pierre_mackie

Southern Kings to face Lions


Written by Pierre McLeod (pierre_mackie)

Posted in :EP Kings, Original Content, Super Rugby on 23 Jul 2013 at 14:26
Tagged with : , , , , , ,

The Southern Kings have announced their team to face the MTN Lions in the first of two promotion / relegation matches at the Nelson Mandela Bay Stadium in Port Elizabeth on Friday night.

As expected the Southern Kings have made quite a few changes to the side that faced the Sharks a fortnight ago, with many of their first choice players coming back into the side. Among the backs SP Marais takes over from Siviwe Soyizwapi, Ronnie Cooke replaces Waylon Murray who returns to the bench and the halfback combination of Demetri Catrakilis and Shaun Venter step back into the side with Nicolas Vergallo and George Whithead moving to the bench.

The outstanding loose trio combination of Jacques Engelbrecht, Wimpie van der Walt and Cornell du Preez will again partner up for Fridays clash with Mpho Mbiyozo falling out the match day 22 and Devin Oosthuizen moving to the bench. Last week’s captain Steven Sykes moves to the bench to make way for Darron Nell. In the final changes to the starting 15, Bandise Maku and Schalk Ferreira come in for Charl du Plessis and Hannes Franklin.

The Southern Kings will yet again have a new captain leading them onto the field as Darron Nell takes over from Sykes. Ronnie Cooke will be his vice captain.

Southern Kings

15 SP Marais 14 Hadleigh Parkes 13 Ronnie Cooke (VC) 12 Shane Gates 11 Marcello Sampson 10 Demetri Catrakilis 9 Shaun Venter 8 Jacques Engelbrecht 7 Wimpie van der Walt 6 Cornell du Preez 5 David Bulbring 4 Darron Nell ( C ) 3 Kevin Buys 2 Bandise Maku 1 Schalk Ferreira
Replacements
16 Charl du Plessis 17 Hannes Franklin 18 Steven Sykes 19 Devin Oosthuizen 20 Nicolas Vergallo 21 George Whitehead 22 Waylon Murray


73 Comments

  • big balls to drop Sykes. I wonder if he’ll come back when they get relegated?

  • Comment 1, posted at 23.07.13 14:28:55 by West Indies Cricket Board Reply
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  • @West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 1) : not quite sure why, sure there is a valid reason

  • Comment 2, posted at 23.07.13 14:36:39 by pierre_mackie Reply
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    pierre_mackie
     
  • Well in the spirit of rugby I wanna wish these guys good luck…. There is a mountain ahead of them…. Good luck and may the best team win…..

  • Comment 3, posted at 23.07.13 14:46:10 by Lassy_lion Reply
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    Lassy_lion
     
  • @West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 1) : would we have him would be a better question

  • Comment 4, posted at 23.07.13 14:59:57 by The Hobbit Reply
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    The Hobbit
     
  • Lassy_lion nice of you, good luck to your team.

  • Comment 5, posted at 23.07.13 15:01:43 by JD Reply
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  • A mobile backline so they’re might be looking to take the Lions on at their own game.

  • Comment 6, posted at 23.07.13 15:39:21 by Baylion Reply

    Baylion
     
  • Wish a miracle happens and the Kings are able to stay in the competition. They’ve added more value than the Lions ever did. See Ackermann has tried his best to level the playing field by starting with Elton.

  • Comment 7, posted at 23.07.13 15:46:42 by GreatSharksays Reply

     
  • It will be a close game in the first half, both teams feeling each other out. With the boot of the Greek and the home crowd the KIngs might just have the lead at the haldf, but the do not have the attacking flair and scrum power to take on the Lions. Lions will run away with it in the second half

  • Comment 8, posted at 23.07.13 15:59:21 by Mutley Reply
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    Mutley
     
  • Any chance the Lions and Kings can combine for Super Rugby and then rotate their home games between PE and Joburg? That way they’ll be a strong side and both cities get some matches at least. The players can then split up to their respective provinces for the Currie cup. I’d rather have half the number of home matches than have to go a whole season with none!

