robdylan

Sharks players commit to the future


Written by Rob Otto (robdylan)

Posted in :Original Content, Sharks, Super Rugby on 31 Oct 2016 at 13:02
Tagged with : , , , , , , , , , , , , ,

The Sharks are a team determined to recapture their glory days, but as we know, success does not happen overnight. Winning campaigns are typically built on a platform of shared values and culture and in a team sport like rugby, where strong bonds of trust between team mates are vital, it is virtually impossible to be successful and develop that culture in an environment where high player turnover forces you back to square one at the end of each season.

The Sharks have lost something like 47 senior players from their ranks over the last three years alone and are determined that this rot has to stop if the team is to build on the signs of turnaround from this year’s Currie Cup campaign and reap the rewards in years to come. While the list of new signings announced this morning is rather thin, the real news is the list that follows: those current Sharks players who have bought into the future plans and shown their commitment to fans, jersey and team by signing contract extensions.

Credit must go to CEO Gary Teichmann and COO Eduard Coetzee for taking the necessary steps to safeguard our immediate future by convincing the majority of our young, talented squad to sign contract extensions. The message is clear: to play for the Sharks, you must be committed to the team and put your money where your mouth is, for the fans. If that’s not how you want to play, well there are plenty of other places to make your living.

Here are the 17 extensions announced today:

Thomas du Toit – 3 years
Mzamo Majola – 3 years
John-Hubert Meyer – 2 years
Franco Marais – 2 years
Hyron Andrews – 3 years
Jean Droste – 2 years
Stephan Lewies – 2 years
Rowan Gouws – 1 year
Benhard Janse van Rensburg – 2 years
Andre Esterhuizen – 2 years
Marius Louw – 2 years
Neil Maritz – 2 years
Tristan Blewett – 2 years
Odwa Ndungane – 1 year
Sibusiso Nkosi – 3 years
Rhyno Smith – 2 years
Curwin Bosch – 2 years



115 Comments

  • Wow well done all involved! Today is a good day to be a Shark. :cool:

  • Comment 1, posted at 31.10.16 13:06:04 by Another Nick Reply
    Another NickSuper Rugby player
     
  • Glad we are getting guys to commit to longer contracts.

  • Comment 2, posted at 31.10.16 13:12:48 by Hulk Reply
    HulkSuper Rugby player
     
  • Great news for those who are listed, … what about those that aren’t listed but are in the current set-up, just trying to figure out who is actually leaving?

  • Comment 3, posted at 31.10.16 13:14:00 by stevovo Reply
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  • So correct me if I am wrong, but almost every major position at the Sharks are now occupied by former Sharks players? Gary CEO, Eduard COO, Rob Head Coach… Any I’m forgetting?

  • Comment 4, posted at 31.10.16 13:17:04 by KingRiaan Reply

    KingRiaanTeam captain
     
  • @KingRiaan (Comment 4) : Very interesting this. Not many of the other unions can say the same..

  • Comment 5, posted at 31.10.16 13:24:05 by Another Nick Reply

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  • Great to see so many players committing to the Sharks!!!

  • Comment 6, posted at 31.10.16 13:25:41 by JD Reply
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  • @stevovo (Comment 3) : bear in mind that a lot of other guys not mentioned here already have 2-3 years left on their contracts anyway.

    Nobody of any “substance” is leaving. Astle is going, Mjekevu is going on loan to Kings and won’t come back…. who else? Christiaan de Bruin is going. No big names leaving, trust me.

  • Comment 7, posted at 31.10.16 13:34:11 by robdylan Reply
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  • Glad to see some good business in terms of continuity being done. Now the players need to produce on the field and reward the faith shown in them

  • Comment 8, posted at 31.10.16 13:39:42 by SheldonK Reply

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  • Heart-warming stuff…

  • Comment 9, posted at 31.10.16 13:44:40 by pastorshark Reply
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  • Feel like mjekevu would have done well with the attack minded game plan if he didn’t lose the ball so often and knock on. Certainly showed an eye for attack just little things let him down. I feel like we need a fetcher a real fetcher to make us more of a threat. Marcel took around 2 years to become a proper fetcher and than we lost him when he was hitting his best years,I hope one of the the dupreez or both starting focusing more on that break down, iv given up on majola seems to have hit his peek

  • Comment 10, posted at 31.10.16 13:48:33 by Poisy Reply
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  • @Poisy (Comment 10) : I don’t think Wandi bought into the vision

