Comment 2) : give me the good news!

  • Comment 4, posted at 12.09.16 15:47:30 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 4) : We get to watch 15 good players on Saturday ;)

  • Comment 5, posted at 12.09.16 15:50:45 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 5) : Nope, not 15, actually 23 of them :mrgreen:

  • Comment 6, posted at 12.09.16 15:52:39 by Henkb Reply
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  • @Henkb (Comment 6) : Well 15 at a time ;)

  • Comment 7, posted at 12.09.16 15:53:29 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 7) : True, but the reserves handling the water going on and off the field also exert some pure class and skill, just in the way they carrying the holder with the bottles, never mind the oval ball

  • Comment 8, posted at 12.09.16 15:55:12 by Henkb Reply
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  • @Henkb (Comment 8) : Will be interesting to see if NZ tinker with their team before away matches in Arg, SA.

  • Comment 9, posted at 12.09.16 16:00:59 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 9) : I think they will have the trophy basically wrapped up by this weekend, so might as well tinker a bit with it then

  • Comment 10, posted at 12.09.16 16:09:43 by Henkb Reply
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  • @Henkb (Comment 10) : @SheldonK (Comment 9) : sad but true!!! Would be interesting to see what they do.

  • Comment 11, posted at 12.09.16 16:25:09 by JD Reply
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  • I still wonder if AC record does not improve this year if we will see one of the shorter careers as bok coach? I just had that feeling after the Argies loss and it hasn’t gone away. It’s like he has the ingredients but no clue how to put it together. He also had a lot of ingredients at stormers and also didn’t manage to set the world on fire.

  • Comment 12, posted at 12.09.16 18:35:31 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionTeam captain
     
  • I hope you’re wrong Rich but there seems to be a worrying amount of chickens coming home to roost.

    @SheldonK (Comment 3) : SARU’s management thanks you for your generous statement.

  • Comment 13, posted at 12.09.16 20:06:37 by vanmartin Reply
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  • In 2011 the Boks were also ranked 4th and 2003 they were ranked 5th. Perhaps the beginning of the end was way back then and we are now approaching the end of the end.

    Whatever that may mean.

  • Comment 14, posted at 13.09.16 01:22:51 by fyndraai Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 3) :

    They got what they deserved….but will they care to admit it?

  • Comment 15, posted at 13.09.16 01:24:27 by fyndraai Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 11) :

    Did you notice that the Bok pack and front row were both lighter than that of the Aussies on Saturday.

    I know it’s just one [more] stat.

  • Comment 16, posted at 13.09.16 01:26:48 by fyndraai Reply
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  • @fyndraai (Comment 16) : no did not. Strange with Strauss in the team.

  • Comment 17, posted at 13.09.16 07:22:22 by JD Reply
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  • @fyndraai (Comment 16) : @JD (Comment 17) : Our backline has to be one of the smallest currently in the top 5(not for long :roll: ) as well?

  • Comment 18, posted at 13.09.16 07:43:32 by Quintin Reply

    QuintinSuper Rugby player
     
  • @fyndraai (Comment 16) : Well have a look at 2007 Bok team:
    Os Du Rant, John Smit, BJ Botha, Bakkies Botha, Vic Matfield, Schalk Burger, Juan Smith, Danie Roussouw, Fourie DuPreez, Butch James, Brian Habana, Frans Steyn, Jacque Fourie, JP Pieterson, Percy Montgomery

    Compared to the team last saturday:
    Beast, Strauss, Adriaanse, Etzebeth, De Jager, Louw, Mahoje, Whiteley, De Klerk, Jantjies, Habana, De Jongh, Kriel, Hougaard, Goosen

    Now tell me we still producing big quality players in SA…..

  • Comment 19, posted at 13.09.16 08:09:59 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 19) : that 2007 team was an awesome team!!! And all of those players was on form!!!

  • Comment 20, posted at 13.09.16 08:19:04 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 20) : So the question then: Can we replace like for like in terms of size and quality in 2016?

  • Comment 21, posted at 13.09.16 08:37:17 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @JD (Comment 20) : Damn right!
    @SheldonK (Comment 21) : We have a better chance of doing that in the forward pack than in the backline. Butch, Steyn , Fourie and JPP, all big blokes who can tackle the living fuck out of you. Can’t match that currently.