    At least it makes sense to me as a bystander :mrgreen:

  • Comment 9, posted at 23.07.13 16:01:25 by SeanyJMc Reply

    SeanyJMc
     
  • ^^ They could call them the Lion Kings πŸ˜†

  • Comment 10, posted at 23.07.13 16:01:53 by SeanyJMc Reply

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  • @SeanyJMc (Comment 9) :

    no

  • Comment 11, posted at 23.07.13 16:17:51 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @GreatSharksays (Comment 7) : I’m not sure on what basis the Kings have “added more than the Lions ever did” in your estimation other than by surprising some by being competitive in their first year.
    The harsh reality is that the Kings record, objectively, was worse than that of the Lions in either 2012 or 2011. In 2012 the Lions also finished bottom of the combined log on 25pts – 1pt more than the Kings (24) achieved this year. The Lions points difference was 123pts better than that of the Kings. The prior year (2011) the Lions finished second last on 29pts a year in which they also only won 3 games and drew one but earned 5 losing bonus points for being within 7pts.

    I have no problem with a promotion- relegation concept for Super rugby and at the end of the day the Lions were the architects of their own demise (look how the Cheetahs have responded) but to suggest that the Kings have done better is patent nonsense.

  • Comment 12, posted at 23.07.13 16:35:17 by steve Reply

     
  • @steve (Comment 12) : Thanks for that….. It just piss me off that everyone is saying the Kings are so much better….They still finished last I cant see how that is better than the Lions…. Stop sucking up and tell it as it is…. Kings also suck so they deserve to be out of S15….Finish and klaar….

  • Comment 13, posted at 23.07.13 16:40:10 by Lassy_lion Reply
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    Lassy_lion
     
  • @Lassy_lion (Comment 13) : you don’t think it’s impressive that the kings achieved roughly the same in their first-ever year of competition as the Lions did after 5 years straight?

  • Comment 14, posted at 23.07.13 16:41:49 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 14) : No it does not impress me at all… SARU gave them a nice sum of money so yes they could buy some players….If I am not mistaken they said it is to promote rugby in the eastern cape….There was only like 4 or 5 local players…..So no they did not impress me at all….Give the LIONS the same sum of money and see how we kick everyones asses next year….I believe you have to work hard to make a sucsess of something and not let it fall into your lap….

  • Comment 15, posted at 23.07.13 16:46:44 by Lassy_lion Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 14) :

    The Lions also have to buy a new team every year so it seems similar to me ….

  • Comment 16, posted at 23.07.13 16:47:56 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @Lassy_lion (Comment 15) : @Zibbie (Comment 16) : geez, but you guys are blinkered.

  • Comment 17, posted at 23.07.13 16:56:34 by robdylan Reply
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  • The Kings have been way more successful than I expected. Having said that I prefer watching the Lions play than them, with their defensive based masterplan. The same goes for the Stormers.

  • Comment 18, posted at 23.07.13 17:10:40 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • From bits and pieces picked up all over the place it seems as if many of the Kings players are already on their way to other teams. How much substance there is in this I dont know.

  • Comment 19, posted at 23.07.13 17:12:48 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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  • The Kings will not keep their players because if a Super rugby team like Sharks, Stormers, Cheetahs or Bulls offer them a contract they will go cause they’re assured to play super rugby. The same will apply to the Lions. Good young players will leave both teams to go to other super rugby teams, untill SA rugby make up their minds and pick one of the two teams and give them a two or three year fixed spot.

  • Comment 20, posted at 23.07.13 18:03:37 by JD Reply
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  • Good luck to my boys, hopefully the better teams wins and hopefully those are my Kings, our record is 3 wins and 1 draw better than people gave us a chance of achieving, I’ll take it anyday. If you’re gonna compare an franchise’s record in 2011 and 2012 to a team’s record in its debut’s season. Bring the fact that the Lions were a long established union in 2011 and 2012 into consideration.