  • Comment 11, posted at 31.10.16 13:52:19 by robdylan Reply
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  • Well that’s sad to hear,good luck to him, I hope sbura sithole has, its about time he stepped up and showed the form he had under white

  • Comment 12, posted at 31.10.16 13:58:48 by Poisy Reply
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  • @Poisy (Comment 10) : I think the way the modern game is going the need for an out and out fetcher is being greatly reduced. Especially if you look at how teams no longer look to create rucks and the number of rucks, especially in Super rugby is decreasing. The importance going forward will be ability to dominate the collision/tackle

  • Comment 13, posted at 31.10.16 14:03:08 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @sheldonK no point in doing that if you not gonna win the ball by being good on the floor,look at the boks and sharks, they make so many tackles but because they lack a bissie or alberts or marcel made no real difference because the opposition kept getting good quick ball and they score

  • Comment 14, posted at 31.10.16 14:07:02 by Poisy Reply
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  • @Poisy (Comment 14) : Thats not solely because of no fetcher…cant expect 1 guy to do that. Reason we didnt get ball is because the next arriving players were late in getting there or body position was terrible. Fix the general issue dont just buy 1 guy. I didnt see 1 ‘fetcher’ have a major influence. Although dont think there are many pure ‘fetchers’ out there

  • Comment 15, posted at 31.10.16 14:09:50 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 15) : Where does this point of view come from? The AB will never go out on the park without a fetcher, it is the sole reason why Savea can’t get a start. A great fetcher is of massive value to a side – he needs to be the fittest, most courageous player on the field and lead the team at the breakdown. I think one of our biggest downfalls is that we do not have an out and out fetcher. Just as an example, is it just a coincidence that the year we did our best against the AB was when Brussouw was picked in 2009? Every player nowadays needs to be able to play the breakdown, but you will always get that one, the real fetcher who stands back for no one and his one job on the field is to disrupt, steal and insure clean ball for his team mates. I think it is a vital position.

  • Comment 16, posted at 31.10.16 14:22:42 by Vonno13 Reply
     
  • @Vonno13 (Comment 16) : You do know the rules and game has changed from 2009? I think relying solely on 1 player to be a fetcher is not worth it these days. Every game i watch i see less and less impact of a ‘fetcher’ and a bigger impact made by players arriving at the ruck/tackle at speed in a good body position. Every player needs to have good ruck/tackle skills…yes some are going to be better at it. But searching for 1 guy is a waste of time. There arent any in SA currently

  • Comment 17, posted at 31.10.16 14:36:03 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 17) : So I guess the AB pick Matt Todd because of his great skill, do me a favour man! What position did you play if I may ask?

  • Comment 18, posted at 31.10.16 14:47:54 by Vonno13 Reply
     
  • @Another Nick (Comment 5) : The Cheetahs can say the same! Rory Duncan, Franco Smith, Daan Human, Corniel Els, and JP du Toit. Think Charl Marais as well

  • Comment 19, posted at 31.10.16 15:05:21 by KingCheetah Reply

    KingCheetahTeam captain
     
  • @KingCheetah (Comment 19) : And I think that has a lot to do with how the Cheetahs started playing with flair like the teams of old.

  • Comment 20, posted at 31.10.16 15:09:38 by KingRiaan Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 7) : Where are Astle, Mjekevu and de Bruin going?

  • Comment 21, posted at 31.10.16 15:11:53 by ChrisS Reply
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  • @ChrisS (Comment 21) : Astle to the French 4th division or something. Mjekevu Kings. No clue re de Bruin.

  • Comment 22, posted at 31.10.16 15:16:16 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Vonno13 (Comment 18) : I played lock. So these vitally necessary ‘fetchers’ in SA are who exactly? And if we dont have 1 on the park should we just not bother? Kick everything away? Or should we get every players, particularly forwards, accurate and effective at ruck time?

  • Comment 23, posted at 31.10.16 15:16:55 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 23) : So Jake White was right when he said that a Fetcher’s only job is fetching him beer from the fridge? :twisted: :mrgreen: The problem is people forget there are other ways of effecting a turnover, not only stealing the ball at a ruck. With the rules as they are, a smothering tackle, holding the player up and forming a maul, is extremely effective, as is a strong counter-ruck. If the defence outnumbers the attack at a ruck, then the counter-ruck should be on, driving the opposition off the ball. Just as effective as a fetcher stealing the ball.

  • Comment 24, posted at 31.10.16 15:27:21 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 22) : Thanks, Rob. I was hoping we would keep Astle as he played well this year.