    I see some ‘pundits’ say de Jong is a candidate for Springbok captaincy after Strauss retires, things are going from bad to downright ridiculous!

  • Comment 22, posted at 13.09.16 08:59:02 by Quintin Reply

    QuintinSuper Rugby player
     
  • If we took this game as a loss in advance I would definitely try some combos that could be interesting…first I would call Bizzie…but Kriel at full back…leave Steyn out of 22….I would get Damian back at work 12…maybe the skrik was enuff coz he is a big talent despite recent form…PSDT as a flank…we need to be able to have 80 m fitness ready and the bench as the AB we always super fit…..ffs I am trying here!!

  • Comment 23, posted at 13.09.16 09:13:25 by Sharkfinn Reply

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  • Buckle up boys, it’s going to be a rough 4 years.

  • Comment 24, posted at 13.09.16 09:16:52 by KingRiaan Reply

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  • @Sharkfinn (Comment 23) : I agree with you on Damian, Kriel and PSDT. Bissy is out for 3 months so he’s a no go unfortunately. Is Marx available? Might as well give Strauss the boot since he’s retiring anyway.

  • Comment 25, posted at 13.09.16 09:24:26 by Quintin Reply

    QuintinSuper Rugby player
     
  • We just need to ride this wave. Soon the rugby coffers will be empty and interest will dwindle and the pack will scurry on the ship to loot something else. Then we’ll rebuild rugby…

  • Comment 26, posted at 13.09.16 09:49:23 by KILLER SHARK Reply
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  • We just need to ride this wave. Soon the rugby coffers will be empty and interest will dwindle and the pack will scurry off the ship to loot something else. Then we’ll rebuild rugby…

  • Comment 27, posted at 13.09.16 09:49:44 by KILLER SHARK Reply
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  • @KILLER SHARK (Comment 27) : If you look at the Currie Cup attendance, and even Super Rugby, then the interest is already dwindling.

    SARU must wake up soon or realise they’re going to kill the Golden Goose.

  • Comment 28, posted at 13.09.16 10:02:21 by StevieS Reply
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  • @Quintin (Comment 22) : For me Frans Steyn played his best rugby at the RWC 2007. He distributed beautifully and combined skills and power to dominate.

  • Comment 29, posted at 13.09.16 10:03:32 by StevieS Reply
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  • @StevieS (Comment 28) : think the goose is already in the oven!!! Going to be very difficult to reverse the damage that was already done!

  • Comment 30, posted at 13.09.16 10:15:35 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 30) : We’re going the same way SA football has gone.

    There are as many people who have a team in the EPL rather than supporting a local team as there supporters of local PSL teams.

  • Comment 31, posted at 13.09.16 10:26:00 by StevieS Reply
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  • @Quintin (Comment 22) : HM tried by playing Schalk, Lood and MAtfield as 10,12 and 13….

  • Comment 32, posted at 13.09.16 10:42:44 by Kabouter Reply

    KabouterCurrie Cup player
     
  • @StevieS (Comment 31) : and it all starts with the administrators of rugby emulating those in charge of soccer straight down the drain!!!!

  • Comment 33, posted at 13.09.16 11:38:13 by JD Reply
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  • Yeah look. I am seriously considering buying an All Black jersey. The people used to support the AB’s in during the previous regime as an FU to SARU, so I guess we can do the same..

  • Comment 34, posted at 13.09.16 11:39:55 by KingRiaan Reply

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  • @KingRiaan (Comment 34) : personally I’m thinking about a French jersey! I’m so use to supporting struggling teams that I’m afraid of how I’d react to supporting a team that wins almost all their games!!!

  • Comment 35, posted at 13.09.16 11:49:40 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 35) : May as well be French considering half of SA players are there! Could even possibly make a team:
    Marcel VD Merwe, Bismarck, Jannie, Paul Willemse, Juandre Kruger, Duane Vermuelen , Jaques DuPlessis, Pierre Spies, Cameron Wright, Demetri Catrakilis, Habana, Wynand Olivier, Paul Jordaan, wing?, Frans Steyn

  • Comment 36, posted at 13.09.16 11:51:44 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @JD (Comment 35) : I’ve always supported the French aswell, seeing as I’m from french descended, but I think wearing an AB jersey is just a bit more of an FU

  • Comment 37, posted at 13.09.16 11:59:47 by KingRiaan Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 36) : hahaha ja what will we call them Frenchsa Barbarians?