  • Comment 21, posted at 23.07.13 18:53:53 by Ludz Reply

    Ludz
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 17) :

    no really sir . you make it sound if the Lions team of 2012 has been playing together for 4 years without much change . this is not the situation . the sharks for example are a much more settled team than the Lions .

    i drew the team sheets for the Lions vs sharks Super 14 game on 15 March 2008 :

    Lions:
    Louis Ludik, Dusty Noble, Jaco Pretorius, Walter Venter, Rayno Benjamin, Jaco van Schalkwyk, Jano Vermaak, Joe van Niekerk, Ernst Joubert (capt.), Cobus Grobbelaar, Anton van Zyl, Gerhard Mostert, Ross Geldenhuys, Willie Wepener, Heinke van der Merwe.
    Replacements: Ethienne Reynecke, JC Janse van Rensburg, Willem Alberts, Franco van der Merwe, Chris Jonck, Rudi Vogt, Jannie Boshoff.

    Sharks:
    Stefan Terblanche, Odwa Ndungane, Waylon Murray, Bradley Barritt, JP Pietersen, Francois Steyn, Rory Kockott, Ryan Kankowski, Jacques Botes, Keegan Daniel, Johann Muller (capt.), Albert van den Berg, BJ Botha, Bismarck du Plessis, Tendai Mtawarira.
    Replacements: Craig Burden, Jannie du Plessis, AJ Venter, Jean Deysel, Ruan Pienaar, Frederic Michalak, Adrian Jacobs.

    For the Lions starting 15 0 is still with the Lions
    For the Lions bench 2 player remain with the Union . However JC is on his way out and franco might follow .

    For the Sharks Start 15 8 players are still with the union
    For the Sharks bench 3 players are still with the union .

    so saying the Lions are a established union is not very accurate πŸ˜›

  • Comment 22, posted at 24.07.13 08:13:38 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @Zibbie (Comment 22) :

    my point in this is . CONGRATULATIONS KINGS …. you have managed to do just as badly as the Lions has done for the last 10 years . and now the real challenge start . Player retention … seems having a super rugby team doesnt guarantee that one either when the sharks and the bulls and stormers come shopping πŸ˜›

  • Comment 23, posted at 24.07.13 09:10:32 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @Zibbie (Comment 22) : whose fault is it that the team wasn’t settled?

  • Comment 24, posted at 24.07.13 09:23:51 by robdylan Reply
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  • @Zibbie (Comment 22) : The Lions had there own share of problems (especially management) Things could / can be very different for the Lions, but things have to change on top first. And yes player retention is important, but the players don’t always seem happy and you must wonder why?

    I can’t however deny the spirit that the Kings has shown at times. They have been really motivated and one can only wonder what will happen if they move up the ranks (being CC prove there what they can do and then move on to SR) I’m looking forward to the relegation matches as I think neither team will give an inch. Good luck to both teams even thou I hope the Lions take it.

  • Comment 25, posted at 24.07.13 09:25:20 by Farlington Reply

    Farlington
     
  • @Zibbie (Comment 23) : Wonder how the tjietas managed to survive all the so-called plundering Pirate franchises to make it into the qtr. finals this year?

    No matter how you slant it, it took being kicked out of SR for the Lions to finally take action with their sinking ship. We’ll see over the next few weeks whether it pays off.

  • Comment 26, posted at 24.07.13 09:29:18 by FireTheLooser Reply

     
  • @robdylan (Comment 24) :

    please see my post @Zibbie (Comment 23) :

    @Farlington (Comment 25) : @FireTheLooser (Comment 26) :

    Going to be do or DIE !!!!! Hoping we can make it back and start the recovery !!!!

  • Comment 27, posted at 24.07.13 09:36:22 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @FireTheLooser (Comment 26) :

    Simplistic and inaccurate.

    The Cheetahs were not disrupted by a lot of injuries this year, which helped. We saw the effect of a long injury list on the Sharks and the Stormers seasons and the Lions had an even worse one in 2012 without the benefit of loan players.

    Since Kevin de Klerk took over a lot of work has gone into sorting out the problems he inherited and I believe the Lions were well set for a good 2013 with the squad they had in 2012.

    Being kicked out of Super Rugby set them back at least two years having lost 15+ players last year.

    Of their match 22 for Friday 14 players have played less than 10 SR matches, 7 of which have no SR experience, If they lose JC, Franco, Roodt and Jantjies this year they lose 188 of their 382 SR caps.