  • Comment 25, posted at 31.10.16 15:29:40 by ChrisS Reply
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  • @KingCheetah (Comment 19) : Yup, 100% correct bud. The Cheetahs are thoroughly home-bred. @KingRiaan (Comment 20) : Ditto. A lot of their recent success is because of it.

  • Comment 26, posted at 31.10.16 15:30:13 by Another Nick Reply

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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 24) : @SheldonK (Comment 23) : We definitely still need fetchers in the modern game. Look at the difference Matt Todd made against the Wallabies and how he was neutralised only when Pocock was brought on.

  • Comment 27, posted at 31.10.16 15:31:08 by ChrisS Reply
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  • @ChrisS (Comment 27) : The Wallabies had almost 70% possession in the last game not dont know about that. I think that being able to convert tries and kick penalites is important…does that mean i should pick Morne Steyn over Beaudon Barratt…unlikely

  • Comment 28, posted at 31.10.16 15:34:01 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 28) : I’m also of the more old school thought of having a balanced loose trio. An opensider that actually fetches the ball, a 7 that can run through a barn door, and a skillful 8 that can mix it with the forwards and run it with the backs. Look at Kriel, very good as a linking, supporting, running flank, but kinda ineffective when the game gets tight

  • Comment 29, posted at 31.10.16 15:47:15 by KingRiaan Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 23) : it is obviously a point we will never reach an agreement on. You ask where they are, the Fletcher’s. They get chucked as soon as they leave school, for being too short. Show me one loose forward in SA under 1.9m our loosies are all very tall men, meaning they will always have a disadvantage in stealing ball. Mccaw was only 1.88 if that, Todd the same. I think cane is their tallest fetcher at 1.89 the AB have it right as their combinations are right. All 3 loose forwards play different games, Cane/ Todd the fetcher, Kaino the beast and then the subtle skill set and linking of Read, not to mention he also happens to be a beast. So my argument remains, you need a fetcher in your side, they are of paramount importance in my mindset.

  • Comment 30, posted at 31.10.16 15:54:07 by Vonno13 Reply
     
  • @KingRiaan (Comment 29) : Look dont get me wrong..im not saying you way is completely wrong and definitely wont work. It certainly can. My point is that why do we have to base all our hopes on having a fetcher when there clearly arent any in SA currently. Should we not improve the ruck and tackle work of our forwards in general? The modern game is about staying on your feet and dominating the collision and keeping the ball alive and if it does go to ground hit the ruck hard and low to blow it open for quick ball. For me a fetcher slows the game not speeds it up. And as i said there currently arent any ‘fetchers’ in SA…the guys coming through the ranks are all ball players that can carry the ball and compete at rucks.

  • Comment 31, posted at 31.10.16 15:54:31 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @Vonno13 (Comment 30) : Look i do get your point BUT in the same comment you say we absolutely need a fetcher and then also say there are none and none coming through, well no fetchers in the traditional sense. So what should we do what my question…just give up? I am convinced we can play successfully without relying on a ‘fetcher’.

  • Comment 32, posted at 31.10.16 16:05:06 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 31) : Look, the days of the traditional fetcher is changing, they will start getting more hybrid like. But you need that one guy in your team that is exceptional on the ground. That is why the Sharks never needed a fetcher while we had Bissie, he fulfilled the role of fetcher for us. So with a player like that in your team, then you can choose a loose trio for example of Ginger Ninja, and both the Twins.

  • Comment 33, posted at 31.10.16 16:09:13 by KingRiaan Reply

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  • When was Coetzee made COO,I thought he was the marketing manager.

  • Comment 34, posted at 31.10.16 16:16:52 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 34) : also not sure exactly when it happens, but his area of responsibility keeps growing

  • Comment 35, posted at 31.10.16 16:18:22 by robdylan Reply
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  • @KingRiaan (Comment 33) : See i think both twins and Van Der Walt are good at ruck competing. So too is Etienne Oosthuizen. The reason SA teams look bad at ruck time is because we take forever and a day to get back to our feet from the ground and thus arrive late, and in a bad position

  • Comment 36, posted at 31.10.16 16:18:33 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 35) : Must be due to that brilliant Rugbyginners campaign, he was responsible for :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

  • Comment 37, posted at 31.10.16 16:39:02 by The hound Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 35) : think it’s because he’s doing a good job!

  • Comment 38, posted at 31.10.16 18:09:43 by JD Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 32) : bring back CJ Velleman

  • Comment 39, posted at 31.10.16 18:46:29 by Vonno13 Reply
     
  • @Vonno13 (Comment 30) : Boom Prinsloo is 184, Tier Schoeman is 1.88

  • Comment 40, posted at 31.10.16 20:19:10 by KingCheetah Reply

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  • @Vonno13 (Comment 39) : He is injured i believe. Also not convinced his benefit outweighs his penalty count and how he will fare in a team that dominates. Id still pick the 2 DuPreez over him.

