robdylan

Rob shows his hand


Written by Rob Otto (robdylan)

Posted in :Original Content, Sharks, Super Rugby on 9 Feb 2017 at 15:27
Tagged with : , , ,

By naming a strong starting line up for tomorrow’s warm-up game against a Bulls XV, Sharks coach Rob du Preez has left little doubt as to what he’s thinking in terms of selection for the Super Rugby season opener.

Du Preez said, ahead of last week’s Cheetah clash, that he would start the main game with a close to full strength team and the similarities to this week’s lineup show that most of the thinking is now quite clear.

Pat Lambie again captains, with the starting backline unchanged but for one position. Cobus Reinach starts at scumhalf, but the rest of the unit is the same.

Up front, the same locks start again, with Tera Mtembu in for injured Keegan Daniel in a straight swap at 8. Franco Marais and Lourens Adriaan start in the front row, replacing Chiliboy Ralepelle and Coenie Oosthuizen in the only other changes.

Sharks:
15 Curwin Bosch, 14 Kobus van Wyk, 13 Lukhanyo Am, 12 Andre Esterhuizen, 11 Lwazi Mvovo, 10 Pat Lambie (captain), 9 Cobus Reinach, 8 Tera Mtembu, 7 Jean-Luc du Preez, 6 Philip van der Walt, 5 Ruan Botha, 4 Etienne Oosthuizen, 3 Lourens Adriaanse, 2 Franco Marais, 1 Tendai Mtawarira

Substitutes: 16 John-Hubert Meyer, 17 Chiliboy Ralepelle, 18 Coenie Oosthuizen, 19 Wian Vosloo, 20 Jean Droste, 21 Jacques Vermuelen, 22 Jean Deysel, 23 Francois Kleinhans, 24 Rowan Gouws, 25 Benhard Janse van Rensburg, 26 Sibusiso Nkosi, 27 Jeremy Ward, 28 Johan Deysel, 29 S’bura Sithole, 30 Clement Poitrenaud



108 Comments

  • If anyone is going, please update scores. This team will make us as proud about the sharks brand going forward, as the 90′s boys did

  • Comment 1, posted at 09.02.17 15:36:00 by jdolivier Reply
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  • Any idea what the Bulls team is?

  • Comment 2, posted at 09.02.17 15:42:41 by ChrisS Reply
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  • Cant really argue with the supposed 1st choice team really. Perhaps the most interesting are the names that dont appear in either team..Stefan Ungerer, Michael Claasens, Garth April, Inny Radebe, Odwa Ndungane, Rhyno Smith.
    And then assuming the following are injured in same way: Keegan Daniel, Thomas Du Toit, Dan DuPreez, Stephen Lewies

  • Comment 3, posted at 09.02.17 15:44:04 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 3) : Interesting to see Rohan Gouws in the reserve team. He wasn’t in either of the squads for last week’s warm-up game. Also seems as though the openside Phillip experiment is ongoing.

  • Comment 4, posted at 09.02.17 15:54:37 by vanmartin Reply
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  • Is it going to be broadcasted

  • Comment 5, posted at 09.02.17 15:56:03 by Gerriecellcshark Reply
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  • @Gerriecellcshark (Comment 5) : Nope

  • Comment 6, posted at 09.02.17 15:58:15 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @vanmartin (Comment 4) : Glad to see Van Der Walt at 6 continuing.

  • Comment 7, posted at 09.02.17 15:58:40 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 7) : It does suddenly allow for some mouth-watering loosie combinations.

  • Comment 8, posted at 09.02.17 16:00:11 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 4) : Are you sure? I thought he played for the b team last week?

  • Comment 9, posted at 09.02.17 16:06:07 by robdylan Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 8) : i do like the idea of 2 bigger hard working loosies and then a quicker ball playing 8. Think it gives good balance to the scrums as well

  • Comment 10, posted at 09.02.17 16:06:47 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @vanmartin (Comment 4) : Typo in the team list. Rowan, not Rohan. Corrected now.

