robdylan

Bulls confirm Adongo coup


Written by Rob Otto (robdylan)

Posted in :Bulls, Original Content, Sharks on 14 Nov 2011 at 13:48
Tagged with : , , , , ,

The Blue Bulls today announced the signing of Kenya’s finest export, Daniel Adongo, from the Sharks.

The massive Adongo, standing 1.97m in his socks and weighing 112kg at latest count, runs the 100m in under 11 seconds and was a winger in his age group days, before transitioning to a utility forward role with the Sharks Vodacom Cup team.

Big Dan played a big role for the Sharks XV in 2011, where coach Sean Everitt seemed keen to back him, regularly playing him at loose forward and lock. A lack of gametime in the Currie Cup, though, has led to no further progress for the 22-year-old, who lacks somewhat in ball skills and positional awareness, having come to the game relatively late in life. Bulls supremo Heynecke Meyer has seen the potential that John Plumtree has chosen to ignore, though and Adongo looks set to be developed further in the light blue of the Bulls.

Adongo will be contracted to the Bulls until the end of 2013 and we’d like to wish him all the best for his future career. We’re sad to see you go, Dan – but at least you’re in good company. The only way for a rugby player to get better is to play rugby and it would have been nice to see what you could offer, rather than continuing to play Willem Alberts and Jean Deysel into the ground.


184 Comments

  • An Impressive signing by the Blue Bulls.Looks like Stander will stay at the sharks it was between him and daniel.Daniels athletism and speed is what impressed Mr Meyer we will work with his skills and reading of the game that will be sorted out by the forwards coach van graan.

  • Comment 1, posted at 14.11.11 14:00:12 by Muzi Reply
    Muzi
     
  • I sense some frustration in you article Rob?

    No worries, I understand why.

  • Comment 2, posted at 14.11.11 14:01:33 by Morné Reply
    Author
    Morné
     
  • I saw Dan play and he does lack some rugby ‘sense’ but dammit the guy has got huge potential and under some good coaching could become great.

    I still think he should rather play wing than among the forwards. I wonder why he was moved?

  • Comment 3, posted at 14.11.11 14:08:50 by Pokkel Reply
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  • Our loose forward depth looks something like this: 8thman(Pierre Spies,CJ Stander,Arno Botha) Blindside flanks (Dewaldt Potgieter,Jacques Potgieter,Daniel Adongo,Jono Ross) Openside flanks(Deon Stegmann, Warrick Tecklenburg, Wiaan Liebenben) Not bad at all.

  • Comment 4, posted at 14.11.11 14:09:12 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • Sad to lose Dan. Damn Sharks have lost some good youngsters to the Lions now Dan to the Bulls. Think he is talented and watch the Bulls will play him and get the best out of him. Just wish we had faith in him and played him more.

    Go well Dan all the best at the Bull.

  • Comment 5, posted at 14.11.11 14:11:10 by Puma Reply

    Puma
     
  • The bulls started preseason vandag lots of hard work ahead.Hopefully we will have a better 2012 super 15 season.I wonder who will be the captain.My money is on Pierre Spies,Potties and Chilliboy.

  • Comment 6, posted at 14.11.11 14:12:45 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 6) :

    I don’t think Spies and especially Potties even deserve to make the starting 15 for the Bulls.

    Chilli will probably get is.

  • Comment 7, posted at 14.11.11 14:17:09 by Pokkel Reply
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  • Why do we see things Sharks management and coaches don’t??? FFS!

  • Comment 8, posted at 14.11.11 14:20:45 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner Ice
     
  • Let’s be honest. The Sharks don’t have the patience and the skills coach to nuture kids who have potential but are not quite there. Think he will do better at the Bulls with their structures.

  • Comment 9, posted at 14.11.11 14:22:45 by Mocho Reply

    Mocho
     
  • Pokkel give it a rest geez Pierre Spies will start at number 8 for the vodacom blue bulls Deal with it!

  • Comment 10, posted at 14.11.11 14:26:19 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • If you are a Sharks supporter get used to this, I’m afraid we gonna loose some of our bigger assets this season or just after, cause they not getting game time or being played out of position… Count these words… I am a Sharks supporter, a frustrated supporter… 👿

  • Comment 11, posted at 14.11.11 14:28:21 by Franshark Reply
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    Franshark
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 10) : Pokkel don’t have 2, you do….

  • Comment 12, posted at 14.11.11 14:29:36 by Franshark Reply
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    Franshark
     
  • By the way Wyand Pienaar started training with the bulls in the currie cup season i hope he has recovered from his injury.We need a full back Asap.Zane and Jurgen are solid maybe Ulrich Beyers will get a chance.

  • Comment 13, posted at 14.11.11 14:29:56 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • Lets put a few things into perspective though…yes Adonga is a big,strong and quick guy. But the Sharks and Bulls have good loose forwards to I cant see him getting much gametime there. I think the Bulls will look to make him a lock which the Sharks should have done (i dont know if they tried or not). I havnt seen him play much but from what i hear his handling was on the low side and penalty count on the high side. Maybe its just a case of the Sharks rather backing their u21s to come through.

  • Comment 14, posted at 14.11.11 14:31:36 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonK
     
  • Franshark who you talking about lindeque???..stander????..Cloete???

  • Comment 15, posted at 14.11.11 14:32:26 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 10) :

    I don’t have to deal with it you do. I agree he will play but it doesn’t mean he deserves it.

    Potties has gone backwards IMO and I’m not sure he’s a guaranteed starter.

  • Comment 16, posted at 14.11.11 14:38:31 by Pokkel Reply
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  • At lock we are abit thin Gernu Eksteen and Mostert are not even ready yet.Young van heerden and marvin orie have potential.We will have to wait for our 4 junior star locks hehe jacques du plessis,dennis visser,phillip du preez,irne herbst to develop exciting times.

  • Comment 17, posted at 14.11.11 14:41:23 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • The only loose forward who is guaranteed a start is Pierre Spies at number 8 full stop, finish,klaar and if you have a problem with it suck on it !

  • Comment 18, posted at 14.11.11 14:45:15 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @ comment 8:

    i am guessing that FFS stands for ‘Favourite Free Stater’ :mrgreen:

  • Comment 19, posted at 14.11.11 14:45:51 by dawj Reply

     
  • @Muzi (Comment 18) : that’s not necessary… we’re all entitled to our opinions here. Fact is, most Sharks fans (nay, most non-Bulls fans) see Spies for what he is – an overrated showpony – and if you can’t handle THAT on a Sharks site, then I guess it’s you who should be doing the sucking.

    Now apologise to Pokkel.

  • Comment 20, posted at 14.11.11 14:49:24 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @dawj (Comment 19) : 😆

  • Comment 21, posted at 14.11.11 14:49:55 by Franshark Reply
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    Franshark
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 20) :

    No worries! I like seeing him getting so worked up about nothing! 😆

  • Comment 22, posted at 14.11.11 14:51:09 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @Muzi (Comment 15) : I’m even worried about lambi, if he does not play 10 his gonna be lost…

  • Comment 23, posted at 14.11.11 14:51:43 by Franshark Reply
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    Franshark
     
  • @Pokkel (Comment 7) : there’s no way heyneke will drop spies, however rubbish he may be.