  • Comment 41, posted at 01.11.16 08:57:16 by SheldonK Reply

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  • And the names we don’t see? Botha, vd Walt etc. Or do they already have contracts covering the next few years?

  • Comment 42, posted at 01.11.16 12:24:02 by coolfusion Reply

    coolfusionSuper Rugby player
     
  • @coolfusion (Comment 42) : yes they do.

  • Comment 43, posted at 01.11.16 12:56:46 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 43) : Well apart from the French dude its great to see the sharks commit to a team that can last past 3 years in terms of player age. Also seems like we kept most of the good ones.

  • Comment 44, posted at 02.11.16 07:01:22 by coolfusion Reply

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  • @coolfusion (Comment 44) : yes only Odwa and “the French dude” that’s pushing retirement!

  • Comment 45, posted at 02.11.16 12:25:19 by JD Reply
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  • Providing they stay injury free and i guess thats a big IF…but im looking for a big season from these guys next year:
    Pat Lambie
    Andre Esterhuizen
    JL DuPreez
    Phillip Van Der Walt
    Stephen Lewies
    Thomas DuToit
    Chilliboy Ralapelle

  • Comment 46, posted at 02.11.16 13:13:36 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 46) : can also add Adriaanse, Dan dP, EO, Marais, Botha etc!!!

  • Comment 47, posted at 02.11.16 13:16:24 by JD Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 46) : I always thought Dan was the better of the twins and definitely streets ahead of Rob jnr.
    Time will tell,I also believe he is a better lock than a flank.But I have been shouted down on these pages by cogonisti who insist he’s too short at the same time as Itoje who is shorter makes World rugby player of year shortlist.

  • Comment 48, posted at 02.11.16 13:33:09 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 48) : I think Dan has had a trying year as he wasnt in great form and then picked up a couple injuries. I wouldnt mind seeing him play at 4 at all but i dont see it likely. I think in 2017 he will need to try re-establish himself again.

  • Comment 49, posted at 02.11.16 13:48:40 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @JD (Comment 47) : To be honest i cant see any of Adriaanse, EO, Marais getting a lot better than they played this year. So hoping they can at least be consistent.
    Dan DP had a tough year so he needs to re-establish himself and get back in the team.
    Botha was a let down this year and i dont think he was in good condition so will just be happy to see him fit.

  • Comment 50, posted at 02.11.16 13:50:23 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 49) : Think Dan played injured for most of the year and then every game he was fighting for his place.Such a pity we never played those two with Marcel,

  • Comment 51, posted at 02.11.16 14:06:45 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 51) : Yeh definitely a missed chance there. Who knows how things would have turned out but a Sharks side featuring Lambie, Coetzee, Lewies, Dan Dup, Reinach for the full season could have been interesting…

  • Comment 52, posted at 02.11.16 14:24:14 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @The hound (Comment 48) : I’m less married to the idea than I was.

  • Comment 53, posted at 02.11.16 15:51:17 by robdylan Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 50) : think those 3 had a great season and I totally expect them to be the same or even a bit better next year.

  • Comment 54, posted at 02.11.16 16:47:46 by JD Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 53) : and what idea is that?

  • Comment 55, posted at 02.11.16 16:50:39 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 55) : the idea that Dan DuP should never play lock.

  • Comment 56, posted at 02.11.16 17:59:21 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 56) : out and out 5 lock, agree with you. Problem is, Rob feels he is an out and out 8, so don’t expect the switch will happen with Rob in charge

  • Comment 57, posted at 02.11.16 19:40:46 by Vonno13 Reply
     
  • @Vonno13 (Comment 57) : problem we have is that we need at least 2 out-and-out 4 locks. I’m not convinced Dan has the skills to be a 5, but could be a “meat shield” at 4, perhaps. Lack of height is a concern.

    I’m worried that our second-rowers are all far too rangy.

  • Comment 58, posted at 02.11.16 19:45:53 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 58) : I guess that depends on the type of style you want to play. Cheetahs cleverly used variations in lineout plays to better utilise Reniel Hugo and Justin Basson. Both are rangy type locks, but they run well into space vs. Crashing it up and they have been very good in this regard.
    I hope that Carl Wegner and Dennis Visser can come good, as I believe we will need more, to be competitive is S 18

  • Comment 59, posted at 02.11.16 20:08:52 by KingCheetah Reply

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  • @KingCheetah (Comment 59) : maybe I’m old fashioned, but I still think you need one of your locks to primarily act as a meat shield.