  • Comment 11, posted at 09.02.17 16:08:25 by robdylan Reply
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  • Youngsters Mukendi and Joubert were training with the squad, maybe left to their age group teams…

  • Comment 12, posted at 09.02.17 16:09:50 by Grasshopper Reply

    GrasshopperVodacom Cup player
     
  • @Grasshopper (Comment 12) : Mukendi seems to have eaten a few steaks since he left school. Interested to see if he makes the Sa u20 side

  • Comment 13, posted at 09.02.17 16:11:18 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 13) : What beefed up? He was quite beefy at school….lost pace?

  • Comment 14, posted at 09.02.17 16:15:27 by Grasshopper Reply

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  • @Grasshopper (Comment 14) : oh no no you should see him now. Dunno how his pace is looking though but he is a lot bigger than at school and even last year

  • Comment 15, posted at 09.02.17 16:19:46 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 3) : Maybe they know what they have in Ryno and want to see what the Frenchman brings? Like what I saw from JvR when he came on,but too short to really get an opinion. Hope tera has another good game,love that grubber from him last week!

  • Comment 16, posted at 09.02.17 16:35:38 by HeinF Reply

    HeinFTeam captain
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 15) : He won the school 100m champs in matric, great time too..

  • Comment 17, posted at 09.02.17 16:37:25 by Grasshopper Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 9) : @robdylan (Comment 11) : My bad, I searched only on ‘Rohan’ in the previous squad announcement.

  • Comment 18, posted at 09.02.17 16:43:43 by vanmartin Reply
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  • Excitement is building…

  • Comment 19, posted at 09.02.17 17:22:37 by pastorshark Reply
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  • Must say I like the team but would swop Ginger and Terra.

  • Comment 20, posted at 09.02.17 21:37:36 by JD Reply
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  • @HeinF (Comment 16) : I first saw JVR playing for Pukke and was impressed, and he also impressed with his cameo last week but as you say time will tell more. Tera is very under rated due to all his injuries- if he can stay fit and conditioned he can be very good. And yeh perhaps you right regarding Ryno Smith

  • Comment 21, posted at 10.02.17 08:20:42 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @Grasshopper (Comment 17) : He impressed me a lot when he was at school, especially the demolition of College at KP. But always wondered if he could translate that to senior rugby. He certainly has the build now so lets see what he can do.

  • Comment 22, posted at 10.02.17 08:21:44 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @JD (Comment 20) : Terra would disappear at 6. If you gonna switch VD Walt to 8 then rather play a Kleinhans or even Deysel at 6. Just an interesting comment from Eddie Jones recently when asked about players a bit out of position- he said the number on your back only dictates where you start at a set piece, after that you are a rugby player on the field. I think sometimes we a bit too concerned with the number on a guys back

  • Comment 23, posted at 10.02.17 08:22:33 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 23) : 8 is a pretty important number in a pretty important set piece though!

  • Comment 24, posted at 10.02.17 09:03:33 by Die Kriek Reply

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  • @Die Kriek (Comment 24) : I agree, I am very worried about our no8

  • Comment 25, posted at 10.02.17 09:08:32 by Uli Boelie Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 23) : @Die Kriek (Comment 24) :

    I think when Dan is back we will be well covered.

  • Comment 26, posted at 10.02.17 09:11:09 by Uli Boelie Reply
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  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 26) : Just a wild thought, when Lewies is back you could play Oosthuizen at 8 behind Botha and Lewies,kinda like a Dance Rossouw behind Bakkiesand Victor.

  • Comment 27, posted at 10.02.17 09:36:28 by The hound Reply
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  • @Die Kriek (Comment 24) : @Uli Boelie (Comment 25) : @Uli Boelie (Comment 26) : Why are we worried about our no.8?? Am i missing something? There is Tera and Jaques Vermuelen both good 8s. Then Van Der Walt can play there if needed but is filling a gap at 6. Then there is Dan DuPreez when fit and then Keegan comes back. I really dont think 8 is a worry at all

  • Comment 28, posted at 10.02.17 09:38:16 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 28) : I think we rather have a shortage of outright open-sides

  • Comment 29, posted at 10.02.17 09:57:57 by Bokhoring Reply
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  • @Bokhoring (Comment 29) : i would agree which is why i hope the experiment with VD Walt continues. Although to be fair to him Kleinhans showed up well in his little cameo last week too.