  • Comment 24, posted at 14.11.11 14:55:40 by Megatron Reply

    Megatron
     
  • @dawj (Comment 19) : for now that will have to do! 😆

  • Comment 25, posted at 14.11.11 14:58:36 by Ice Reply
    Competition Winner Ice
     
  • welcome to Blue Bull country Dan,haven’t seen much of him outside a couple of bench cameos last year for the u21s,hope you have a long and fruitful career here at the Bulls. Would play Botha or Stander ahead of Spies,but the reality is that Spies will don the 8 jersey,you guys should keep Wiaan Liebenberg’s name in mind, reckona year or two from now he’ll be the 1st choice opensider for the Bulls

  • Comment 26, posted at 14.11.11 14:59:48 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • @Franshark (Comment 23) : Where is Lambie gonna go…CPT? Players are not bigger than the game. They get played serious money to play so should play where they are told.If they think they better than the team then they must leave as they will not create a good team environment.

  • Comment 27, posted at 14.11.11 15:10:34 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonK
     
  • geez, accepting the fact that we are losing a few good youngsters, but its impossible to keep them all… The senior side can only accommodate a certain amount of players in the squad, and contract those guys. Lets say we kept Dan, then they would have left someone else out, like one of the Marais brothers… Its sad to see them go, but as i said, impossible to keep everyone happy.

    We played in the Super 15 quaters and CC final, and still you guys are frustrated… you are really a hard bunch to keep happy. The bulls can afford to sign youngsters, as they are losing alot of their senior guys. We, on the other hand, have got most of our senior guys still with us. So if you all want to see the sharks keep their youngster, its only going to happen if the senior guys leave.

  • Comment 28, posted at 14.11.11 15:11:08 by VanWilder Reply

    VanWilder
     
  • @VanWilder (Comment 28) : Very wise words!

  • Comment 29, posted at 14.11.11 15:14:50 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonK
     
  • Immediately we have no need for Dan but who knows in a couple of years time, the likes of Alberts and Deysel might decide to further their careers abroad and we might be looking for some continuity and not have it.

    There are 2 things to remember about SA rugby.
    1. We are overstocked with good looseforwards. It’s a schoolboy preferential position for big talented kids.
    2. The Bulls can’t possibly accommodate all the talent they’re taking on board, at the moment at the very top level ie CC and SR. They perhaps will be at an advantage in that they can select the best guys to keep on but something will have to give in their programme at some stage in the next few years and when that does happen, I believe that a few officials up there in Pretoria will come to the realisation that many of their perceived investment signings have to be reclassified as expenses (some costly ones)- players the paid good money to join the Bulls and then could not use and finally had to watch sign with other Unions.

    I’m pretty sure we’ll see this process working in cycles. One Union feeling the need to overcompensate by signing more than they need at inflated prices no doubt, only to back off later and let a different Union take up the spending reins.

    I hope it doesn’t sound like I’m talking cr*p :mrgreen:

  • Comment 30, posted at 14.11.11 15:37:14 by beet Reply
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    beet
     
  • @beet (Comment 30) :

    Sounds right.

  • Comment 31, posted at 14.11.11 15:39:28 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @beet (Comment 30) : U make perfect sense, well at least i understand the logic. At the Sharks we currently have a lot of fairly young senior players (centres apart) and most of them are Boks or have Bok caps. The Bulls on the other hand have had a lot of their senior guys leave this year and as such they dont know who is next in line and hence want to cover themselves everywhere. But in time the Sharks senior guys will move on and then it will be the Sharks that need players and guys at the Bulls/Lions etc that can get a place will move to a Union that requires there services… and so things go round and round.

  • Comment 32, posted at 14.11.11 15:43:34 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonK
     
  • @beet (Comment 30) : “We are overstocked with good looseforwards. It’s a schoolboy preferential position for big talented kids.”

    SARU should issue a directive that a quarter or a third of those kids must be moved to centre. A midfield quota* if you will. :mrgreen:

    *I know this is a contentious term to use on Sharksworld. I trust that everyone reading this comment understands the context in which it is used.

  • Comment 33, posted at 14.11.11 15:46:50 by vanmartin Reply
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    vanmartin
     
  • @vanmartin (Comment 33) :

    I agree wholeheartedly. Imagine Kanko and Keegan were “TOLD’ to move to centre early in their careers?

    @beet (Comment 30) :

    Beet would you continue playing Dan as a loosie. What do you think his potential is as a JPP like wing?

  • Comment 34, posted at 14.11.11 15:49:29 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 33) : yes yes… I grant you a temporary and very specific exemption.

    Use a better word next time 🙂

  • Comment 35, posted at 14.11.11 15:49:30 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 35) :
    Jeez you were here in a flash. Do you have alarms that go off when words like that are used on the site? :mrgreen:

  • Comment 36, posted at 14.11.11 15:51:15 by Pokkel Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 35) : I have decided on “allotment” for future use. 😀

  • Comment 37, posted at 14.11.11 15:57:26 by vanmartin Reply
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    vanmartin
     
  • I’m extremely pissed off, said this a while ago, our coaching anability resulted in Adonga not being given a chance. Well done Heyneke Meyer, you have built an impressive 2012 squad. Stupid Sharks management, you guys make me sick. I’ve been calling for Adonga’s naturing for ages. Instead we pin our hopes on predictable players playing a one dimensional game plan that can be defended by any half descent coach. No coaching, no strategy, no vision, no backline play, no sht.!

  • Comment 38, posted at 14.11.11 16:01:24 by GreatSharksays Reply

     
  • @beet (Comment 30) : I agree absolutely, and here’s the proof of your theory, using your words, slightly modified: “…I believe that a few officials down there in Durban will come to the realisation that many of their perceived investment signings have to be reclassified as expenses (some costly ones)- players they paid good money to join the Sharks and then could not use and finally had to watch sign with other unions, such as Jacques-Louis Potgieter.”

  • Comment 39, posted at 14.11.11 16:04:20 by Culling Song Reply
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    Culling Song
     
  • @beet. I’ve been thinking the exact same thing regarding the Bulls signing-spree. I don’t think any other union has any interest in spending so much money for supposed depth though, and it’s unlikely to move on to other teams.

    The solution, I think, is to introduce a salary cap, and central contracts for the Springboks to help unions like the Cheetahs retain their best players/Springboks. It’s partly SARU’s responsibility to help them.

    @muzi. Regarding Bulls captaincy. I hope they give it to Chiliboy. He’s a sure thing to start every game when fit now that Gary Botha has left, surely! Dewald Potgieter doesn’t even warrant a starting place, and Pierre Spies is not captaincy material. Maybe Juandre Kruger or Wynand Olivier if they’re desperate. Even a youngster like Arno Botha or Francois Venter could fill in.

    Bulls need to drop/replace Werner Kruger, Deon Stegmann, Dewald Potgieter & Zane Kirchner a.s.a.p. Normally I’d have Basson in there as well, but he adds some value. He’s got the athleticism. Just needs to want to tackle, or otherwise his position should be on the line as well.

  • Comment 40, posted at 14.11.11 16:09:06 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • @Pokkel (Comment 36) : you seriously need to ask that question after all this time?

  • Comment 41, posted at 14.11.11 16:10:05 by robdylan Reply
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  • @vanmartin (Comment 37) : a lovely word… very agricultural

  • Comment 42, posted at 14.11.11 16:10:32 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • The Bulls are also the one side where I feel, despite them looking good already, they have a lot of players sitting on the sidelines who are so much better then the incumbents.

    I’d put their potential best down as:
    1 Morne Mellett – No fan of Greyling at all.
    2 Chiliboy Ralepelle – 3rd best hooker in SA. Deserves to start more.
    3 Rossouw de Klerk – Not ideal, but heck he’s better then Kruger.
    4 Flip van der Merwe
    5 Juandre Kruger
    6 Not sure, but I’d play Arno Botha here. No point having Stegmann on the field when he makes no impact.
    7 Jacques Potgieter perhaps?
    8 Pierre Spies – But needs to play better then he does for the Springboks.
    9 Francois Hougaard
    10 Morne Steyn
    11 JJ Engelbrecht
    12 Wynand Olivier/Francois Venter
    13 Johann Sadie/Francois Venter
    14 Bjorn Basson
    15 Have no idea. Bulls got nobody, but Beyers could be the best of a very bad bunch.