  • Comment 60, posted at 02.11.16 20:13:18 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 60) : Not old fashioned, guess if you have such a player it does add more options. With Lood off to the Bulls we don’t have that, so improvisation is required.

  • Comment 61, posted at 02.11.16 20:20:49 by KingCheetah Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 56) : ja not sure he will be needed as a lock at the Sharks but he could be a solid no 4.

  • Comment 62, posted at 02.11.16 20:28:39 by JD Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 60) : @KingCheetah (Comment 61) : must say EO is doing a good job at 4 and if fit Lewies can also do his part. Personally I’d rather shift Deysel to lock as I think Dan will be needed to help cover 7/8 to keep JL and Ginger Ninja fresh.

  • Comment 63, posted at 02.11.16 20:34:59 by JD Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 58) : Dan is maybe a year young to take up that mantel. I agree that he can be the rock you need at 4, but might need a year just to mature a bit. I also agree on locks, you need the Martin Johnson, Bakkies Botha, Kobus Wiese at 4. Someone to dominate the rucks and maul defense. We must all just remember one thing with Dan, his groin was completely ripped from the bone and he will need some time to get back in form

  • Comment 64, posted at 02.11.16 21:03:57 by Vonno13 Reply
     
  • @Vonno13 (Comment 64) : must say I do think EO is doing good at 4?! Would like to see him Cary on playing and let guys like Deysel Botha Lewies give him a break very now and then. Dan should help JL and Ginger Ninja to be fresh at 7/8?! But that’s how I see it.

  • Comment 65, posted at 02.11.16 22:01:02 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 63) : @JD (Comment 65) : I think Deysel needs to have one hell of a pre season as he was extremely poor this year. So much so that i feel we should rather move on from him…seems to be too big and heavy now…can he play prop?

  • Comment 66, posted at 03.11.16 08:01:46 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 66) : I still think he is a good impact player in the last 15 min provided he keeps his discipline, but I agree he is not starting material anymore

  • Comment 67, posted at 03.11.16 09:33:13 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 67) : He does make an impact but as you say i dont think he has the legs for more than 15min. Also if you play him off the bench it means you have to leave out someone who could add more value overall in my opinion. He also cant jump in the lineout which doesnt aide his utility cause off the bench.

  • Comment 68, posted at 03.11.16 10:10:29 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @JD (Comment 65) : Etienne is a wonderful player, but he is only one guy and his 2016 workload is going to come back to bite us at some stage. Also a little nervous about ho much longer he’s going to want to stick around, given that he is clearly not in the Bok picture.

  • Comment 69, posted at 03.11.16 10:23:02 by robdylan Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 66) : @robdylan (Comment 69) : for those reasons that I would move Deysel to 4 to help EO with the work load. For now I’d like to see Dan get back to match fitness and confidante anyway think Sharks will need to manage all the high impact players like JL, Ginger Ninja, Dan, etc to try and keep them fresh and avoid injuries.

  • Comment 70, posted at 03.11.16 10:30:49 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 70) : we have Giant Mtayanda as well and I personally think he is a fine player. Battles with injury, though, as do many locks these days

  • Comment 71, posted at 03.11.16 10:46:49 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 71) : he’s an option if he can stay fit. Not sure how I rate him at the moment as I think he under performed a bit.

  • Comment 72, posted at 03.11.16 10:52:12 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 70) : The problem with Deysel at 4, based on his current condition, is that he cant jump in a lineout and doesnt have the fitness to play more than 40min max. So as a depth option in case of injury he is a nice to have. But on most days i wouldnt include him in my 23 as it would mean accommodating him at the expense of someone who could add more value.

  • Comment 73, posted at 03.11.16 10:55:02 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 73) : but this is what this pre-season training must rectify to ensure all the player are fit and in form when Super rugby start.