    If they win the knockouts against the Kings they would have done well this year but they will be hard pressed to be competitive in 2014, especially if they lose more of their senior players whose contracts are up for renewal.

  • Comment 28, posted at 24.07.13 09:47:46 by Baylion Reply

    Baylion
     
  • @Baylion (Comment 28) : bla bla bla. Always someone else’s fault when it comes to the Lions’ woes.

    I’m glad for you guys that management, at least, seems to have quit the excuses and looked at what was wrong internally. That started the healing process and I’m sure it will bear fruit. But my goodness, are the fans still stuck in their delusional paranoid fantasy land, or what?

    It strikes me that Sharks fans and Lions fans are almost polar opposites. Sharks fans will blame their own team no matter what – Lions fans refuse to admit that their team is ever at fault for anything!

  • Comment 29, posted at 24.07.13 09:51:27 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 29) :

    im not saying the lions team or management or who ever is not at fault . they all are .

    If the Kings stay in Super rugby they will have the same challenge as the Lions had . retaining top players . They will have to retain a core of players for four years to be competitive.

    The challenge will also be . players will now also get more exposure . So the Bulls will go mmmmmmmm new players with some SR experience . bargain !

    Im also saying the Kings should not strive to be the same as the LIons . cause lets face it . thats really poor . they should strive to be more like the Sharks .

    And we like it here in LaLa land ! its fun !!!

  • Comment 30, posted at 24.07.13 10:14:03 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 29) : Well, a simplistic bottom line only view, after years of under-performance, isn’t going to work for me πŸ™‚ . Then I would have stopped watching rugby years ago.

  • Comment 31, posted at 24.07.13 10:15:40 by Baylion Reply

    Baylion
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 29) : Our team sucked over the last few years and honestly it was not fun at all to see my team get a klap game after game…. Yes we could not keep our players and that was because of poor management…. Well this shit happened now and you know what I am actually glad they gave the Kings a shot because maybe just maybe it was the push we needed to grow some Balls again…. So lets wait and see but I am telling you the Lions is gonna come back stronger than ever….. Watch this space….

  • Comment 32, posted at 24.07.13 10:16:44 by Lassy_lion Reply
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  • @Zibbie (Comment 30) : can we at least concede that if you compare apples with apples, the Kings have exceeded expectations and have actually done better than the Lions did?

  • Comment 33, posted at 24.07.13 10:23:28 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 33) : BAHAHAHAHA you will never in your life hear those words out of a Lions supporters mouth….Or typed on our keyboards……

  • Comment 34, posted at 24.07.13 10:37:27 by Lassy_lion Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 33) :

    if the kings manage to keep the same core players for the next 4 years . yes sure .

    last year the Lions scarped a bunch of unknowns together and finished last in super rugby

    this year the Kings scarped together a bunch of unknowns together and finished last in super rugby .

    up to now seems much the same . like i said . the real challenge will be next year for the Kings . do you know if any of there players have other contract offers ? other than kat killer ?

  • Comment 35, posted at 24.07.13 10:42:15 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 33) : Sure, they did better than expected.

    As to the second part, let’s see:

    – the Kings finish last
    – has less log points
    – scored less points
    – conceded more points
    – scored less tries
    – conceded more tries
    – couldn’t beat any other SA team
    – got zero losing bonus points
    – didn’t have a long injury list to contend with
    – won the same number of games, albeit all against fellow bottom feeders
    – drew with the Brumbies

    Oh yes, I can see why you think they did better than the Lions

  • Comment 36, posted at 24.07.13 10:48:00 by Baylion Reply

    Baylion
     
  • @Baylion (Comment 36) : after 1 year…

    blinker still on, I see. Won’t bother here.

  • Comment 37, posted at 24.07.13 10:55:54 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 37) :

    like i said . you will only be able to compare the 2 teams in more or less 4 years time .

  • Comment 38, posted at 24.07.13 11:00:00 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 33) : Rob I think we can all admit that the Kings have exceeded expectations. It still leaves a bad taste in one’s mouth thou considering the way things were handled. I feel for the Lions and the fans. And consider this, it’s not easy seeing the good of another team if you feel your team was wronged.