  • Comment 43, posted at 14.11.11 16:15:40 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 43) :

    Then again, maybe we’ll see Lionel Cronje at fullback.

  • Comment 44, posted at 14.11.11 16:21:34 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • Nooooo…! If only we had campo at the sharks (as skills coach) to work with adongo .. 🙁

  • Comment 45, posted at 14.11.11 16:22:43 by bergshark Reply

    bergshark
     
  • @bergshark (Comment 45) : forget that mate, no vision at Sharks HQ.Plum and RS are not a good combination.

  • Comment 46, posted at 14.11.11 16:28:39 by GreatSharksays Reply

     
  • What boggles my mind is that we don’t pass the ball around that much so you not having the best of skilld shouldn’t be an issue! Adongo should never have been overlooked? Our home grown boys that were considered scrap at the Sharks are now beating us and having the last laugh…Rhodes comes to mind.

  • Comment 47, posted at 14.11.11 16:36:48 by GreatSharksays Reply

     
  • @GreatSharksays: do the coaches spent time with the players after normal training hours to work on their technique? Just can’t understand why they let campo go? And not get someone of the same skill to replace him?

  • Comment 48, posted at 14.11.11 16:37:26 by bergshark Reply

    bergshark
     
  • Let’s hope the next signing announced by the sharks is that of skills coach..

  • Comment 49, posted at 14.11.11 16:39:33 by bergshark Reply

    bergshark
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 44) : Yup Ulrich Beyers is the best junior full back we have.

    Blommetjies is small,Kirchner is well kirchner :mrgreen: and visser is a flyhalf not a full back.

    Maybe if Wynand Pienaar has a great season for tukkies he may get a chance to impress.

  • Comment 50, posted at 14.11.11 16:39:58 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @bergshark (Comment 48) :

    Campo was an idiot. That’s why they let him go. Talented player back in his day, but most of the stuff that comes out of his mouth are beyond belief.

    Much like Ollie le Roux… or Robbie Kempson. Being a good player doesn’t make you a good coach.

  • Comment 51, posted at 14.11.11 16:41:16 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • Alberts also underwent a shoulder injury ..hope these guys ( our boks) don’t get over played next season 🙁 rhodes couldve been perfect in the 4/7 role. ( Also taking some strain off alberts and deysel ).

  • Comment 52, posted at 14.11.11 16:41:49 by bergshark Reply

    bergshark
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 44) : At loose head young juan louw schoeman has a big future ahead for him he had a great season for the under 21s this year for a prop he reminds me of frans malherbe.

  • Comment 53, posted at 14.11.11 16:42:31 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @hendrikp: I just care about what rugby skills he can teach the individual players.

  • Comment 54, posted at 14.11.11 16:44:46 by bergshark Reply

    bergshark
     
  • The Bulls will announce their Super 15 squad and captain on wednesday.

    Apparently its between chilli and spies.

  • Comment 55, posted at 14.11.11 16:44:59 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 50) :

    Can’t imagine a guy who’s not part of the core squad being a long-term solution. Very rarely that happens.

    The gap between full-time professionals and club players are widening by the day.

  • Comment 56, posted at 14.11.11 16:46:31 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 56) :

    I forgot to mention. His arrogance wouldn’t have gone down well with most players.

  • Comment 57, posted at 14.11.11 16:51:22 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 50) : I really like Wynand Pienaar. I’ll stick my neck out and say he’s better than Visser.

    Ulrich Beyers remains a bit of an enigma for me. I haven’t really seen the star quality that he feel he has. The Bulls obviously went out of their way to get him from WP. I feel that he wud have had limited opportunities in Cape Town anyway. But he surprised me and had a good final vs the Sharks. I have to concede that one.

  • Comment 58, posted at 14.11.11 16:53:49 by beet Reply
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  • @Muzi (Comment 53) : he got nicely sorted out in the scrums by our guys in the final.

  • Comment 59, posted at 14.11.11 16:58:39 by beet Reply
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    beet
     
  • @beet (Comment 58) :

    Lot of varsity cup players (especially UCT & maties) being picked up lately hey! Not many adding huge value though if we’re to be completely honest. Unless you include the ones who’d already been part of their respective provinces U-19 or U21 sides also.

  • Comment 60, posted at 14.11.11 16:58:51 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • @bergshark (Comment 54) :

    He can’t teach them anything that will make them any better.

    With his arrogance, he’d probably try take over anyway. No one is interested in working with Campese because he spends half the time talking about how he used to do it. Thinking rugby is all about the goose steps and so forth.

    If he were any good he’d have offers coming his way. Instead he’s in Fiji promoting a beach-side sevens tournament.

  • Comment 61, posted at 14.11.11 17:02:51 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 53) :

    That the guy that played for the Baby Boks?

    He was terrible. No big future there pal.

  • Comment 62, posted at 14.11.11 17:05:20 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • @beet (Comment 59) : let’s give Nick Schonert his due… the kid’s a monster!

    Re Rossouw de Klerk… not convinced he’s better than Kruger. Chadwick flipping ate him twice this year.

  • Comment 63, posted at 14.11.11 17:12:50 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Pokkel (Comment 34) : Honestly Daniel is the kind of player who can make opponents pay dearly for giving him an inch of space. He is quick and powerful.

    However as a centre, I’d have concerns over his hands. They are not good at the moment and his passing isn’t good either.

    As a wing, I’d be licking my lips at the prospect of him getting the ball coz he probably wouldn’t have to pass it 90% of the time. However I’d be extremely anxious about a guy who had to drop back deep and field a high ball even if there was no pressure on him to make the catch. I’d have concerns over his clearance kicking game as well, particularly under pressure.

    As a looseforward, I think he still needs to acquire a much better feel for his responsiblities on the field. Being able to read the game is kind of second nature to top level guys who’ve played it from a young age and are well acquinted with their positions. Daniel doesn’t have this benefit of years of experience to rely on. Particularly on D, he needs to be more alert, certain of where to stand and who to mark and probably how to communicate. I think these negatives also work against him being a centre.

    For me, at 1.96 and as athletic yet strong as he is, developing him as a lock would be my first preference. He can get up high in the lineout and get in a quick jump ahead of his opponent. I’d aim to produce another Radike Samo but it would not be a short-term plan. There is still a lot of work to be put in. The Bulls have a couple of softies at lock in their system right now – Fudge and Hess. I can Daniel passing them on the value chart quite easily just from a physical point of view and indications are there that he is an extremely committed hard worker on the training ground and in the gym as well.

    Pacy Radike stood out at lock for the Brumbies in his breakthru season of S12. He’s now a dependable l/fwd. Daniel could turn out the same way.

    I like to believe that the Sharks make good decisions on which juniors to keep and which to let go but at 22 I can’t help but feel that we should try hold onto him for a couple more seasons.

  • Comment 64, posted at 14.11.11 17:22:27 by beet Reply
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    beet
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 40) : certainly wouldn’t be misplaced(the captaincy I mean) with Arno Botha,think he’ll be a Bok captain,post 2015 I reckon,for now the safest bet should be Schalk for the Boks. I’m really keen to see Botha get a run with the Bulls in SR,rate this lad very highly

  • Comment 65, posted at 14.11.11 17:26:22 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 43) : Cronje!