  • Comment 74, posted at 03.11.16 11:03:51 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 74) : true

  • Comment 75, posted at 03.11.16 11:16:23 by 50shadesofshark3 Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 71) : I rate Andrews ahead of Mtayanda,who I find very docile for such a huge man, anyway my choice for locks would be Lewies,Botha,Dan ,Oosthuizen,Andrews in that order,,no place for Deysel o rMtayanda

  • Comment 76, posted at 03.11.16 11:18:58 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 76) : Yeh i would agree. Deysel and Mtyanda as purely depth injury cover. Id probably add young Jean Droste in there ahead of Deysel and Mtyanda too

  • Comment 77, posted at 03.11.16 11:26:37 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @JD (Comment 74) : Preseason to try and get fit yes…but there are no guarantees and some guys need more work than others which will be for their own account. Preseason cant get a player in form though…it can try and best prepare them but how they fare in the pressure game environment is really anyones guess

  • Comment 78, posted at 03.11.16 11:28:35 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 58) : @robdylan (Comment 56) : @The hound (Comment 48) : a player’s height s one of a few factors to look at when it comes to line-out ability (also receiving kick-offs).let’s look at standing reach and vertical leap.player 1 is 1.96m and player 2 is 2.00m. But both have the same standing reach and player 1 actually has a 4cm vertical leap advantage.plus his reaction time off the ground to max height is quicker.player 1 at ‘just’ 1.96m could then very well be the better line-out option.whiteley ,standing 1.93m ,managed to steal a ball from one off the abs locks in dbn ( who are 2.04m and 2.02m).once-off,yes.but did happen.there is more data required to line-out ability than just height.juan smith imo would have made a very good ‘traditional’ sa no4 lock,especially in this 30s.this doesn’t mean both locks should be 1.95/1.96.still feel the need for an athletic +2.04m lock in the middle of the line-out ,and kick-offs.
    An effective line-out must win their own ball and compete strongly at the front ,the middle,and the back.also have variation in their line-out play.and maul/defend the maul.

  • Comment 79, posted at 03.11.16 11:33:33 by 50shadesofshark3 Reply

    Under 21 player
     
  • @JD (Comment 74) : skill I would like to see next season is players to take a pass at pace without breaking stride.this will require 2 more skill developments.accurarate passing and catching.

  • Comment 80, posted at 03.11.16 11:54:22 by 50shadesofshark3 Reply

    Under 21 player
     
  • Assuming all personnel are fit this would be my preferred Sharks lineup:
    1. DuToit 2. Chilliboy 3. Adriaanse 4. Oosthuizen 5. Lewies 6. VD Walt (c) 7. DuPreez 8. Mthembu 9. Reinach 10. Lambie 11. Mvovo 12. Esterhuizen 13. Am 14. Van Wyk 15. Bosch
    Bench: Beast, Marais, Oosthuizen, DuPreez, Daniel, Claasens, Smith, Deysel, Ward

  • Comment 81, posted at 03.11.16 12:44:08 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 81) : bloody interesting lineup that. Are we allowed a 9-man bench now, though? :)

  • Comment 82, posted at 03.11.16 13:33:52 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 81) : not a bad team but would not shift vd Walt to 6. Think he’s probably one of the best no8′s in SA so would leave him there.
    @robdylan (Comment 82) : like Rob said interesting 9 man bench ;-)

  • Comment 83, posted at 03.11.16 13:39:37 by JD Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 82) : haha oops, mean to be Deysel/Ward

  • Comment 84, posted at 03.11.16 13:44:12 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @JD (Comment 83) : 2 ideas behind VD Walt to 6- 1. He is clearly behind a few guys at 8 for the Boks already and there is no out and out 6 currently established. And then he did play a game at 6 and i really thought he was good.

  • Comment 85, posted at 03.11.16 13:45:22 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 78) : Yes players will have to put in some extra work to get top fit but I do think RdP snr is the type of coach that will not monitor the progress of the players. Think he will inform players if he’s not happy with their progress so that should motivate them to do that extra work.

  • Comment 86, posted at 03.11.16 13:48:00 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 86) : As far as i am concerned being a pro athlete should mean self motivation but yes i see your point. Still doesnt guarantee anything and i have been a bit skeptical about the Sharks conditioning programs in the past…but as they say time will tell and im hoping for a positive outcome

  • Comment 87, posted at 03.11.16 13:54:09 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 87) : for sure the Sharks totally stuffed up with conditioning of some players so yes your skepticism is not unfounded. However what I’ve seen from RdP snr so far it seems as if he’s not the type of person that would except it if players are not giving it their best and that gives me a bit hope for next year. But like they say “the prop is in the puding” ;-) so only time will tell!!!

  • Comment 88, posted at 03.11.16 14:05:57 by JD Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 81) : I feel like Mthembu has had his chances and really has not put his hand up. I think he is an excellent bench option for the Sharks since he covers all three back row positions. Personally, if VD Walt is moved to 6 I would want to see Keegan or DdP at 8. Ideally, I still think Keegan is our best 6, so I would start him there, and rotate VD Walt, and DdP between 8 and 7, with JLdP our first choice at 7.