  • Comment 30, posted at 10.02.17 10:04:35 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 30) : Kleinhans was a beast. He really got stuck in and seems a lot more determined and phyaical this year.

    Does anybody know who is in the Bulls XV?

  • Comment 31, posted at 10.02.17 11:17:59 by ChrisS Reply
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  • @ChrisS (Comment 31) : I just posted the (shit) lineup

  • Comment 32, posted at 10.02.17 11:20:23 by robdylan Reply
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  • @ChrisS (Comment 31) : Yeh was impressed with Kleinhans cameo…will see if he gets a chance this year. Its tough to include him on the bench though as only really covers 1 position

  • Comment 33, posted at 10.02.17 11:21:15 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 33) : I dig Franna – but can he stay fit? He’s 26 now and has yet to play a full season since his junior days.

  • Comment 34, posted at 10.02.17 11:45:42 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 34) : Think a couple guys fit into that bracket…can he stay fit and offer value…can Jean Deysel stay fit….Stephen Lewies too. The looking at guys like Khaya Majola and Odwa Ndungane…are they still offering value for their contracts. All those guys are genuinely decent guys and been loyal to kzn but the questions have to be asked

  • Comment 35, posted at 10.02.17 11:51:33 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 35) : You can add Pat’s name too. Can’t imagine he has played in more than 16 Super Rugby matches in 3 full seasons?

  • Comment 36, posted at 10.02.17 12:53:36 by KingCheetah Reply

    KingCheetahTeam captain
     
  • @KingCheetah (Comment 36) : Yes very true. He was the obvious one so left him out as if he is fit he will definitely play.

  • Comment 37, posted at 10.02.17 13:02:00 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @The hound (Comment 27) : That’s actually not such a bad idea.

    @SheldonK (Comment 28) : Tera- no comment, I don’t know how good Jacques is so I cant comment on him either. VdW, well he is a great player, but not the no8 we need, yes when Dan is back and when KD is back. but until then I am not convinced we have the right personnel to play no8. Thus far I would need to play a wait and see game.

  • Comment 38, posted at 10.02.17 13:02:50 by Uli Boelie Reply
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  • @KingCheetah (Comment 36) : Your thoughts on the Cheetahs so far from preseason games? Same story different year in terms of defense?

  • Comment 39, posted at 10.02.17 13:02:52 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 38) : Thats very interesting thoughts. Cant say i agree but each to his own. Vermuelen is a highly rated youngster, comfortable at 7 or 8 and can sub at lock if really required. Very athletic and likes to be involved. You say VD Walt not the no8 we need- what type of no8 would you like as of interest?

  • Comment 40, posted at 10.02.17 13:05:15 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 40) : Warren Whitely

  • Comment 41, posted at 10.02.17 13:23:55 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 41) : I would say Tera, Keegan and to an extent Vermuelen fits that same mould type as Whiteley

  • Comment 42, posted at 10.02.17 13:27:38 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @KingCheetah (Comment 36) : Speaking of the seasonally injured, do you know if Goosen has returned to SA and if he is farming now?

  • Comment 43, posted at 10.02.17 13:48:19 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 43) : As far as i know he is working at a Stud farm, not sure where though

  • Comment 44, posted at 10.02.17 13:50:02 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 44) :P robably his father’s he used to be a Lipizaner type, dressage champion.

  • Comment 45, posted at 10.02.17 14:39:23 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 45) : Goosen not his father.

  • Comment 46, posted at 10.02.17 14:58:26 by The hound Reply
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  • @Uli Boelie (Comment 38) : why no comment on Tera?

  • Comment 47, posted at 10.02.17 15:22:52 by robdylan Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 39) : I honestly don’t know what to make of it, as yet. Think Franco is playing his cards close to his chest. Either that or we are in for another long season. I am hoping it’s the former.

  • Comment 48, posted at 10.02.17 15:23:39 by KingCheetah Reply

    KingCheetahTeam captain
     
  • @KingCheetah (Comment 48) : I dont think he has played his key men in their combos yet so as you say tough to tell. But judging on the preseason games defense in the 2nd half seems to be an issue again which is where the Cheetahs seem to lose a lot of games near the end. Perhaps a fitness thing or poor subs issue.