  • Comment 38, posted at 13.09.16 12:03:17 by JD Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 19) : lets be honest I don’t think our minister of sport would approve the 2007 team just saying :roll:

  • Comment 39, posted at 13.09.16 12:04:11 by schrodingers cat Reply

    schrodingers catCurrie Cup player
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 36) : that’s a good team you have there just replace spies with liebenberg

  • Comment 40, posted at 13.09.16 12:06:06 by schrodingers cat Reply

    schrodingers catCurrie Cup player
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 21) : @Quintin (Comment 22) : don’t think so. That was a special bunch of guys just like the 1995 team! Don’t get teams like that every year!

  • Comment 41, posted at 13.09.16 12:09:18 by JD Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 36) : that team would beat our current bok side , make jake white the coach of that team and you have yourself wc victory

  • Comment 42, posted at 13.09.16 12:11:06 by schrodingers cat Reply

    schrodingers catCurrie Cup player
     
  • @JD (Comment 41) : actually the side he named in comment 36 would be just as special

  • Comment 43, posted at 13.09.16 12:12:57 by schrodingers cat Reply

    schrodingers catCurrie Cup player
     
  • @JD (Comment 38) : Well instead of the Boks you could call that side the Cocks :roll: @schrodingers cat (Comment 40) : There probably a few guys i missed, just used ones i could think of.

  • Comment 44, posted at 13.09.16 12:21:53 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @schrodingers cat (Comment 43) : I really don’t think so. Yes it’s not a bad side but nowhere near as good as the 1995 or 2007 side but hey that’s what makes life so interesting as we all have our own opinions.

  • Comment 45, posted at 13.09.16 12:27:22 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 45) : atleast we can both agree that our current bok side is shit

  • Comment 46, posted at 13.09.16 12:30:35 by schrodingers cat Reply

    schrodingers catCurrie Cup player
     
  • @schrodingers cat (Comment 46) : YES for sure!!! but then again that’s not an opinion that’s a proven fact (especially after the last three games)!!!

  • Comment 47, posted at 13.09.16 12:33:30 by JD Reply
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  • Just wondering: what the hell will we be commenting if on Saturday the Bokke beat the All Blacks?

  • Comment 48, posted at 13.09.16 12:37:16 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 48) : Its kinda as i said before the Aussies game…would a win not be worse than a loss in this situation…

  • Comment 49, posted at 13.09.16 12:39:14 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 44) : You just made me realise that things are not yet rock bottom shite,Wynand fucken Olivier,Pierre Spies,Juandre Kruger,I need to go wash the puke out of my mouth.

  • Comment 50, posted at 13.09.16 12:41:03 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 50) : haha i saw them on the weekend french highlights so names came to mind. Think Olivier is actually in the UK now though so my mistake there. Im sure ive missed a good few guys though

  • Comment 51, posted at 13.09.16 12:48:57 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @The hound (Comment 50) : hahaha alway some reasons in life to be thankful!!!!

  • Comment 52, posted at 13.09.16 12:57:11 by JD Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 51) : my overseas based side
    Coach:Jake white
    Assistant coach:Eddie jones
    1-kittshof
    2-bismarck
    3-Jannie
    4-Willemse
    5-Jansen Van rensburg
    6-Liebenberg
    7-Jauqes dup plesis
    8-Duane Vermeulen
    9-hougard
    10-Catrikiles
    11-habana
    12-steyn
    13-Eberson
    14-Jordaan
    15-le roux

  • Comment 53, posted at 13.09.16 12:57:17 by schrodingers cat Reply

    schrodingers catCurrie Cup player
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 49) : not sure?!?! Would however make for some very interesting comments and articles!?

  • Comment 54, posted at 13.09.16 12:58:53 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 48) : I can just hear the word “character” being spewd out of every mouth

  • Comment 55, posted at 13.09.16 13:01:58 by KingRiaan Reply

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  • @KingRiaan (Comment 55) : hahaha yes for sure!