  • Comment 89, posted at 03.11.16 14:50:31 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 89) : Interestimg that you rate Daniel that highly. I think he does well as a captain but at the tackle and breakdown he gets dominated a lot and is pretty ineffective until the game opens up in the last 15min or so which is why id personally play him off the bench. I think Mthembu has had a lot of injuries so hard to really judge his form although he has played well in the last year when he has got game time. For me it would be ideal to start VD Walt at 8 and JL DuP at 7…then 6 is pretty much up for grabs and if nobody else then Daniel i guess

  • Comment 90, posted at 03.11.16 14:54:14 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 90) : I don’t disagree with your analysis of Keegan, I just feel there is nobody else the Sharks have that is a better option at 6. I also think Keegan is a great bench option, since he can also cover all three positions well, it is just that I don’t see anyone as a better option at 6 now at the Sharks. My opinion of course. I do think you could work through the season by rotating the four players, each getting equal game time, and always have a strong loose trio on the pitch. That with a few appearances from our other loosies to rest the first 4 should do the Sharks well for SupeRugby, assuming no decimation from injury.

  • Comment 91, posted at 03.11.16 14:59:18 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 91) : Yeh look dont get me wrong Daniel has good qualities- he is quick around the park and makes a number of cover tackles and has good hands, he is a good competing threat at the lineout. But in terms of forward play he is a non entity at the tackle/ruck and often gets penalised trying to make an impact, he is also a non entity at stopping a driving maul or contributing to pushing it. He is however a pretty good captain generally.

  • Comment 92, posted at 03.11.16 15:02:25 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 92) : I’m not sure I would go as far as saying he is a non-entity, perhaps not as effective as some. As I said, I do see your point about Keegan’s strengths and weakness. I am somewhat surprised though, if you are willing to move VD Walt to 6, why not play DdP at 8? It would seem to me, based on your previous posts, which I generally find very insightful, that you would be very happy with a preferred back row combination of 6 VDW, 7 JLdP, 8 DdP, with Keegan covering on the bench?

  • Comment 93, posted at 03.11.16 15:12:15 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 93) : Yeh maybe non entity is a bit strong but he isnt very effective. I do think the twins play well as a combo but im not yet convinced by either of them at 8 yet. SO if i played them together it would be at 6 and 7 with VD Walt at 8. VD Walt is a very classy 8th man

  • Comment 94, posted at 03.11.16 15:18:17 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 94) : hmmmmm I thought DdP had quite a few games at 8 in SuperRugby 2016, and I thought he excelled there. There were even a few games he kept VD Walt out (while both were uninjured). I think DdP has done extremely well at 8 and has certainly proved his worth there. My problem/concern is that none of the 3 are truly opensiders, so I struggle with which one of the 3 would be best at 6. In general though, I believe DdP is far stronger at 8 than at 7, again my opinion, and free at that, so worth every penny. :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

  • Comment 95, posted at 03.11.16 15:22:36 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 95) : Dan Dup did fairly well but i think VD Walt makes less errors at 8 than him and probably covers better. Having said that VD Walt is probably the best 6 of the 3 of them and can actually do well in that position. Will be interesting to see RDP’s thinking if everyone is fit. Through that new chap Vermuelen into the mix as well

  • Comment 96, posted at 03.11.16 15:28:23 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 96) : I felt Dan’s errors were due to his youth and inexperience. I believe that with some time, along with the mentorship of VD Walt, Dan could become the best 8 of the current crop in SA, again my opinion.

  • Comment 97, posted at 03.11.16 15:30:34 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 97) : He will most definitely get better and better the more he plays no doubt.

  • Comment 98, posted at 03.11.16 15:46:59 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 98) : Which is why I would want to see him get as much game time there as possible, hence why I would only change your team above by replacing Mthembu with him. My point with Terra is I don’t see him having the same growth potential as Dan, so Dan would clearly benefit more from game time. With your idea of VD Walt at 6, he could provide guidance and stability to Dan, perhaps sometimes playing 8 on attacking scrums as he excels off the back on attack.

  • Comment 99, posted at 03.11.16 16:07:32 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 99) : Thats fair enough

  • Comment 100, posted at 03.11.16 16:10:29 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 100) : Good discussion, I am hoping the same discussion has been held amongst the Sharks coaching staff.