  • Comment 49, posted at 10.02.17 15:26:31 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 49) : reckon they’re missing Venter at the moment.

  • Comment 50, posted at 10.02.17 15:35:41 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 50) : Yeh big time, Boom Prinsloo makes a difference too.

  • Comment 51, posted at 10.02.17 15:38:24 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @Salmonoid the Subtle (Comment 43) : I do believe he is in SA, saw an article somewhere, that he was involved in a shooting incident, whilst hunting with a friend. He is involved in a horse stud farm I believe.

  • Comment 52, posted at 11.02.17 08:27:10 by KingCheetah Reply

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  • @KingCheetah (Comment 52) : If you say returned to sa foes that mean in a playing capacity?

  • Comment 53, posted at 11.02.17 15:59:38 by coolfusion Reply

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  • @coolfusion (Comment 53) : No, not to my knowledge.

  • Comment 54, posted at 12.02.17 16:19:08 by KingCheetah Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 23) : @Die Kriek (Comment 24) : that’s true but I would have Ginger Giant at 8 specifically because of the scrum. Going forward it’s “easy” to play 8 but going back it’s becomes a lot harder. Ginger is the kind of player that can make those “bad” balls better by using his power to get some forward momentum.

  • Comment 55, posted at 12.02.17 17:26:20 by JD Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 41) : don’t get me wrong I like Whiteley as a player but he did “disappeared”a bit when the Bokke pack was under pressure. Personally I still prefer Ginger at 8 at the Sharks.

  • Comment 56, posted at 12.02.17 17:30:10 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 56) : So agree with you. I think Ginger offers more as a complete 8, than Whiteley. Whiteley looked good in the combo he played in, Whereas Phillip will look good regardless.

  • Comment 57, posted at 12.02.17 19:28:34 by KingCheetah Reply

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  • @KingCheetah (Comment 57) : yes Phillip seems like one of those guys that just works his socks off without loonking for “glory”. Really glad Sharks was able to sign him!

  • Comment 58, posted at 12.02.17 20:56:40 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 55) : Yeh look i cant argue that VD Walt isnt a good 8- he is a very good 8 BUT currently he is probably seen as the 4 or 5th choice 8 in SA, whether rightly or wrongly. So for his own aspirations and also to fill a very big need at both the Sharks and Boks if he can make a successful move to 6 then it both benefits the Sharks (who do have other no.8 options) but also gives him a big chance to push for the Bok no.6 slot that is very wide open

  • Comment 59, posted at 13.02.17 08:35:04 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 59) : I guess it depends how long AC can fend the wolves off, and who succeeds him. Whiteley got picked in public sentiment, and because other contenders were either injured or hadn’t stamped their claims as yet. vd Walt should have returned a year earlier. Don’t think there is a 8 in SA with his combination of real grunt and linking skills.

  • Comment 60, posted at 13.02.17 09:24:13 by KingCheetah Reply

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  • @KingCheetah (Comment 60) : Yeah I feel the same way, don’t see any other 8 like him(vd Walt) in SA especially with physicality in mind. WW is certainly not a physical presence a pack although he’s very good at avoiding contact and run into open spaces but in tighter games like internationals you need a bit of both(physicality and link-up play) and vd Walt seems more balanced in that regard.

  • Comment 61, posted at 13.02.17 09:33:52 by Quintin Reply

    QuintinSuper Rugby player
     
  • @KingCheetah (Comment 60) : @Quintin (Comment 61) : Yeh look it depends how selectors view him but if im not mistaken i dont think he has ever been on the Bok radar as an 8th man. Perhaps because he is more solid than spectacular. I just think he can make a successful move to 6 and think his Bok chances are perhaps higher there

  • Comment 62, posted at 13.02.17 10:19:13 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 62) : Yeah I wasn’t really talking about him in the Bok setup, just saying that I think he has a more balanced game at 8 than WW has and IMO his physicality and skill set balance is better suited to international matches.