    The playing field might have been levelled thou with no SR for the Lions this year. If the teams met last year I would not think twice about the outcome. Now I’m not so sure and I think a lot of Lion supporters might have the same fears. Is it fair… No but the truth is that who ever loses the relegation might find it very difficult to get back into SR in the future. If the Lions lose they will more than likely not retain the senior guys they still have available. If the King lose, well as we know there are players who have loop holes in their contracts and will also leave the union.

    No matter how we look at this, it’s an ugly mess and there will be unhappy people and people that feels they have been wronged at the end of the relegation match ups.

  • Comment 39, posted at 24.07.13 11:19:05 by Farlington Reply

    Farlington
     
  • Look Lions fans, I feel for ya, I really do.

    But they had ten years of substantially less than mediocre returns and I think everyone tired of the dros they dished up year in, year out.

    To claim that their results, after assembling a team from scratch against all the odds, are no better than what the Lions dished up is both vindictive and childish.
    It shows a lack of understanding as to what makes a team tick and shows a massively blinkered vision of the world.

    I’m tired of the continual whining and moaning of Lions fans and, honestly, I hope you get your asses handed to you in this game, if only so I dont need to hear any more of your persecution complex and this continual Kings bashing we’ve had of late.

    The Kings, despite everybody willing them to fail, have still delivered better results than the Lions have over the last decade of Super Rugby. If the Lions team and fans want the rest of SA to take them seriously, perhaps they should kepp their mouth shut and deliver on the field.

    For what its worth – I’m a neutral. Perhaps thats why I can see the value that the Kings have brought to the table, without blind, misplaced patriotism.

    Go Kings! Win or lose you can hold your head high given what you’ve delivered this year.

  • Comment 40, posted at 24.07.13 11:25:09 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @Baylion (Comment 36) :

    You’ve got serious issues separating fantasy from reality.

    Lions 2012 – last
    Lions 2011 – second last
    Lions 2010 – last
    Lions 2009 – third last
    Lions 2008 – last
    Lions 2007 – third last
    Cats 2006 – second last

    Its pathetic and everybody acknowledges it but you. Yet you still persist by denigrating the Kings.

    Truth is – Jozi doesnt deserve a team based on the results over the last few years.

  • Comment 41, posted at 24.07.13 11:32:21 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @Zibbie (Comment 38) :

    I can compare then now, simply because its virtually a mathematical impossibility that a team can do worse than the Lions have over the last 5 years.

  • Comment 42, posted at 24.07.13 11:33:50 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 40) :

    may i ask if you believe the Kings will do better at player retention than the Lions have over the last few years ?

    like a pointed out in an earlier post , that is why the Lions have failed (not an excuse , just pointing out the facts) .

    The Sharks like pointed out (again not excuses just pointing out the facts) have done a lot better than the Lions in player retention over at least the last 4 years

    So , that would mean , for the Kings to be competitive , they will have to retain a core team of players for i would say at least for years (more is better).

    So here the Kings will have to be better than the Lions .

    If the manage to fight of the Stormers Bulls and Sharks . sure i will admit they are better than the Lions .

    is this fair enough for your liking ?

  • Comment 43, posted at 24.07.13 11:39:29 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @Zibbie (Comment 43) : not a fair comparison. The Lions’ player retention efforts were never hampered by uncertainty over their Super Rugby inclusion… up until last year.

    The Kings have had this “one season only” thing hanging over their head ever since their participation was finally approved 4 months before the competition.

    It’s a bloody miracle they managed to attract any players at all fir this season

  • Comment 44, posted at 24.07.13 11:46:39 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 44) : im not comparing the Kings and the Lions . im saying . this is what the Kings will have to do .

    if VinChainSaw says he is tiered of hearing excuses from the Lions supporters the Kings will have to move fast not to hear the same from him about them in about 4 years time .

    That is of course assuming they win the Promo game . who ever loose that will not be able to put together a competitive CC team together next year

  • Comment 45, posted at 24.07.13 12:00:54 by Zibbie Reply
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  • VinChainSaw
    Would just love to hear your moaning if the shoe was on the other foot….LOL

    You guys seriously make me laugh…..

    Well we will just see how good the Kings are once we kick there asses all over PE and JHB….