  • Comment 101, posted at 03.11.16 16:13:35 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 101) : I think with the training squad they have they open to anyone making the side depending on how they fare at training etc

  • Comment 102, posted at 03.11.16 16:15:22 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 102) : How players do at training is very important, if not key factor. However, it is also very important to look to the future with regard to player development, and that is where potential should also come into play when determining your team. We need to have realistic expectations for the Sharks this upcoming season, and in my opinion that means understanding there is a rebuilding process in play, and part of that is making selections based on future considerations like player potential. A player like Dan can benefit so much from SuperRugby game time, I believer more so than any player in the current squad, that should be a critical factor in considering his selection, don’t you think?

  • Comment 103, posted at 03.11.16 16:24:13 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • In 2016, we made the SR playoffs, and regardless of what people think and say about the people who previously held the positions, we have a new CEO, new SR coach and our Director of Rugby has left. To expect anything more than a season of rebuilding is really unreasonable in my opinion. It is unfortunate since this is the season we were focusing on last year as the schedule would be much less stressful than last season, but we are now stuck with another rebuilding year. I think the Lions showed clearly that the so called more difficult schedule, playing the NZ teams is not necessarily a hindrance to going all the way in SR. For me, after almost a hundred years of building a team to finally be winners in 1990 it is far easier to endure one or two more years of rebuilding.

  • Comment 104, posted at 03.11.16 16:40:48 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 101) : @SheldonK (Comment 102) : Rob can just copy and paste this into email ……….. what am I saying no need for that as I’m sure they all read the blog anyway!!!

  • Comment 105, posted at 03.11.16 17:07:49 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 105) : It is so easy to be right typing on a computer keyboard with no pressure of having to answer to all the supporters……. ;-)

  • Comment 106, posted at 03.11.16 17:30:03 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 106) : yes and add to it that every supporter have their own ideas and personal favourites that must play and all of a sudden live as a coach becomes a lot harder!

  • Comment 107, posted at 03.11.16 17:38:32 by JD Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 103) : Thats a very fair point. Its all about selecting complimentary combinations whilst bearing in mind that you need to win today but also give players experience for tomorrow. Selections are a lot tougher in reality than on a blog :)

  • Comment 108, posted at 04.11.16 09:19:48 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • Here’s the thing, while we might agree this will be a rebuilding year, I also believe we have the talent, that with some good luck and avoidance of injury, the Sharks could do extremely well in this comp. It is a difficult balance, I think we have the talent and ability, we just need to develop the ruthless efficiency AND consistency. Consistency is so key, There are tens of thousands of golfers who can hit long straight drives, nice approach shots and even putt well, problem is all the bad shots thrown in there as well. The pro golfer rarely hits a poor shot. In professional rugby, your prop can not have the ability to scrum well, but has lots of bad scrums, or a 10 that can kick the ball a mile, but is inconsistent. A player like Lambie, known for his calmness and steadiness on the pitch is the epitome of consistency, other 10s in SA may have better or even additional skills, but none are as consistent as Pat. Beast is the same way scrumming.

  • Comment 109, posted at 04.11.16 12:55:31 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • April is only one year younger than Lambie, but could not be further away from him in consistency. If he could become consistent, wow, what a talent. I hope working with Lambie will help April in this regard, he could be a great if………

  • Comment 110, posted at 04.11.16 12:58:58 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 109) : Fitness and conditioning goes a long way in ensuring consistent performances

  • Comment 111, posted at 04.11.16 13:00:35 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 110) : he was playing club rugby a year ago. Do you seriously expect more from April than what he has given us to date? From what I have seen from a guy with so little experience I” very happy with him and would back him.

  • Comment 112, posted at 04.11.16 13:06:30 by GreatSharksays Reply

    Assistant coach
     
  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 109) : @SheldonK (Comment 111) : also comes from lots and lots of practice that cause the muscle memory to form. Like Gary Player use to say when asked about luck “the more I practice the luckier I get”.

  • Comment 113, posted at 04.11.16 13:10:38 by JD Reply
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    JDAssistant coach
     
  • @GreatSharksays (Comment 112) : I think you missed the point of my post, I never said I expected any more from April, I did say I thought that if he could become consistent he would be a great. The talent is there, the skills are there, the consistency is lacking, and no that is not surprising considering he was playing club rugby last year.

  • Comment 114, posted at 04.11.16 22:28:06 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @GreatSharksays (Comment 112) : @Dancing Bear (Comment 114) : don’t want to sound like a broken record but I still blame AC for April losing all his confidence and form. Hope he can get it together before next year as he’s a talented player but he’s running out of time to show he belongs in the “big league”.

  • Comment 115, posted at 05.11.16 12:08:59 by JD Reply
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