  • Comment 56, posted at 13.09.16 13:07:02 by JD Reply
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  • @schrodingers cat (Comment 53) : Not sure who the lock Van Rensburg is? I would probably go with Jaques DuPlessis there or even Anton Bresler. My 10 would be Ruan Pienaar (he should have stayed at 10 once started there). The side just shows that 7 and 13 are positions we dont produce a lot of quality in overall

  • Comment 57, posted at 13.09.16 13:07:06 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 57) : i believe that if a lock is mobile enough to play flank he should play flank .I actually think that Eben etzebeth should play flank as hes pace and athletisism is the same as that of a flank.Tell me what you think about this :
    4-Willemse
    5-De jager
    6-Du plessis
    7-Eben Etzebeth
    Eben and dupplesis are so mobile for big guys they are actually being wasted at lock and their size is a asset at flank.Their is a clear difference in the mobility of Willemse/de jager and eben/dup
    Dont know if you agree with me but awnsering your q though i would say we have enough mobile locks in our country to play 7 fkank that i dont think we have a problem there

  • Comment 58, posted at 13.09.16 13:32:04 by schrodingers cat Reply

    schrodingers catCurrie Cup player
     
  • @schrodingers cat (Comment 58) : Im a firm believer in there being more than 1 successful way to play and comprise a team. So yes your thinking does have merit and a pack of Kitshoff, Mbonambi, Redelinghuis, Willemse, De Jager, Jaques DuPlessis, Etzebeth, PSDT would have a lot of benefits (some cons too as with all combos)
    However id like to go with a bit more speed personally so would look to a pack of:
    Ox Nche, Marx, Adriaanse, Mostert, PSDT, Kriel, Coetzee, Whiteley

  • Comment 59, posted at 13.09.16 13:44:14 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 59) : I must say that Ox Nche is a real talent I do hope he gets a call up sooner rather than later and yess everyone will obviously have different opinions on how to play ect. thats rugby

  • Comment 60, posted at 13.09.16 13:50:27 by schrodingers cat Reply

    schrodingers catCurrie Cup player
     
  • @schrodingers cat (Comment 60) : I hope Ox realises that he will look much better in a black and white jersey than an orange one

  • Comment 61, posted at 13.09.16 13:53:15 by KingRiaan Reply

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  • @schrodingers cat (Comment 60) : He has a lot of potential, still has a few technical scrumming issues that could get found out especially playing in NH. And yes there is most definitely more than 1 way to skin a cat but there needs to be a plan and selection to combine with that plan. At the moment the Boks seem to be trying half and half and ending up nowhere

  • Comment 62, posted at 13.09.16 13:56:55 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @KingRiaan (Comment 61) : ja I would not be unhappy if the lad decides to move to Durbs!!!

  • Comment 63, posted at 13.09.16 14:21:19 by JD Reply
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  • @schrodingers cat (Comment 58) : don’t know how they will do in a quick match but can’t see them ever losing a ball in the lineouts!!!

  • Comment 64, posted at 13.09.16 14:23:05 by JD Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 59) : the second forward pack is not a bad selection. Fast but also physical.

  • Comment 65, posted at 13.09.16 14:25:13 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 65) : A couple of them im not yet sold on but yeh was what i could think of for a very mobile pack.

  • Comment 66, posted at 13.09.16 14:44:39 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @JD (Comment 64) : haha well if you have 5 locks in youre pack i dint think you should

  • Comment 67, posted at 13.09.16 14:47:15 by schrodingers cat Reply

    schrodingers catCurrie Cup player
     
  • @JD (Comment 64) : With that size pack they could dictate the speed of the game, would be tough to dominate the collisions against them.

  • Comment 68, posted at 13.09.16 14:51:45 by SheldonK Reply

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  • After the Boks most probably lose on Saturday i would like to see only locally based players selected for the 2 games in SA vs Aussies and New Zealand. If AC does that he can then make a choice about what he wants to get out of the End of Year Tour.

  • Comment 69, posted at 13.09.16 15:15:59 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @schrodingers cat (Comment 53) : Are you planning to take that team to next world cup or is it a stop gap team while youngsters mature? Jannie won’t make a rwc. And even if he does I would take Redelinghuis over him and Start prepping Dreyer for second seat.

  • Comment 70, posted at 13.09.16 16:11:07 by coolfusion Reply

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  • @schrodingers cat (Comment 67) : hahahaha yes!

  • Comment 71, posted at 13.09.16 16:12:46 by JD Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 68) : and that’s why you shift the ball as much as possible and have as few “collisions” as possible! Let them run around to stop the attackers don’t allow them to stand and wait for you.