  • Comment 66, posted at 14.11.11 17:26:47 by GreatSharksays Reply

     
  • @robdylan (Comment 63) : Thats true Rob. I don’t think I’ve mentioned him once this season. He’s an underrated player at u21 level. Our u21 frontrow had huge boots to fill based on the quality of the 2010 team and did a standout job.

  • Comment 67, posted at 14.11.11 17:29:07 by beet Reply
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    beet
     
  • @beet (Comment 64) : I would have also given him the number 5 jersey.

  • Comment 68, posted at 14.11.11 17:31:49 by GreatSharksays Reply

     
  • @Ludz (Comment 65) : PLEASE can someone explain to me exactly which body of water this Arno Botha kid has walked over to b e so highly rated?

    Is there a youtube clip or something showing him actually doing anything special? All I’ve seen of him was at the JWC where he looked decent (albeit selfish) against opposition of a similar age.

  • Comment 69, posted at 14.11.11 17:31:59 by robdylan Reply
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  • @beet (Comment 67) : what do you make of Mienie? He’s even more underrated than Schonert is, yet seems to have some talent.

  • Comment 70, posted at 14.11.11 17:32:50 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @vanmartin (Comment 33) : There are so many potential SB Williams playing in the schools backrow at the moment. Here in KZN we have a Craven Week youngster named Carel Swart, who’ll be in matric next year and a candidate for SA Sch I’m sure. He’s 1.90, strong and quick. He definitely has the skills to be an imposing midfielder. I’m really glad SBW is staying on SR. Kids love the flavour of the season stuff. His influence has already and will still go far in SA circles. Hopefully it will persuade kids, their parents and coaches who have a fixation with the backrow particularly no.8 to reconsider the option of centre. It would be good for SA rugby.

    Like you say, just imagine the likes of Kanko and Spies and Koster in midfield. :mrgreen:

  • Comment 71, posted at 14.11.11 17:35:58 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 69) :

    Looked more then decent. He was our best player at Junior World Champs.

    No match for Marcell Coetzee though right 😛

  • Comment 72, posted at 14.11.11 17:36:16 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • so just to address the comments earlier… I’m not actually suggesting that the Sharks should keep every youngster that comes through their systems – far from it. Clearly it would be naive to think that you can hang onto every kid you produce.

    The issue here is the two pronged cluster-f*ck of letting good juniors go while bieng forced to buy in overrated has-beens to replace them at the other end of the scale. Daniel is a special case – a guy with wonderful physical attributes and a work ethic second to none who the sharks should, frankly, have done more with by now. In a team so lacking in fresh ideas and x-factor, particularly on attack, I find it a shameful waste of a great opportunity to not make more of this guy.

  • Comment 73, posted at 14.11.11 17:38:10 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylan
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 72) : ja… but so what? Why is he suddenly a future Bok captain just because he had a decent JWC?

  • Comment 74, posted at 14.11.11 17:39:03 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylan
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 72) : just to add to that… for a junior to look good playing against other juniors doesn’t automatically translate to anything.

  • Comment 75, posted at 14.11.11 17:39:39 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylan
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 70) : That is true as well Rob. Danie is a bit like Deon Carstens. He’s mobile and has good hands. He’s also no slouch in the scrums. He’s done our u21 team proud this season and also proved to be too much for those Bulls to handle in the semi come scrumtime.

    Definitely underrated. But being a short LH prop doesn’t help his case.

  • Comment 76, posted at 14.11.11 17:40:18 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • Rob Dylan the sharks under 21s couldnt cope with arno botha everytime he touched the ball.The dude is a machine.

  • Comment 77, posted at 14.11.11 17:41:08 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 72) : I don’t have a problem praising or talking up Arno.

    The issue for me, and I admit that you’re entitled to your opinion, was you puting Marcell down when you were newer on this blog. I’m not sure you meant it that way but that’s the way it came across. 😡

  • Comment 78, posted at 14.11.11 17:42:38 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @beet (Comment 76) : ah yes… that’s true… we need tall props to life our 1.9m locks 🙂

  • Comment 79, posted at 14.11.11 17:42:53 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylan
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 77) : thanks – you just proved my point.

    I don’t actually care how good he looks against under 21 players… Marcell Coetzee played for the seniors all season and looked more than comfortable at that level.

  • Comment 80, posted at 14.11.11 17:43:45 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylan
     
  • Watch Carel Swart join the bulls next year haha the bulls like the glenwood boytjies.

  • Comment 81, posted at 14.11.11 17:44:14 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @All, we have 2 of the best young loose forwards in the country coming up, Marcell Coetzee and Fran Kleynheins. We should be covered for sometime…..don’t need to worry!

  • Comment 82, posted at 14.11.11 17:44:23 by Grasshopper Reply

    Grasshopper
     
  • Beet forget about blommetjies that guy has to pick up weight he will get tossed around like nobodys beez neez.

  • Comment 83, posted at 14.11.11 17:46:59 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • Malcom Marx now this kid is SA schools material a powerhouse of note.

  • Comment 84, posted at 14.11.11 17:49:11 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @beet (Comment 71) :

    I’m going to say that in general our first-choice centres are already big enough.

    But it’s no coincidence that the players who push on to Springbok honours are 90% of the time the bigger ones.

    The main exceptions being Heinrich Brussow, Fourie du Preez & Pat Lambie as starting players.

    But in every other position the player is pretty much the one who is the biggest/heaviest/tallest in his position from the top 5 franchises.

    So I wouldn’t say we have a problem in the midfield in terms of size. These guys would potentially be less effective in a position where opposition players prepare to play against them.

    I would argue handling skills, footwork & defense (anticipation, technique etc.) would all be far more important then a players size, but it does help if they get the technique right.

  • Comment 85, posted at 14.11.11 17:51:36 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • @Muzi, well you must be a KES or Lions supporter. I watched Marx against Westville, not bad but avoids the tough stuff like Spies. Carel Swart of Glenwood is a much better allround No 8/loose forward. Marx will have to keep him out of SA schools in 2012…

  • Comment 86, posted at 14.11.11 17:52:43 by Grasshopper Reply

    Grasshopper
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 74) :

    Heck I never said he should be Springbok captain. No way. Bulls captain as a stand-in MAYBE if he were to crack the starting line-up. They aren’t exactly loaded up with players you would call ‘captaincy material’.

    @beet (Comment 78) :

    I don’t recall putting him down! :mrgreen: But I haven’t seen much of him so just keep quiet about him. Maybe it’s my silence in voicing an opinion regarding him that has people raising eyebrows? 😆

  • Comment 87, posted at 14.11.11 17:54:11 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • Hendrikp i was watching the french beat the boks in 2006.Janick Jauzion the french inside centre was pure magic his footwork setting up that vincent clerk try gave me goosebumps.

  • Comment 88, posted at 14.11.11 17:54:28 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • Dont you guys think the Bulls are indeed a little thin on wing? They only signed one wing, JJ Engelbrecht. As far as I can remember. And they have lost v/d Heever to the WP. Imho, I think they will want to develop Adongo into a macro-wing to fill their void.

    Mvovo is almost similar to Adongo in style. Little iffy on defence, handling and reading play, but given space, he will make you pay dearly. Again, just my humble opinion. 😕

  • Comment 89, posted at 14.11.11 17:55:26 by JustPlainSHARK Reply

    JustPlainSHARK
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 69) : Rob, I think Arno has proven to be an outstanding impact player at senior level so far.

    As much as there are people who like putting Pierre Spies down, I can’t help but believe that Arno has modelled his game on that of Pierre’s just like Nardus vd Walt another exciting Bulls junior player.

    Arno’s timing of his runs off the shoulder is faultless. His anticipation around the fringes (even on defence here)is really good. His ability to spot a gap and get up to max speed from a standing start, really good. His decision-making good.