    It’s scary that we haven’t heard a thing regarding our Bok coach. We haven’t had a single training camp yet either have we? SARU already screwing us this year by not being decisive early on, we needed to start planning our season in January. Once the SR starts there won’t be any time for that until the French show up on our doorstep.

  • Comment 63, posted at 13.02.17 11:18:46 by Quintin Reply

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  • @Quintin (Comment 63) : If you play VD Walt at 8 for the Sharks who would you play at 6 and 7 then? just curious.
    In terms of the Boks- we dont usually have a Bok camp at this time of year anyway so nothing different there. In terms of the coach AC is still in charge as nothing has been said to suggest anything otherwise. So in terms of the Boks there is really nothing different to previous years…the coach continues and first camp will be before June series

  • Comment 64, posted at 13.02.17 11:36:09 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 62) : I think that is because when he really started to perform for the Cheetahs, Thormeulen was the incumbent, and there was also Arno Botha. Currently he should be on their radar.

  • Comment 65, posted at 13.02.17 11:54:04 by KingCheetah Reply

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  • @KingCheetah (Comment 65) : I reckon he is currently behind Vermuelen, Whiteley, Notshe…whether rightly or wrongly just think thats the case

  • Comment 66, posted at 13.02.17 11:56:18 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @KingCheetah (Comment 65) : @SheldonK (Comment 66) : with SARU looking at limiting overseas based players Vermuelen might be getting out of the picture and I’m sure Notshe is playing 6 or 7 for Stormers.
    Personally I think currently Ginger Giant is the best 8 playing in SA but yes I understand your reasoning for him moving to 6 to maybe have a better chance of playing for the Bokke.

  • Comment 67, posted at 13.02.17 12:45:44 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 67) : Will be very interesting to see the mix of local vs foreign for these June internationals

  • Comment 68, posted at 13.02.17 12:57:55 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 66) : Notshe? Really don’t see why! Has he really made any impact at all? He has been hyped for sure, but going on Super Rugby form for 2016, only Ginger and Whiteley really performed.

  • Comment 69, posted at 13.02.17 16:25:51 by KingCheetah Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 68) : yes that will be interesting indeed! Have an feeling it might be mainly local based players.

  • Comment 70, posted at 13.02.17 16:59:54 by JD Reply
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  • @KingCheetah (Comment 69) : for sure! Personally I’d love to see a combination of Kriel/Boom, Cassiem and Ginger Giant play in June test.

  • Comment 71, posted at 13.02.17 17:02:37 by JD Reply
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  • @KingCheetah (Comment 69) : My reason is simply because Notshe has been involved before whereas VD Walt has not. Remember i said its not a matter of whether he ‘should be’ there but just a matter of what it is rightly or wrongly

  • Comment 72, posted at 14.02.17 08:27:15 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @JD (Comment 71) : There are a lot of possible combos…could go local in 6. Kriel 7. DuPreez 8. VD Walt…or foreign in 6. Coetzee 7. DuPlessis 8. Vermuelen or even multiple other combos

  • Comment 73, posted at 14.02.17 08:30:54 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 64) : Yeah I know there’s nothing different than previous years in terms of the Boks this time of the year, that’s my worry. If we had some clarity regarding our coach, we could have had one or two sessions before the SR starts to lay out plans for the players, especially after the year we had last year, but there is no one taking any initiative.

    @SheldonK (Comment 73) : With the France nr. 8 Picamoles coming in at 116kg 1.92m, we better bring some big boys to the party, and he is in good form too! What about (foreign included) 6. Coetzee 7. vd Walt(?) 8. Vermeulen.

    Not sure about vd Walt at 7 though but that’s a big loose trio right there.

  • Comment 74, posted at 14.02.17 09:07:26 by Quintin Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 73) : One also has to ask if there is a better local pack than the following 1.Steven Kitshoff 2. Bismarck DuPlessis 3. Vincent Koch 4. Flip Van Der Merwe 5. Juandre Kruger 6. Marcel Coetzee 7.Jacques DuPlessis 8. Duane Vermuelen…yes there is perhaps a more flashy pack in SA…but a pack to get the grunt work done?

  • Comment 75, posted at 14.02.17 09:08:37 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @Quintin (Comment 74) : That being said though I think we will see a strong move away from overseas based players this year.

  • Comment 76, posted at 14.02.17 09:09:07 by Quintin Reply

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  • @Quintin (Comment 74) : The number of the back doesnt make a big difference just that the players have the skills and attributes needed and combine well

  • Comment 77, posted at 14.02.17 09:10:17 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 77) : Yes that’s true, a good coach will asign tasks to players with the skills that suite their game.

  • Comment 78, posted at 14.02.17 09:19:22 by Quintin Reply

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  • @Quintin (Comment 78) : A good coach will be able to recognize the best player in each position and have enough suss to be able to combine their individual brilliance into one united focus, which is called a team.
    To call for only local players in the Bok team is seriously naive, rather call for the best players to be in the team.
    Thats where we should start, and then realise that every restriction you put on that selection is a restriction that weakens the team.

  • Comment 79, posted at 14.02.17 09:43:19 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 79) : Penny for your thoughts if you had to pick the June test loose trio and bench now, assuming everyone is fit?

  • Comment 80, posted at 14.02.17 09:44:38 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 80) : Assuming everyone was fit is not the criteria,how they will be rated in June is.
    Will Marcel come back better from his long layoff, how much stronger will Jean Luc be now he is a year older, and is Duanne Vermullen a year past his best.
    In June you will know the answer to all three, thats my selection by the way.

  • Comment 81, posted at 14.02.17 10:15:00 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 81) : Yeh i do get your point and strong selection. Although it does get tough to try and compare how well say a Marcel is playing in Europe compared to say Jaco Kriel in super rugby…if they both doing well who is really doing better? Does it become a reputation or personal preference thing? Tough to compare form over different comps is my point.

  • Comment 82, posted at 14.02.17 10:19:52 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 82) : That is why you have selectors, they shouldn’t be selectors if they can’t be completely impartial and have no other agenda than to pick the best team.They should be above being blinded by reputation and personal,provincal loyalties.
    But that never happens and get the situation where Schalk Burger gets picked year after year and Jean de Villiers gets picked as the captain despite never playing 3 games in a row for 10 years.

  • Comment 83, posted at 14.02.17 10:29:58 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 83) : I dont think selectors anywhere can be truly unbiased…all have personal preferences in some form. Also as i said how do you compare performances over 2 different comps ?

  • Comment 84, posted at 14.02.17 10:53:49 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 84) : I personally think the success of the All Blacks team over the past 10 years was that they have come close to unbiased selection.To be an All Black you had to only do one thing be the best in that position, that week.
    When last could we truly say that,I don’t think we ever had it in our entire rugby history.

  • Comment 85, posted at 14.02.17 11:21:32 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 85) : I think the All Blacks success is a lot more than unbiased selection. The quality and quantity of their talent make selection a lot easier even if it was biased. Over the last 20yrs of professional rugby NZ has by far had the best rugby players and not just the ones representing the All Blacks. Dont think thats just because of selection. But yes in SA we do have unique considerations but at least we can pick foreign players, which if we were NZ we wouldnt be able to.

  • Comment 86, posted at 14.02.17 11:24:37 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 86) : Maybe its because in NZ it means more to be an AB than anything else, they know that it means they are the very best in their position.
    When they know their time is over they move overseas, Ma Nonu,Dan Carter.
    That is definitely not the case here.

  • Comment 87, posted at 14.02.17 11:35:47 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 87) : I dont think its a motivation thing, ask any young rugby player in SA and they will tell you that they want to be a Bok. I just think we need to accept that NZ has superior rugby players quite simply. Their population has a better genetic makeup and they just excel at rugby. Yes there are minor things like programs and approaches etc etc but at the end of the day they are just better players just like their are better rugby players in SA than Japan.

  • Comment 88, posted at 14.02.17 11:41:51 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 88) : I disagree with you totally,just look at our 7′s team, no genetic inferiority there.
    In fact when you look at that mix its almost perfect.
    Secondly look around the British and European teams at the young South Africans who have no desire to be a Bok,
    Thirdly the player drain is not only white players.