  • Comment 72, posted at 13.09.16 16:16:50 by JD Reply
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  • @coolfusion (Comment 70) : Should we really be picking a team now that will play in 4yrs? Should we not pick the team based on who is injury free and on form at the time? Its risky business picking a guy now and keeping him for 4yrs…injuries in a World cup year can kill all those plans. In my view the best current team should be picked. Injuries and drop in form will allow for depth creation on its own

  • Comment 73, posted at 13.09.16 16:17:14 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @JD (Comment 72) : Collisions are still very much a part of the game. Trust me the All Blacks are still the most physical side in world rugby. Its because they win the collisions that enable them to play the flowing rugby that they do.

  • Comment 74, posted at 13.09.16 16:19:59 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 73) : Which is why I asked if it’s a long term team or a stopgap till the young guys mature.

  • Comment 75, posted at 13.09.16 16:21:01 by coolfusion Reply

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  • @coolfusion (Comment 75) : I take the view that a guy like Habana may not be fit and firing the next world cup…but same goes for a youngster Like Curwin Bosch. If players know the best fit and firing players will be picked for each game and series then i think it gives a lot more incentive to produce both for the Boks and for their provincial sides. Well hats my view anyway. I just see guys saying we should pick our next world cup captain now…thats such silly thinking in my view.

  • Comment 76, posted at 13.09.16 16:24:12 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 76) : it worked for JW when he selected JS as captain just after the World cup?!?!

  • Comment 77, posted at 13.09.16 16:33:05 by JD Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 74) : yes you’re correct when needed they can be just as physical as the best teams, but I have a feeling that they take way less contact than SA. Letting the ball do the work is a big part of their game.

  • Comment 78, posted at 13.09.16 16:37:47 by JD Reply
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  • @coolfusion (Comment 70) : thats just a overseas based team that i think would beat our current bok side at this moment in time,however only bissas,jannie and habbana are the ones over the age of 30 their which in a way is a absoluteley shocking stat because it indicates the high number of young players playing overseas

  • Comment 79, posted at 13.09.16 18:06:12 by schrodingers cat Reply

    schrodingers catCurrie Cup player
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 74) : Ja thanks to those big pacific Islanders …cough..Kaino…cough…savea ….without pacific Islandrrs NZ would be nowhere

  • Comment 80, posted at 13.09.16 18:09:31 by schrodingers cat Reply

    schrodingers catCurrie Cup player
     
  • @schrodingers cat (Comment 80) : very true!!! NZ the birth place of the 1000 islands rugby team!!!

  • Comment 81, posted at 13.09.16 19:55:38 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 81) : those are some big boys i wonder how much fish they go through in a week

  • Comment 82, posted at 13.09.16 20:41:51 by schrodingers cat Reply

    schrodingers catCurrie Cup player
     
  • @schrodingers cat (Comment 80) : @JD (Comment 81) : Most of those Islanders are born in N.Z.They are New Zealanders,

  • Comment 83, posted at 13.09.16 21:32:24 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 83) : not sure about the most think a lot of them yes but also a lot that moved there as 18-19 year old to try and make it as professional rugby players.

  • Comment 84, posted at 13.09.16 22:17:35 by JD Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 19) :

    If you look closely at that 2007 team you may see that it would be impossible to select a similar one in 2016.

    And I do feel obliged to once again point out that the 2007 team only managed to beat lower ranked teams. Arg (5), Eng (7), Fiji (11), Tonga (12), Samoa (13), USA (17). Which is certainly better than the 2016 team, but not by much.

    Winning the WC was a great thing, but calling a team great that had not triumphed over other great teams is just stupidity. The ’09 team was a great team……….for a very short time.

  • Comment 85, posted at 13.09.16 23:36:20 by fyndraai Reply
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  • @schrodingers cat (Comment 79) : Ok so let’s look at strategy. How about selecting a team here or overseas that will bring boks back to winning. Then cycling in the guys who will be around for next world cup. Obviously based on current form and then also not being guaranteed the spot by being rotated or dropping out if they don’t retain form. I think AC is trying to hit the right combo now and keep that team for 3 years with minor tweaks. Same as HM.The problem is that he came in on a forced rebuild. He cannot, even if he wanted, to still get by with guys from previous world cups, like divvie and HM were able to. He HAS to test and build an almost entirely new team.