    But for the most part, he’s gotten to come on against tired players.

    I really like Arno. I believe that we are almost overdue for the new batch of talented players to take over from the likes of Burger, Spies and Juan Smith and Arno is one of them.

    However just like Goosen, his real test will be standing up against the best for 80min and putting his hand up in all areas of the game. Up until now much of his hype has been around his attacking game in open space. We need to learn more about the defender at top level.

    A guy like Pedrie Wannenburg was a fantastic prospect once upon a time but now not fit to be mentioned alongside a Burger or Spies or Juan S.

  • Comment 90, posted at 14.11.11 17:56:30 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 85) :

    **It does help being bigger I mean, so yes, it would be nice if a lot of the bigger guys decide at an early age to give centre a go, rather then going to the forwards ‘because they’re big’.

  • Comment 91, posted at 14.11.11 17:58:20 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • Grasshopper we will see if hans scriba and the sharks scouts are serious about swart or else he will join pieter oosthuizen..adendorff..moolman and co at loftus.

  • Comment 92, posted at 14.11.11 17:58:42 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 85) : Ja but how deep does this size go.

    Take away JP, JdV and J.Fourie. Do we still have the big boys with talent after that?

  • Comment 93, posted at 14.11.11 17:59:26 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 88) :

    That was the game right after Schalk had broken his neck.

    If we’d not lost him, we’d have won. He was making 20+ tackles a game at that stage and covering a ridiculous amount of ground. Wouldn’t have allowed them the sort of space to score the tries they did!

  • Comment 94, posted at 14.11.11 18:00:51 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • It would probably have been pretty cool hanging onto such an athlete as Adongo. But where would he have played for the Sharks? I know he lacks experience and such, but we have contracted more than able youngsters to cover lock.

  • Comment 95, posted at 14.11.11 18:03:10 by JustPlainSHARK Reply

    JustPlainSHARK
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 92) : Muzi, I won’t be surprised to see Carel Swart heading your way unless the feedback from the Bulls is poor. He’ll have many familiar faces up there to make him feel at home. + he’s Afrikaans first language.

  • Comment 96, posted at 14.11.11 18:03:24 by beet Reply
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    beet
     
  • Beet i think you are underestimating cj standers potential.Remember he is ahead of arno and boy oh boy was he damn good this year.

  • Comment 97, posted at 14.11.11 18:04:15 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @Muzi, very true! The Sharks have lost Warren Whitely, Dean Moolman, John Roy Jenkinson, Walker, Adendorff, Jacques Taylor, Schnetler etc to the Lions, Leopards and Bulls and those are just Glenwood Old Boys….

  • Comment 98, posted at 14.11.11 18:04:31 by Grasshopper Reply

    Grasshopper
     
  • @beet (Comment 93) :

    True.

    I’m just not sure whether the bigger guys always have the athleticism (explosion etc.) to be playing in the centres.

    The guys mentioned are rare exceptions. In the case of Pierre Spies, he was a back as well but couldn’t have been a centre with those handling skills, or his style of holding the ball in one hand. Also links terribly with other players.

    Guys like Koster & Kankowski could’ve though, but they’re also very good forwards. We sometimes don’t give Kankowski enough credit.

    But yes, it will be nice to see bigger guys playing in the centres! Francois Steyn showed us all what a guy can do with size on his side.

  • Comment 99, posted at 14.11.11 18:06:32 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • @Grasshopper (Comment 86) : I watched that Westville – KES game. What didn’t you like about Marx in that game?

    He went on to stand out in Academy Week as well and got selected to the SA Academy team. Not bad for a grade 11 player.

  • Comment 100, posted at 14.11.11 18:06:34 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 97) :

    How good?

    Who is to blame for the Bulls not making the semi-finals then? 😆 They definitely can’t all be all that good.

  • Comment 101, posted at 14.11.11 18:08:24 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • Beet When we played glenwood in the parktown high school under 14 tournament they called their set moves in afrikaans that kinda left us chicken scared because they all looked HUGE and conditioned.

  • Comment 102, posted at 14.11.11 18:09:35 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 99) : I don’t for a second dismiss what you’re saying about skills and ability in the midfield.

    It’s just that we have a culture that says dictates that a big guy who has all the right attributes to be an awesome centre should pick the ball up at the back of the scrum.

    At the risk of sounding like a hypocrite, I’d do the same thing as a SBR coach. The value you get out of a good no.8 at school level is huge, far greater than at centre.

  • Comment 103, posted at 14.11.11 18:11:13 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @Beet, he plays too loose for me. Kind of like an extra centre running off rucks. He is a ball carrier rather than a grafter who gets stuck into rucks. I presonally prefer grafters like Teichmann, Vermuelen etc than glory seeking flanks not getting stuck in…

  • Comment 104, posted at 14.11.11 18:11:32 by Grasshopper Reply

    Grasshopper
     
  • @Grasshopper (Comment 98) :

    Get over it hey!

    If the Bulls want to sign 50 players for every 1 that will go onto the senior side, that’s their business! It’s not something they’ll be able to do forever.

    In the mean time the Sharks still produce talented players for the senior side. Guys leaving to play elsewhere should be seen as a positive in terms of them getting an opportunity.

  • Comment 105, posted at 14.11.11 18:11:56 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • Hendrikp id pick stander ahead of koster.No disrespect to koster that knee injury has regressed his development in the currie cup semi final he was invincible.

  • Comment 106, posted at 14.11.11 18:12:51 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 74) : I’ve watched all the JWC,all the captains from van Velze in 08,Rob Ebersohn in 09,CJ Stander in 10 and Arno this year and none have been more examplary than Arno,have no doubt in his capabilities of being a Bok,just reckon he’ll go 1 step further

  • Comment 107, posted at 14.11.11 18:14:38 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • Grasshopper well you guys poached warren potgieter and lets not forget marne coetzee not 2 bad at all.

  • Comment 108, posted at 14.11.11 18:15:09 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 102) : All 3 1st team coaches are fluent in Afrikaans and I think only 2 players in their 1st team squad are English first language. Afrikaans, Xhosa and Zulu are probably all ahead. But that’s neither here nor there. Bottomline is Glenwood are doing an outstanding job on the rugby field and the vibes I get whenever I go there are really positive. It’s also a very friendly school. I think it always has been.

  • Comment 109, posted at 14.11.11 18:15:30 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • One has to see this loss of Adongo in context. He isn’t the first prospect that we are losing, all the while signing has-beens.

    Look back on a list including Barritt, Murray, Pienaar, Rhodes, etc. Individually, each one explained away, but the pattern is unmistakable, as is the huge development that youngsters like Rhodes and Cilliers have made away from the 1-dimensional coaching of the Sharks.

    I don’t know that Adongo will blossom into the amazing player that he has the potential to be, but I do know that he is a phenomenal athlete and hard-worker, and that he is a thousand times more likely to develop as a player at the Bulls rater then at the Sharks.

    As a Bok supporter first and foremost, I’m trying to be happy about what is a wise move for him.

  • Comment 110, posted at 14.11.11 18:16:06 by Big Fish Reply
    Author
    Big Fish
     
  • @beet (Comment 103) :

    Since coming to NZ I’ve thought that the system of having players play in their weight-divisions works a lot better.

    Could be something for SARU to look at.

  • Comment 111, posted at 14.11.11 18:16:25 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • Ludz Rob Dylan thought francois venter would fail to make the step up its nothing new.

  • Comment 112, posted at 14.11.11 18:17:45 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @Grasshopper (Comment 104) : But he’s extremely effective at what he does. He’s the primary ball carrier. KES have a good playbook but they go to him so often and yet he gets over that gainline. There has to something in there that you appreciate. Marx plays to a KES gameplan that maximises the benefit of having him on the park.