    We as the Lions wil shut all the critics once and for all…. By ourselfes….

  • Comment 46, posted at 24.07.13 12:01:08 by Lassy_lion Reply
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  • @Lassy_lion (Comment 46) : wow, but some of you guys are going to look very stupid indeed if you don’t convincingly thrash the Kings in both of the upcoming games.

    Just be sure not to stand too close to the edges of the massive hole you’re digging.

  • Comment 47, posted at 24.07.13 12:03:47 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 47) :

    i said before . i think its going to be a very close game ..

  • Comment 48, posted at 24.07.13 12:11:53 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @Zibbie (Comment 48) : mate, you are incredibly level-headed, respectful and reasonable and we love having you here.

    Wish I could say the same for some of your red-clad brethren…

  • Comment 49, posted at 24.07.13 12:16:07 by robdylan Reply
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  • @robdylan (Comment 49) :

    now if the Lions loose i would have to start supporting the Bulls and that would have to mean a attitude redo πŸ˜›

  • Comment 50, posted at 24.07.13 12:25:00 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @Zibbie (Comment 43) :

    Mate, it has nothing to do with player retention.

    The Lions downfall started with the (mis)management at the union and ended with the complete and utter lack of support for the Lions in Johannesburg.

    If yourown fans cant be bothered to get out and watch their team at Ellis PArk, why should the rest of us be subjected to the rubbish that your team has dished out year in, year out?

    When the Lions can pack out Ellis PArk like other South African franchises can, then I’ll give them the time of day.

    Right now, it just sounds like that old entitlement issue that South Africans have so magnificently perfected. Its a disgrace that you can even moan about it given the lack of results over the last ten years.

  • Comment 51, posted at 24.07.13 12:26:14 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @Zibbie (Comment 50) :

    You’d get banned from SW mate.

  • Comment 52, posted at 24.07.13 12:26:55 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @Lassy_lion (Comment 46) :

    Whatever dude. You’ll just have another raft of excuses if you dont win.
    Bigging up a team that has perennially disappointed ever since Francois Pienaar left can only end up leaving egg on your face.

  • Comment 53, posted at 24.07.13 12:28:23 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • Zibbie, just read through my comments and they sound tad aggressive… please dont think they’re aimed at you personally.

  • Comment 54, posted at 24.07.13 12:29:06 by VinChainSaw Reply
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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 51) :

    im hoping that Kevin De Klerk can sort things out for us . But for now , everything rests on the Promo game . Who ever loos that is pretty much screwed

  • Comment 55, posted at 24.07.13 12:33:10 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 54) :

    if i had taken comments on Sharksworld personally i would not have lasted long . Fact is , i share your frustration . My team performed very badly for very long .

    The Kings will face much the same challenges as the Lions do . I believe player retention should be top priority for a Super rugby Fancies. Kings will need to fight of the Sharks , Bulls and Stormers when it comes to player requirement. If they manage to do that , great . and if the Lions do get back in super rugby , i expect them to not finish last next year but perform well . like the Cheetahs did this year . not be also rans

  • Comment 56, posted at 24.07.13 12:41:20 by Zibbie Reply
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  • Lions won Currie cup in 2011 yet they can’t keep their players?!?!?! O what can the excuse be?!?!?! Lions should be part of the Bulls in super rugby and Kings should get a spot in A-section of Currie cup and should stay in super rugby.

  • Comment 57, posted at 24.07.13 17:10:51 by JD Reply
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  • @JD (Comment 57) :

    good idea ! i like !! Red Bulls :mrgreen:

  • Comment 58, posted at 24.07.13 19:03:33 by Zibbie Reply
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  • @VinChainSaw (Comment 51) :

    Average attendances:

    Ellis Park 2012 SR: 23313
    Kings Park 2012 SR: 24271
    Kings Park 2013 SR: 22453 (Excluding the Kings game, the figures not available)
    FS Stadium 2012 SR: 19244
    FS Stadium 2013 SR: 20627

    @JD (Comment 57) :

    Won the CC in 2011, got kicked out of SR in 2012 – enough reason to lose players that time, I’d think.

    Fact is, the Kings “performance” is viewed with rose coloured glasses while it was in fact poor. