robdylan

Fresh transfer rumours – and why I’m not too worried about them


Written by Rob Otto (robdylan)

Posted in :Original Content, Sharks, Super Rugby on 20 Feb 2017 at 13:17
Tagged with : , , , , ,

Tongues are wagging after a number of weekend news outlets reported that Northampton are keen to acquire the services of not only Cobus Reinach, but also Pat Lambie. While I view these reports as little more than speculation at this stage, I’d like to try and put some of this to bed in the interests of focusing on this week’s REAL news – the start of Super Rugby.

Let’s start with the basics – the obvious. Good South African payers are always in demand overseas. There are always offers and many of them take these offers. This is a wider issue affecting not only the Sharks and it’s one that I have already written about a number of times. In the interests of not repeating myself, I’ll be brief – we need to pay more money to fewer players. That’s the only way we can compete.

Now, looking at this one specifically, the Reinach rumour is not new. There’s considerable speculation doing the rounds that he may already have signed a contract, but the reality is, nobody is saying anything. The Sharks have told us they are aware of the offer and are in negotiation with the player, whose contract expires this year. Cobus will have taken the exclusion from the World Cup squad in 2015 pretty hard and has had nearly a year out of the game (due to injury) to brood over that slight, while watching others play for the Boks in his place. Sharks aside, I wouldn’t be surprised if he was seriously considering throwing in the towel and chasing the money, but perhaps a good season for the Sharks and the offer of a Bok contract could convince him otherwise? Let’s hope that’s the case.

Pat’s situation is rather different. He holds two separate contracts, one with the Sharks and another with SA Rugby and both are valid through 2019. In order to move anywhere, Pat would need to break both of those deals, which is simply not something I can picture him doing, knowing a little of his character. The Sharks have shown willing, in the past, to release players if their heads and hearts are already set on playing overseas, but there is absolutely no reason for the Springboks to do the same, barring, of course, a massive fallout in the future between Lambie and the Springbok management that would see him unlikely to play for the national side again.

It’s important to note that there is no indication at this stage that Pat Lambie isn’t firmly in the Springbok plans, hence no reason I could see for SA Rugby to accede to a contract termination request, should the player even want to request one.

No, to me, this is just wishful thinking on Northampton’s part and smacks a little of a sort of “with enough money we can have anyone we want” arrogance. Pat will stay put and see out his contracts; let’s hope that Cobus can be convinced to hang in there and give it another shot as well.



64 Comments

  • The basics of this is that Lambie is unlikely to go anywhere unless he is firmly out the Bok picture in 2017. If Reinach isnt part of Bok plans in 2017 chances are he will go, if he is part of the Boks he could be persuaded to stay with a nice contract renewal from the Sharks and possibly Boks. With the strength of our currency i just wonder how ‘cheap’ is it for Euro clubs to get South Africans as opposed to Aussies and New Zealanders.

  • Comment 1, posted at 20.02.17 13:21:47 by SheldonK Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 1) : I think they’ve shown that they can afford players from any of the three countries. It’s really all about motivation, at the end of the day. Why is it easier to sign Bok players than All Black players?

  • Comment 2, posted at 20.02.17 13:24:48 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 2) : I think lifestyle plays a big part. For the majority NZ is basically a small town country with a couple big cities, even then big is relative. So the players there are quite happy with the standard of living they get from the contracts they are on from NZ rugby. There isnt as much drive for bigger and better money as compared to SA. I also think central contracting plays a part, as does the strength of the NZ super rugby and test sides. The Aussies are a tricky one- i dont think they are in demand as much as South Africans and New Zealanders and even the good ones that do go overseas dont usually last too long.

  • Comment 3, posted at 20.02.17 13:28:54 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 2) : I think, that if anyone has actually spoken to Pat before any of these rumors started, they would know that he is the type of person that would not just break a contract signed as you said, his family and love for the Sharks is far deeper in his blood than i think most people would see on the surface, so as you pointed out, think that the saints is just trying to throw a stone in thr bush and see what happens, or it is trying to lure Cobus with some more bait in him playing with a familiar FH, not surr just my thinking behind it

  • Comment 4, posted at 20.02.17 13:34:43 by Henkb Reply
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  • Not to sound overly flippant but que sera, sera. We know our top players get targeted and we don’t know if they’ll stay or go yet but life will carry on regardless.

  • Comment 5, posted at 20.02.17 14:14:03 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 5) : If the Sharks close the doors after Lambie goes to the UK im gonna blame you entirely :mrgreen:

  • Comment 6, posted at 20.02.17 14:24:13 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 6) : Just my personal opinion here but Marcell Coetzee would be the bigger loss between the two

  • Comment 7, posted at 20.02.17 14:35:34 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 7) : Well thats just stating the obvious…Marcel is a much bigger human than Lambie :cool:

  • Comment 8, posted at 20.02.17 14:38:19 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 8) : Let me put it this way, if we were to shup up shop after a player leaves us, I would have expected it to happen with the departure of Marcell Coetzee

  • Comment 9, posted at 20.02.17 14:40:36 by vanmartin Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 9) : that’s it – i’m pulling the plug

  • Comment 10, posted at 20.02.17 15:07:26 by robdylan Reply
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  • I feel that if anyone is mentioned in a rumour they should be dropped as they obviously dont have their full focus on the Sharks… :cool: :grin:

  • Comment 11, posted at 20.02.17 15:25:18 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 11) : yeah, we should definitely drop Cobus and Pat. Also Ettas.

  • Comment 12, posted at 20.02.17 15:46:13 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 12) : Agreed…and we should be on the lookout for other names mentioned just in case…

  • Comment 13, posted at 20.02.17 15:50:19 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 13) : actually, let’s drop all players whose contracts expire in 2017

  • Comment 14, posted at 20.02.17 15:52:50 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 14) : how about a commission to try all those we think are guilty of unSharklike activities?

  • Comment 15, posted at 20.02.17 15:53:36 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 14) : @robdylan (Comment 15) : U can never be too careful…weed out those not fully committed to the cause…

  • Comment 16, posted at 20.02.17 15:54:58 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 16) : I think i remember seeing Andre Esterhuizen at the Spar…now Spar isnt a Sharks sponsor so wonder where he is off to, have you heard anything?

  • Comment 17, posted at 20.02.17 15:56:03 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 3) : I initially liked your argument, until I thought of players like Ruan Pienaar, Bakkies Botha, and Bissie and Jannie, none would be considered city slickers, yet all ended up in Europe. How do you explain that? Do SA small town okes have big city attitudes?

  • Comment 18, posted at 20.02.17 16:01:53 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 18) : Why did the likes of Pienaar, Bossie and Jannie move to Durbs instead of staying in Bloem? Money and Fame? Again there will always be exceptions i just think in general my point holds true. But it is only one of the factors. I think even if you asked the players themselves they couldnt pinpoint one main thing, although think money would be very close to top of the list for all

  • Comment 19, posted at 20.02.17 16:04:26 by SheldonK Reply

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  • Look, I certainly hope this article has it spot on…
    But at the end of the day I’m with van…

  • Comment 20, posted at 20.02.17 16:04:52 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 19) : Reading your original point, you indicate this as a general attitude in NZ, clearly I understand not everyone fits in the box. So if this is the general attitude in NZ, do you think that in general South Africans have more of a big city attitude. These are serious questions, bot being facetious.

  • Comment 21, posted at 20.02.17 16:07:31 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 18) : Maybe the reason NZ finds it easier to keep players is because they beat Italy and Japan from time to time? Or the chance to learn from Wayne Smith and the like is more enticing than say Proudfoot or Mzwandile Stick? Who knows? :???: :???:

  • Comment 22, posted at 20.02.17 16:09:24 by West Indies Cricket Board Reply
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  • Re: “the SA vs NZ and Aus in terms of players targeted by Europe” thing…clearly one major factor is the buying power our money has versus the buying power of NZ and Aus money. That simple difference will always make it easier to tempt our players compared to theirs…

  • Comment 23, posted at 20.02.17 16:09:49 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 19) : One thing is certain, having traveled much around the world, South Africans are more prevalent almost everywhere, working outside SA, and most expect to return to SA. South Africans are closely followed by Israelis, but you rarely see New Zealanders, except in small sectors of the sailing/boat building community. I guess that kind of proves your point.

  • Comment 24, posted at 20.02.17 16:10:39 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 21) : I genuinely think SA players have more of a big city attitude as you put it compared to NZ players. This is just my personal feeling having chatted to guys from both countries and friends that stay over but i just feel NZ players are more comfortable with what they are paid and the subsequent standard of living it brings where as SA players always seem to want bigger and better…again generalising though.

  • Comment 25, posted at 20.02.17 16:11:02 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 22) : :mrgreen: :mrgreen: ;-) Or maybe the reason we lost to Italy and Arg and Japan is because our best went overseas? ;-)

  • Comment 26, posted at 20.02.17 16:12:04 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 17) : let’s get him in front of the panel and find out. We ahve to be sure

  • Comment 27, posted at 20.02.17 16:12:45 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 27) : And they thought the Spanish Inquisition was hectic…just wait

  • Comment 28, posted at 20.02.17 16:13:33 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 25) : No I get it, using generalizations in debate and discussion is perfectly acceptable, clearly different cultures have different “attitudes”, it is I think, important to learn these differences, it makes communicating with those from other cultures much easier and more effective. Thanks for your thoughts, I actually thought you were spot on initially, just wanted to get a little deeper into your thoughts.

  • Comment 29, posted at 20.02.17 16:15:26 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 27) : Since I am not living in SA, I would guess that Cell C is a cell/mobile phone service company. So what of those players, coaches and employees of the Sharks who have a service contract with Vodacom??????? Scandalous! :lol:

  • Comment 30, posted at 20.02.17 16:18:52 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 29) : Ah ok cool. Yeh when you start looking at cultures and influences it can get quite interesting. Not only in how it affects the players attitudes but also how they play the game and what they are good at.

  • Comment 31, posted at 20.02.17 16:20:24 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 31) : And also off the field, how well they will adapt to the new environment and enjoy that experience. South Africans and Aussies tend to be more outgoing, and NZers more reserved in my experience. That could certainly affect how one ends up enjoying the overall experience, thus whether they remain long term or not.

  • Comment 32, posted at 20.02.17 16:24:12 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 31) : Mostly you gave it far more thought than the standard “The NZers have more respect/love for the jersey than SAans,”

  • Comment 33, posted at 20.02.17 16:25:57 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 33) : Yeh def not as simple as that, and actually think thats a rubbish reason. Far much more to it than that, and to an extent also very situation specific

  • Comment 34, posted at 20.02.17 16:28:38 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 18) : Maybe ,just maybe New Zealanders are quite secure about the lifestyle they will have in New Zealand after they hang their boots.
    Where as South Africans are not, the pressure is on the South African players to get as much money they can out of the game while they still can.
    Most of those Grey College boys have been living that life since they were at junior school, very few them came from Bloem and were scouted like professionals at 12 .Maybe money even changed hands at that level.
    Very few them remained loyal to the Free State after school, and immediately took the best offer they could, they are totally conditioned to take the next big one as it comes along.
    Pat on the other hand is a different kettle of fish,dont think he is motivated by greed, but then again remember his Grand father Nic Labuschagne who played rugby for England long before it was fashionable to do so.
    Maybe he thinks his playing days are numbered and would just like to get out everything that he can.

  • Comment 35, posted at 20.02.17 16:29:05 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 35) : one rider to what I wrote above. I think if Pat suffers another injury, he will be off.

  • Comment 36, posted at 20.02.17 16:32:39 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Dancing Bear (Comment 24) : @SheldonK (Comment 25) : Guys, in terms of all this – both re: rugby and re: in general – there are many more factors involved. They are economic, social, psychological and more…and some of them are complicated. Personally I think the one you’re debating is quite far down the list of contributing factors…
    I mean, go ahead debating…I’m enjoying the reading…I just thought I’d say that…

  • Comment 37, posted at 20.02.17 16:33:06 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 34) : Yep, consider the overseas Boks who are “protesting” what is happening with the Boks. That passion is driven by something, they are taking huge risks to their careers by speaking out the way they do, why do it unless you love/respect the Bok jersey. You can argue if they are right or wrong but the problem is NOT a lack of love/respect for the jersey, rather just the opposite driven by it. So I agree it is a rubbish argument.

  • Comment 38, posted at 20.02.17 16:34:04 by Dancing Bear Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 36) : Fair point…so intensify praying now is what you’re saying?

  • Comment 39, posted at 20.02.17 16:34:28 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 36) : I think if he suffers one more injury he will retire.
    By the way how did Vickerman die?

  • Comment 40, posted at 20.02.17 16:34:56 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 40) : nobody is saying….

  • Comment 41, posted at 20.02.17 16:36:19 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 41) : That is very sad.

  • Comment 42, posted at 20.02.17 16:37:35 by The hound Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 35) : Good comment…

  • Comment 43, posted at 20.02.17 16:39:16 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @The hound (Comment 42) : agree. Strong speculation, of course, that it was suicide, but no confirmation.

  • Comment 44, posted at 20.02.17 17:05:07 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 41) : @The hound (Comment 42) : very sad indeed!

  • Comment 45, posted at 20.02.17 21:06:51 by JD Reply
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  • @pastorshark (Comment 37) : Yeh 100% there are many factors involved and different factors for each individual i feel. So it is very case specific. I do however feel that the money factor is a main contributing factor in all scenarios…but definitely not the sole factor

  • Comment 46, posted at 21.02.17 08:57:28 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @robdylan (Comment 44) : Yeh apparently any story about his death is followed by a suicide helpline number or advert in Australia. But as you say no confirmation of anything from anyone yet

  • Comment 47, posted at 21.02.17 08:59:01 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 46) : I still believe we must bite the bullet and not pick overseas guys. Simply put a Super contract plus a Bok contract brings you much closer to Toulon money than a Toulon contract plus a Bok contract does. Without googling I can name John Smit, JDV, Matfield, Percy, SBW, Ben Smith, Folau etc etc who have chosen the Jersey over money, when they were not given the chance to butter their bread on both sides. What this “system” is doing to the Springboks is just incidental, the real damage is being done to the local game.

  • Comment 48, posted at 21.02.17 09:49:40 by West Indies Cricket Board Reply
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  • @West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 48) : Ah look there are pros and cons to both sides of the argument. I think privatisation of the unions would be a help but so too would the number of Bok contracts awarded. With a possible career ending injury around the corner its very tough to tell these players they should rather choose to play for the Boks than secure their financial futures. I have no problem with overseas players being picked BUT then they must attend all the same camps and hit the same fitness requirements at the same time as the local players. If they cant then they shouldnt be picked. But its a lot more complicated than picking the jersey over money.

  • Comment 49, posted at 21.02.17 09:58:38 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 48) : I agree. But we need the fans to also be realistic about the short-term impacts on the Bok team and not throw a hissy fit every time we lose.

  • Comment 50, posted at 21.02.17 09:58:54 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 50) : My hissy fits are reserved only for when we lose to tier 2 nations. We must never, under any circumstances accept losing to Italy.

  • Comment 51, posted at 21.02.17 10:51:38 by West Indies Cricket Board Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 49) : Private ownership is definitely some light in the tunnel. I still believe our clubs would do better by joining leagues in the North with all the sponsorship, money and timezone benefits. The Bulls and Sharks for example would be much more popular in London than they could ever be in Sydney. International sponsors would get more bang for buck. The main thing is the timezone though. So much more exposure for the sponsor. Every game the team plays is primetime TV. Not 9 o’clock on a friday morning bullshit. And I do believe the northern unions would love to have us. But ja, just dreaming out loud.

  • Comment 52, posted at 21.02.17 11:01:28 by West Indies Cricket Board Reply
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  • @West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 52) : And if you then HAD to pick overseas boks, at least you are picking players from the same league with the same schedules etc.

  • Comment 53, posted at 21.02.17 11:04:07 by West Indies Cricket Board Reply
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  • @West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 52) : The big problem is that there is no incentive for the Leagues up North to include SA teams. We have a weak economy, they would have to travel much greater distances and they already have a successful product with packed stadiums each week. All the benefit is for us joining them, no benefit for them. Privatisation could be a good thing BUT that doesnt mean companies etc will actually get on board- as i mentioned we have a weak economy currently.

  • Comment 54, posted at 21.02.17 11:41:57 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 53) : World Rugby has come out and said they will be trying to schedule a global season post the 2019 RWC.

  • Comment 55, posted at 21.02.17 11:42:37 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 54) : Ja it was Regan Hoskins who kept telling the world how the North wanted us so badly. Probably just bluffing for better deal with Sanzar. But damn, it would make sense.

  • Comment 56, posted at 21.02.17 12:06:21 by West Indies Cricket Board Reply
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  • @West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 56) : From a travel and tv coverage point of view yes it would be cool but yeh as i said we dont bring much to the table to offer them.
    Im very interested to see what develops when/if this privatisation of the Unions becomes possible. The Kings will effectively become a state owned enterprise :mrgreen:

  • Comment 57, posted at 21.02.17 12:10:52 by SheldonK Reply

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  • @SheldonK (Comment 57) : haha. a non-profit one.

  • Comment 58, posted at 21.02.17 12:15:57 by West Indies Cricket Board Reply
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  • @West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 51) :

    I’m always a little intrigued when people say that.
    What exactly does it mean?
    You will never accept that the Boks lost to Italy? They did lose to Italy! You will never accept that they may do so again? The reality is that you do not control the future and can not change the past. That’s the universe we live in and it does not care whether you accept it or not.

  • Comment 59, posted at 21.02.17 14:32:53 by fyndraai Reply
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  • Ok, we lost you again. Let me explain slowly using an example. If a rugby team is a restaurant and the players are the chefs and fans are the customers. Then if the food is shit and the customers dont accept it, then the food will have to improve or the customers will stay away. So effectively the customer does control the future of the restaurant. Pop me an email and Ill draw you a sketch.

  • Comment 60, posted at 21.02.17 14:59:10 by West Indies Cricket Board Reply
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  • @West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 60) :

    Got it
    Except in your case you keep going back to the restaurant and keep on eating the food.
    You proclaim you will never accept bad food, yet you do. How come?
    Feel free to draw me a picture of this.

  • Comment 61, posted at 21.02.17 17:30:48 by fyndraai Reply
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  • @fyndraai (Comment 61) : I honestly dont my brother. And not out of spite either. Its just that the springboks with all their sideshows just dont make my palms sweat anymore. Not like the sharks anyway. Not since HM. Its almost March and we dont even know who the captain and coaches are. And Im not alone, if you just look at the empty seats and lack of sponsors. Its [email protected] heartbreaking man.

  • Comment 62, posted at 21.02.17 18:25:28 by West Indies Cricket Board Reply
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  • @SheldonK (Comment 46) : Yup…

  • Comment 63, posted at 21.02.17 20:25:31 by pastorshark Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 50) : agreed

  • Comment 64, posted at 22.02.17 06:54:39 by revolverocelot Reply

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