    But I admit that I’d like to see the coach vary his play a bit, if for no other reason but to make him a more complete player when he gets into junior rugby.

    I’m hoping the Sharks can sign him.

  • Comment 113, posted at 14.11.11 18:19:16 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • I remember when i was at clifton in nottingham road our coach took us to the kearsney and michaelhouse first team games that is where i saw brad barrit jol at 10 that kearsney side was sublime.Michaelhouse players were massive geez.

  • Comment 114, posted at 14.11.11 18:22:59 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • Beet hows young mandla from saints developing when i played against him he wasnt that impressive around the legs we managed to combat him.

  • Comment 115, posted at 14.11.11 18:26:49 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @Big Fish (Comment 110) : I think we’ll have to sink into another Putt-like rugby recession before we see major changes in the Sharks approach.

    I have a feeling that cure is way better than prevention in SA rugby.

    So until then we’re probably best off enjoying the wave ride even if we know it will eventually end. In recent years we’ve had more trophies than all accept the Bulls and a lot more financially stable than a couple of other Unions 🙂

  • Comment 116, posted at 14.11.11 18:27:30 by beet Reply
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    beet
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 115) : He’s gone missing this season.

    There was a chance to play him against the Valke but they opted for Fisher instead and against the Leopards, converted Wynberg flyhalf Kieran Goss got the nod.

    Maybe Rob knows what’s happened to him. Mandla Dube???

  • Comment 117, posted at 14.11.11 18:30:20 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @beet (Comment 116) :
    Not sure if you are joking, beet, but I made the same comment to Rob – we have another old boys’ club New Zealander dragging Sharks rugby back into the stone age and we will probably have to ride this decline right to its nadir before something is done by the powers that be.

    Traditionally, mediocrity is tolerated, and as long as we win some trophies, the obvious signs of an ailing, worsening coaching/ recruitment system will be ignored. Its only when the seats and sponsor’s lists are mostly empty that action will be taken.

    A touch melodramatic? Perhaps – but no less true for that in my opinion.

  • Comment 118, posted at 14.11.11 18:33:32 by Big Fish Reply
    Author
    Big Fish
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 111) : So much tradition. It will be hard to impliment here. I watched a NZ side – Christs Church play 4 games in SA this year. They struggled. Perhaps you know the reason why they weren’t competitive at all – almost like an u17 side vs our u18s + some u19s here and there. Was it size. They also only had one Polynesian kid in their squad which might have been a factor as well. It’s a expense private (independent school)but surely they award bursaries?

  • Comment 119, posted at 14.11.11 18:34:24 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • Beet yea Mr Dube i thought he was overrated.Young innocent radebe is way more talented.

  • Comment 120, posted at 14.11.11 18:34:38 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @Big Fish (Comment 118) : I was trying to cheer you up a bit :mrgreen:

    I feel like I failed miserably :mrgreen:

  • Comment 121, posted at 14.11.11 18:35:36 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @beet, agreed Marx is a good player and currently using his size to bash the opposition, but what happens when he plays loose forwards who are bigger and he does not get over the advantage line. KES are stuffed. Time will only tell when they play Monnas and Affies next year. I still think Swart is better overall!

  • Comment 122, posted at 14.11.11 18:35:47 by Grasshopper Reply

    Grasshopper
     
  • When i watched Goss two years ago in the wynberg festival i did not think he would go that far in rugby.He could kick but he was no sam lane who was the talking point alongside kolisi and carr at cape town.

  • Comment 123, posted at 14.11.11 18:37:12 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • This is a bad loss for the Sharks – this lad under the correct coaching will become a Bok take my word for it.

    Between really kak talent identification (and contracting) and equally kak coaching the Sharks are losing some real talent here.

  • Comment 124, posted at 14.11.11 18:39:21 by Morné Reply
    Author
    Morné
     
  • @Muzi, yep we gained Potgieter and Coetzee but we did not really need them with plenty of KZN schools props and flyhalfs. It’s the Sharks under 19s that will benefit most from them coming down. Marne can’t play craven week next year. Methinks they chose Glenwood because they knew some of the boys from Pukke and Wildeklawer.

  • Comment 125, posted at 14.11.11 18:40:22 by Grasshopper Reply

    Grasshopper
     
  • Grasshopper finally KES will get exposed by the big boys i feel those rankings on rugby365 are incorrect.KES get easy fixtures against the saints schools.Lets be honest Affies and Monnas are not DHS..Rondebosch..boys high and northwood.

  • Comment 126, posted at 14.11.11 18:40:39 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @beet (Comment 119) :

    You mean Christs College? They are in Christchurch yes.

    It may have been that only some players went over, but they’re also not what I’d call the strongest of rugby schools. Auckland schools are far more competitive IMO.

    New Zealand doesn’t really have ‘STRONG’ rugby schools in the same way that South Africa does. There isn’t much recruitment either I would say.

    I mean in Wellington the only two schools you could say that recruit players would be Wellington College & St Pats Silverstream. Wellington College is a public boys school with no boarding. They only ask guys from around the Wellington area (so within a bus ride) to play for them. St Pats also very rarely get players in from outside the Upper & Lower Hutt area.

    Grey College could probably smack any school in New Zealand by at least 50 points.

  • Comment 127, posted at 14.11.11 18:43:34 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • Grasshopper that is where barend and the leopards scouts spot glenwood players at the festival at Potch.The bulls identify targets in the wildeklawer week forget craven week.

  • Comment 128, posted at 14.11.11 18:44:13 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @all, let’s make it very clear Glenwood is an English medium school with boys getting taught in English and writing exams in English. Zulu, Xhosa and Afrikaans boys and their parents choose to send them to Glenwood. It just so happens that the best rugby players are usually the Afrikaans, Zulu and Xhosa players in the school and boarding establishment. Many English schools have Afrikaans speaking pupils, it’s called the new South Africa where language, race and religion are not segregated!

  • Comment 129, posted at 14.11.11 18:45:03 by Grasshopper Reply

    Grasshopper
     
  • @Morné (Comment 124) :
    Agree 100% on everything you said. I keep looking for a light, but the tunnel remains dark.

  • Comment 130, posted at 14.11.11 18:46:16 by Big Fish Reply
    Author
    Big Fish
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 127) :

    Many of the top players are spread out between schools. You don’t find a school producing an unusually large amount of professionals like you do in South Africa.

    Cory Jane went to Heretaunga College, which is probably the worst rugby school in the Wellington area. St Pats Silverstream, which is up there as one of the better rugby schools, is only a short walking distance from there.

  • Comment 131, posted at 14.11.11 18:46:40 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • Hendrikp we played against a new zealand school called Kelston Boys High.To make first team the one maori kid was in grade 8 and he was 100kgs he told us they use that systen to pick first team players.

  • Comment 132, posted at 14.11.11 18:48:49 by Muzi Reply

    Muzi
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 131) : Yes Christs College. My bad. 😳

  • Comment 133, posted at 14.11.11 18:52:11 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @all, Christs College was not a good reflection on NZ schools rugby strength, they are just a small private school like St Charles in KZN. Auckland Grammar, gisborne, kelston, De la Sale, Roturua and Wellington would give all our top schools a good run for their money!

  • Comment 134, posted at 14.11.11 18:52:44 by Grasshopper Reply

    Grasshopper
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 132) :

    Kelston is reasonably strong as far as I’m aware.

    There just isn’t the same emphasis on the game though.

    I mean Grey College start their offseason in November. They train 6 days a week (excluding Sunday) in the offseason, and then every weekday when the season starts.