  • Comment 86, posted at 14.09.16 06:54:11 by coolfusion Reply

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  • @JD (Comment 84) : Yeah a lot of them moved there from the islands to get NZ citizenship. Plus it’s just a better country for them to live in.

  • Comment 87, posted at 14.09.16 07:23:25 by Quintin Reply

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  • @fyndraai (Comment 85) : most of the core of the 2009 team was the core of the 2007 team. Also remember these “low rank teams” was the teams that knocked out the top rank teams so they must have had some form even if their ranking did not show it!

  • Comment 88, posted at 14.09.16 08:13:09 by JD Reply
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  • @Quintin (Comment 87) : for sure much beter economy and work prospects so would make sense to move thereceven if the move is not rugby related.

  • Comment 89, posted at 14.09.16 08:14:46 by JD Reply
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  • @fyndraai (Comment 85) : U do make a point. I do still think the 2007 side was a great side when all the key players were fit.

  • Comment 90, posted at 14.09.16 08:16:06 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @JD (Comment 77) : It did…but how different would things have been had Smit and Matfield picked up big injuries just before the tournament and therefore either missed the tournament or gone in half fit. Guess Heyneke Meyer knows that feeling. In todays rugby its very risky business banking on a guy that fit and playing well now also being fit and firing in 4yrs time for a RWC. It can work…but it can also backfire

  • Comment 91, posted at 14.09.16 08:18:22 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 91) : was just teasing you boet I know it’s very risky. That’s why rotation of players and a leadership group is so important.

  • Comment 92, posted at 14.09.16 08:22:21 by JD Reply
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  • @Quintin (Comment 87) : @JD (Comment 84) : How is this any different to Beast,who has now a record number of caps for any Bok prop and came to South Africa when and from where.

  • Comment 93, posted at 14.09.16 08:22:58 by The hound Reply
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  • In fact, in the days when Zambia was still Northern Rhodesia and Zimbabwe was known as Rhodesia, five Rhodesians or former Rhodesians captained the Springboks and a number have also played Test rugby for South Africa.

    And later, in the period early 2000s Corne Krige, a former Zambian, led the Springboks in 18 Tests. In the present two-Test series against Wales, Thonderai Chavhanga, Tendai Mtawarira and Brian Mujati, are former Zimbabweans who have qualified to play for South Africa by virtue of residence in the country.

    Des van Jaarsveld was the only player to play for Rhodesia when he became Springbok captain. He led the Springboks in the one-off Test during Scotland’s 1960 tour of South Africa. He scored a try in that match.

    Salty du Rand became for first former Rhodesian to lead South Africa when he captained the Springboks in the first (losing) Test against the All Blacks on the 1956 tour of Australia and New Zealand.

    Others to follow in his footsteps were Piet Greyling, who later played for the Free State, Northern Transvaal and Transvaal. He was captain of Transvaal when he captained the Boks in the losing Test against England at Ellis Park in 1972; Bobby Skinstad, Western province/Stormers and Sharks; and Gary Teichmann (Natal) are also former Zimbabweans. One of the most skilful players to represent South Africa was Ian Robertson, who played in the 1974 series against France and the 1976 series against the All Blacks.

    He was an accomplished flyhalf, centre and fullback and excelled in all three positions in the days when specialisation was regarded as paramount.

    David Smith was a centre with ample speed and a scintillating break and played in the 1980 series against the British Lions, and hooker Ronnie Hill played for South Africa from 1960-1963.

    Andy MacDonald was what today would have been called a Zambian when he represented the then Rhodesia, and played prop for South Africa on the 1965 tour of Australia and New Zealand. He was immensely strong, and in fact killed a Lion with his bare hands!

    Probably the best-known of the Rhodesians/Zimbabweans was Ray Mordt, later a great wing for Northern Transvaal and Transvaal and also Currie Cup winning coach of Transvaal in 1994. He became a Springbok as a Zimbabwean player and played in 18 Tests.

    But the ties with South Africa’s northern neighbour extends even further. Former Springbok coach and now a national selector, Ian McIntosh, also hails from the old Rhodesia.