  • Comment 89, posted at 14.02.17 12:03:47 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 89) : How can you disagree when looking at the last 20yrs? Yes there are one off exceptions etc but overall NZ players are just better. You mention our 7s team now, what about NZ 7s over the last how many years when they have won series after series. We can come up with excuses but the fact remains NZ players are just better, no way around it.

  • Comment 90, posted at 14.02.17 12:09:55 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 90) : The NZ system is better ,not the players, we have hugely talented players, think Joost,Matfield,Bakkies,Honnibal,Andre Venter,Danie Gerber,shit I could go on for ever, nothing genetically inferior to any one .We just have a shite corrupt self serving system and have always had it

  • Comment 91, posted at 14.02.17 12:29:12 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 91) : The system is just a small part. For all those Sa players you name there are just as many new zealanders just as good if not better plus hundreds that are just under that. Its a tough thing to admit for south africans but sometimes people are just better at things. And NZ has better rugby players than SA simple as that. Yes there are small contributors such as the system and coaching but overall they are just naturally better.

  • Comment 92, posted at 14.02.17 12:34:07 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 92) : I can only disagree vehemently with you.

  • Comment 93, posted at 14.02.17 12:42:49 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 93) : Thats fine, life would be boring if everyone agreed all the time. Im just going on what ive seen the last 20yrs of pro rugby.

  • Comment 94, posted at 14.02.17 12:44:40 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 94) : Agree to disagree, but one final word please show me the player anywhere in the world who was ”genetically superior ”to Bakkies Botha

  • Comment 95, posted at 14.02.17 12:55:47 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 95) : Jerry Collins, Martin Johnson, Brad Thorne, Paul O Connell, Brodie Rettalick, Sebastion Chabal…just names that pop into my head that have the same if not better physical attributes. Bakkies was a good player but so were many others.

  • Comment 96, posted at 14.02.17 13:05:26 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @The hound (Comment 95) : Bakkies had no brain, so virtually any player with an IQ above 12 was probably genetically superior on some level.

  • Comment 97, posted at 14.02.17 13:56:08 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 97) : You obviously never met him ,and base your assessment on the same stereotypical bullshit,you so like to rail against.

  • Comment 98, posted at 14.02.17 15:01:45 by The hound Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 96) : Ask any of those players who they would consider the hardest man they ever played against and Bakkies would be in the first two.

  • Comment 99, posted at 14.02.17 15:03:25 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 99) : And im sure Bakkies would say the same thing about them when asked who was toughest he played against. Again not saying Bakkies wasnt physically good…just so were others. My point was not about individuals, my point was that overall in sheer numbers NZ has the best natural rugby players.

  • Comment 100, posted at 14.02.17 15:06:37 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 96) : I would throw in the two Venters AJ and Andre as well as Juan Smith

  • Comment 101, posted at 14.02.17 15:12:53 by KingCheetah Reply

    KingCheetahTeam captain
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 100) : Never debated that point.it was your point we were genetically inferior to the New Zealanders that i take exception to.

  • Comment 102, posted at 14.02.17 15:16:01 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 102) : Overall looking at all our players and theirs yes i believe we are. Again im not talking one off individuals, but overall

  • Comment 103, posted at 14.02.17 15:33:50 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonKAssistant coach
     
  • @The hound (Comment 98) : you got me there. I am weak, but he is a Blue Bull.

  • Comment 104, posted at 14.02.17 15:36:04 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 104) : I have met him he is extremely polite ,very soft spoken,and modest almost shy.Huge family man and fucken awsesomely powerful.A very impressive human being.

  • Comment 105, posted at 14.02.17 15:57:03 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 105) : and all the on-field disciplinary issues were just one big misunderstanding, I’m sure. Or a conspiracy.

  • Comment 106, posted at 14.02.17 16:27:37 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylanHead Coach
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 106) : Put it down to over enthusiasm,boisterousness and an excess of adrenaline.

  • Comment 107, posted at 14.02.17 16:35:03 by The hound Reply
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  • And as Tanna so famously said ”Its not a game of tiddlywinks mate”

  • Comment 108, posted at 14.02.17 16:36:17 by The hound Reply
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