    In New Zealand you’d have practice on Tuesday & Thursday. That’s it. None of that video analysis sessions or things either.

    Schools rugby just isn’t as big a deal here as it is in SA.

  • Comment 135, posted at 14.11.11 18:55:45 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • @Grasshopper (Comment 134) : They seem to measure up better against Michaelhouse statistically. However from a rugby strength point of view, you are probably right.

  • Comment 136, posted at 14.11.11 18:56:22 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 135) : This is par for the course nowadays. All the top schools here start training in September for the following season which kicks off in March/April 2012.

  • Comment 137, posted at 14.11.11 18:57:57 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @hendrikp (Comment 135) : So Hendrik, if you’re a talent scout and you notice a talented kid at a small primary school in Auckland, what do you do to give him the best shot at representing the AB’s in 10 years time?

    Just asking to find out more about the NZ system

  • Comment 138, posted at 14.11.11 18:59:35 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @beet (Comment 137) : 😯 My point exactly. You wouldn’t find that in NZ no way.

  • Comment 139, posted at 14.11.11 19:00:11 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • @beet (Comment 138) :

    Well until you reach High School in New Zealand everybody plays club rugby. Up until U-13’s.

    But players do get approached by bigger schools that are close to them and asked if they’d like to give it a go. Not many actually get ‘bursaries’ though.

    Also the divisions are arranged so that they end up playing bigger schools and having opportunities to prove themselves anyway… I mean all the First-XV’s around Wellington were all in 3 divisions, and they play each other at the very start of the season to decide what division each plays in.

    And if not, then they’re sure to get noticed playing club rugby after leaving school.

  • Comment 140, posted at 14.11.11 19:04:43 by hendrikp Reply

    hendrikp
     
  • @all, how is this for crazy! Glenwood tour Argentina in feb, then play 2 local fixtures, then Pukke, Kearsney and Wildeklawer festivals then a whole local season finishing off with Affies away and Grey Bloem at home. I think 26 fixtures in 6 months! Madness!

  • Comment 141, posted at 14.11.11 19:05:43 by Grasshopper Reply

    Grasshopper
     
  • @Muzi (Comment 120) : that’s a good player right there bud,a bit on the dimunitive side though,but he’s good. As for Rob,I think we all entitled to our opinions on different players,the thing is just hoping the boy that you back will step it up and it’s the same for me with Sam Warburton who I rate very highly,had a bit of an argument with the guys at school about who was the best opensider at the WC

  • Comment 142, posted at 14.11.11 19:09:11 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 69) : The boy is a machine Rob, give him 2 years and he’ll be a regular starter for the Bulls.

  • Comment 143, posted at 14.11.11 19:09:47 by GreatSharksays Reply

     
  • @Muzi (Comment 112) : francois venter has yet to accomplish anything in senior rugby. What is actually wrong with you that you can’t see this? Shining in a mediocre bulls team in a watered down currie cup does not count as ‘stepping up’.

  • Comment 144, posted at 14.11.11 19:13:53 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • Mandla got injured and seems to be well out of favour… And out of contract. Think he’ll head down to PE with all the others.

  • Comment 145, posted at 14.11.11 19:19:29 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @GreatSharksays (Comment 143) : and where will Marcell be in 2 years? Or Franna? Or even Jafta? Why does it always have to be the Bulls okes that are legends before the age of 21? Or is it just since Muzi arrived that we feel this way?

  • Comment 146, posted at 14.11.11 19:24:31 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • If the sharks can hold onto Franna, Marcell, Jafta, Chadwick, Cooper, Gouws etc we will have the players for a great future sharks side!

  • Comment 147, posted at 14.11.11 19:29:26 by Grasshopper Reply

    Grasshopper
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 145) : don’t you think you guys should’ve kept him for just 1 more season,I mean the u19 wingers hardly inspired,didn’t watch any of them but the chopping and changing throughout the season proves that none inspired,than again he’ll hardly see any action with both Goss and Fisher likely to be used there,whats the word on Emil Schwarz?

  • Comment 148, posted at 14.11.11 19:31:00 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 146) : hahaha potential uncle Rob,that’s all we see,not that we making them legends

  • Comment 149, posted at 14.11.11 19:35:05 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 148) : goss is gone.

    I spoke to Emil recently. The lad is keen to play again but is looking at another year out at least. I hope he makes it back, but I’m worried about top end after that injury

  • Comment 150, posted at 14.11.11 19:37:15 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 149) : no problems lad (easy on the uncle btw!). Let’s just remember that there’s lots of potential outside Pretoria too.

  • Comment 151, posted at 14.11.11 19:38:36 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @Morné (Comment 124) : Agree. I’m still lost for words.

  • Comment 152, posted at 14.11.11 19:42:32 by GreatSharksays Reply

     
  • @Grasshopper (Comment 141) : they have a very promising 2012 team tho and I suspect they will use the squad system for the entire campaign, not just for the festivals and the GCB game as was the case this year.

  • Comment 153, posted at 14.11.11 19:43:16 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @Grasshopper (Comment 147) : As good as they are they are one dimensional players. Unless we get proper coaches these boys won’t reach their potential.

  • Comment 154, posted at 14.11.11 19:47:34 by GreatSharksays Reply

     
  • @robdylan (Comment 150) : Goss has left,wasn’t aware of that. I understand your concern with Schwarz,so who are the likely lads for u21 wingers,Kayde will definitely be 1,is that van der Westhuizen oke still eligible next year?

  • Comment 155, posted at 14.11.11 19:48:02 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 155) : no, nico is gone, but van tonder maybe? Or he might move to fullback…

  • Comment 156, posted at 14.11.11 19:52:12 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 156) : was also thinking van Tonder will be at 15 next year,guys might be forced to look at some of the u19 lads this year,looking a bit thin at wing,where’s Allan playing next year,loosehead or hooker or tighthead?

  • Comment 157, posted at 14.11.11 19:58:04 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 157) : all 3, I think. They want him to be a utility front row like John was.

    I wonder if Tom is too young to play u21 next year… Given that he’ll still be in matric.
    What do you think about this years’s other u19 wings? Arendse, perhaps? Or there’s ofentse boloke as well who’s still around. Yamkela Ngam has left though

  • Comment 158, posted at 14.11.11 20:04:31 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 157) : I wud say van Tonder definitely a better option at 15 than 11 or 14.

    I’m starting to get a bit worried about my u21 championship winning team for 2012. We’ll need a finisher or 2. I’m really surprised that Dube has left early. He still had a year of u21 left. 😐

  • Comment 159, posted at 14.11.11 20:06:45 by beet Reply
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    beet
     
  • @beet (Comment 159) : maybe I’m wrong about Dibbles… it’s possible I’m confusing him with Ngam (so many kids leaving you can understand it it I get one or two wrong occasionally)…

    Hang ten, lemme check

  • Comment 160, posted at 14.11.11 20:22:03 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @beet (Comment 159) : we got to be a bit clever about this… how about we move Piet to wing and play Paul at 13 next year… FredZ at 10?

  • Comment 161, posted at 14.11.11 20:23:09 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 161) : I was thinking the same thing, shuffling players around. It’s just starting to look like we’ll need an injury free season to keep the dream alive tho.

    Losing Mike Williams and now possibly Goss and Dube – not good.

    Heinrich Arendse isn’t the quickest bloke around for a small guy. He’s a lot better in traffic where he can step, shuffle and weave. The straight line speed isn’t on par with a Specman or a Richards. (Watch someone will tell me Arendse runs the 100m in 10s dead :mrgreen: ). He’ll get the job done at wing tho.

  • Comment 162, posted at 14.11.11 20:42:59 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 161) : According to the 8’o clock Muz :mrgreen: , current SA Schools fullback Sean Robertson may also be joining the Sharks next season. If Muzi is right, I guess that might be our u21 FB sorted out with Jaco staying on the wing.

    Jaco has more value at 15 imho but the team may have to come first. There’s also Jared Meyer who looks to good to be sitting on the bench.

  • Comment 163, posted at 14.11.11 20:52:05 by beet Reply
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    beet
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 161) : could work Rob,like your thinking,Heimar at 12,Kayde on the other wing and van Tonder at 15,Ofentse has his moments,but never thought much of him,watched him for 3 seasons,the fact that he lost his place in the u19 sid to 17 year old Tom is proof. Ngam is even worse than Ofentse,so forget him. Arendse yeah could be worth a look in. Scrummie? Dwayne Kelly? Irish oke is gone,isn’t it?

  • Comment 164, posted at 14.11.11 20:52:35 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 164) : What did you think of Roy Bursey? And if you had to compare him to Matt Williams, who’d come out on top in your books?

  • Comment 165, posted at 14.11.11 21:04:30 by beet Reply
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    beet
     
  • @beet (Comment 163) : Sean Robinson scored 125 points this past season,tries only, equivalent to 25. One of the best attacking fullbacks I’ve ever seen at schoolboy level. Mbembe Payi,is he staying with the Sharks?

  • Comment 166, posted at 14.11.11 21:05:27 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 166) : He’s back at school next year. I thought he’d get a shot at u19 this year but I suspect he may have picked up an injury coz he was set to go to the Isle of Man for the 7s and didn’t.

    I really like Mbhembe. He comes across as arrogant in his ways on the field but in person he is one of the most likeable, humble and respectful young men around. He’s a sight for sore eyes on the rugby field. I really have to get his try against Kearsney this year. It sums up everything about his ability.

    I actually hope he stays at DHS. There was talk of him going to College. With DHS’s short season, it will put him in a good possie to play u19 rugby from the start next year.

  • Comment 167, posted at 14.11.11 21:10:51 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @beet (Comment 165) : Roy was a physical beast,he used to run over players at schoolboy level,but Matt Williams is much more well rounded,has an eye for a gap,not blessed with the pace of Meyer or Mthembu,he does struggle to hit those gaps,but his vision can’t be doubted. He’s very physical though and is a phenomenal ball carrier,so I’d say Williams,Border loose trio in 2008 was 6. Matt Williams 7. Chris Cloete 8. Lubabalo Mtembu,what were the odds that all 3 would land at the Sharks

  • Comment 168, posted at 14.11.11 21:15:15 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 168) : thanks. Roy was with the Sharks as well. He even got capped for the juniors a few times. I watched him at our SBR festival and was very impressed. I thought he was a darkhorse who might come to the fore after school. It didn’t happen tho. He was really unfortunate to have been around when Teru was there in Border.

  • Comment 169, posted at 14.11.11 21:29:13 by beet Reply
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    beet
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 164) : I hope Dwayne gets a shot at playing for the U21 team. I was also excited to hear that Bangi Kobese is joining the Sharks. If he could just put on 15kgs, he could something special as well. He has all the other attributes, he just needs some meat on the bone.

  • Comment 170, posted at 14.11.11 21:33:23 by beet Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    beet
     
  • @beet (Comment 170) : Bangi is a very good player,true that he needs some meat on those bones. He’d be tossed around at u21 level with his body,not even talking about senior rugby. Arrogant lad,but not in a bad way,in the manner that suggests he knows how good he is,he backs himself. Look forward to seeing Dwayne Kelly,the little I’ve seen of him has been really impressive. Love the Sharks for the opportunities they give to Border boys

  • Comment 171, posted at 14.11.11 21:57:19 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • @beet (Comment 169) : roy bursey is craig burden’s cousin… You know that?

  • Comment 172, posted at 14.11.11 22:20:32 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • I liked the guy,but if you can not read the game you will always struggle.

    That shiz you can not learn somebody.
    It is like saying you are going to learn a player play like Pat and Fred,not going to happen.It’s a natural thing.

  • Comment 173, posted at 14.11.11 22:20:51 by Honey Badger Reply

    Honey Badger
     
  • @Ludz (Comment 164) : ja, Pete is back in Ireland. Dwayne and Ivan Ludick as scrummies… Fred Z too?

  • Comment 174, posted at 14.11.11 22:26:42 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 174) : I have a feeling that if Fred Z wants to make it at senior level he is gonna have to play 9 and be like a Piri Weepu.

  • Comment 175, posted at 15.11.11 08:34:19 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonK
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 175) : you reckon he’s not gonna make it at fly?

  • Comment 176, posted at 15.11.11 10:30:53 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 176) : I dont to be honest. He is good without being exceptional at 10, which is what you need to be to make it. His build is also more suited to 9 than 10. In SA our best 9s tend to be play makers if we think of Joost,Fourie,Piennar,Hougaard etc. Having a good kicking game will help him at 9 and a 9 that is a goal kicker opens up a lot of options for coaches to use more running type players at 10-15.

  • Comment 177, posted at 15.11.11 10:40:10 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonK
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 177) : good point… very good point.

    I think whatever the case, though, he needs to pick one position and settle. No reason he couldn’t be first-choice 9 for the u21s next year and grow from there

  • Comment 178, posted at 15.11.11 10:44:27 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 177) : Gavin Hauptfleisch will be fit and raring to go next season as well, adding further options at 10.

  • Comment 179, posted at 15.11.11 10:45:08 by robdylan Reply
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    robdylan
     
  • @Morné (Comment 124) : Interesting view point. I havent seen much of Adongo other than a few performances, usually from the bench, for the the under 21s and the Neo game at the beginning of the season. Im really interested in what it is that you see in him that will definatly make him into a Bok and am especially interested in what position you think it will be at.

  • Comment 180, posted at 15.11.11 11:18:22 by Salmonoid Reply
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    Salmonoid the Subtle
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 179) : I know he is still young but i really do believe Rob Du Preez should be pushed into u21s next year. Yes i know there will be those that question his conditioning but ive watched him play a few times and i like what i see hey…and he is not a small boy! Sharks and Bok rugby need to almost break the traditional mindset in order to be successful. I dont mean veering away from strenghts but a little bit of the unconvential wont hurt- and watch the Bulls next year…i think we will see a very different style of play than we used to.

  • Comment 181, posted at 15.11.11 11:28:38 by SheldonK Reply

    SheldonK
     
  • @Ice (Comment 8) : we have glasses 😆

  • Comment 182, posted at 15.11.11 14:44:09 by rekinek Reply
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    rekinek
     
  • this is really pity 😐

  • Comment 183, posted at 15.11.11 14:44:58 by rekinek Reply
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    rekinek
     
  • @SheldonK (Comment 181) : I have to say that guys like FredZ and RobDP are a lot better suited players to the Sharks’ traditional style. They like to boss the gainline and work in tight spaces, which gets coached up here.

    Paul Jordaan is totally different. Altho he’s a running flyhalf and isn’t a great kicker out of hand, he enjoys standing in the pocket, mainly coz this gives him more freedom to move around.

    I think du Preez will stay on in u19 next season. Probably the best kept secret in u19s has been his punt. It’s huge. Then again, his passing game has been so effective that there really hasn’t been a need to go to the boot very often. It’s a pity he isn’t a good place-kicker.

    Another player who can take control of a game with his big boot is an inform Stefan Ungerer. I hope we get to see the best of him again next year coz he’s also a good fringe sniper and a good leader. He can hurt opponents in a few ways.

  • Comment 184, posted at 15.11.11 15:28:24 by beet Reply
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