  • Comment 94, posted at 14.09.16 08:35:45 by The hound Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 92) : I was kinda hoping someone would mention a leadership group. Who would you put in that group for the Boks going forward? I would think names such as Whiteley, Lambie, PSDT come to my mind

  • Comment 95, posted at 14.09.16 08:47:09 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @fyndraai (Comment 85) : I don’t totally agree with you, we beat england twice in that WC and they beat australia and france on the way to the final, france who beat NZ on their way to the semi’s. So no, the fact that other traditional big rugby nations did not make it to the semi’s is who’s fault now? We also beat a very good Fiji team in our quarter final, and the Argies played the whole comp way above them selves, who we beat in the semi’s. The Argies also beat France twice in that competition.
    My point is take the whole competition and the manner in which all the other non traditional teams played into consideration before making such a statement.

  • Comment 96, posted at 14.09.16 09:32:22 by Uli Boelie Reply
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  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 96) : Agree 100%,what matters in sport is who won and nobody gives a shit about who lost.

  • Comment 97, posted at 14.09.16 09:58:57 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 97) : Indeed, you are either first or last

  • Comment 98, posted at 14.09.16 10:00:51 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @The hound (Comment 93) : ag hell boet I’m not going to get into an argument about right and wrong. Fact is how many players in the current Bok team have any no SA heritage? Go and check the All Blacks and the picture change a bit. Now go even further and check how many players playing in NZ Super rugby teams have Islands heratige.
    Not saying it’s wrong it’s their good luck that so many of these Islanders decided to move to NZ for economic, rugby or what ever other reasons.
    Comments like the 1000 island team is made “tongue in cheek” just having a bit of fun!

  • Comment 99, posted at 14.09.16 10:06:05 by JD Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 94) : @JD (Comment 99) : There’s a summary if you want to see how many foreign players has represented the AB’s. Interesting study they did.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11278276

  • Comment 100, posted at 14.09.16 10:26:26 by Quintin Reply

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  • @JD (Comment 99) : I reckon you would get a big shock if you calculated how many South Africans were playing their rugby outside South Africa,and how many South Africans born players are representing other countries,probably a lot more than the number of Fijian,Samoan and Tongan born in the All Blacks team.

  • Comment 101, posted at 14.09.16 10:28:03 by The hound Reply
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  • There’s big difference when you talk of players with Polynesian heiratage and players born in Polynesia .

  • Comment 102, posted at 14.09.16 10:31:04 by The hound Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 99) : My comment 101 is probably the best summation of ”the start of the big slide”

  • Comment 103, posted at 14.09.16 10:35:42 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 102) : trust me I have a fair idea. Biggest problem is youngsters like CJ Stander and co leaving to play for other countries.
    That said it’s a part of life and if I can go to do the same job for 15 times my current salary I would also go.

  • Comment 104, posted at 14.09.16 12:31:16 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 104) : Yup patriotism and nationalism,are outdated concepts and going forward will have less and less meaning,
    Stander didn’t even wait to see if he was going to make it here,unlike a guy like Barritt who gave it a go first but then saw the writing on the wall.
    That Long haired blond du Plessis,who looks like Patricia Lewis will be the next one in a French jersey,he’s only 22.

  • Comment 105, posted at 14.09.16 12:39:48 by The hound Reply
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  • @Quintin (Comment 100) : thanx interesting reading. Yes not a lot of island born players has played for them, however they can also not talk away the impact that players with island heratige has had on their rugby.
    All of this is their good luck and they’re using it to their advantage so good on them for using it!

  • Comment 106, posted at 14.09.16 12:46:19 by JD Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 105) : can’t really blame a lad for going to “work” abroad if he can get 15 times more than in SA!?

  • Comment 107, posted at 14.09.16 12:51:02 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 106) : Yes, very important players for them in their history. Couple of big names : Jerry Collins, Mils Muliaina, Joe Rokocoko, Rodney So’oialo, Jerome Kaino, Olo Brown. All of them played more than 50 test for the AB’s.

  • Comment 108, posted at 14.09.16 13:25:20 by Quintin Reply

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  • @Quintin (Comment 108) : some great names in there but don’t forget the original tank Jonah Lomu!!!

  • Comment 109, posted at 14.09.16 13:34:10 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 109) : Born in New Zealand.

  • Comment 110, posted at 14.09.16 13:37:09 by The hound Reply
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  • So here we go…sigh!

  • Comment 111, posted at 14.09.16 18:34:26 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 110) : I know but was of Island descend.

  • Comment 112, posted at 14.09.16 18:40:37 by JD Reply
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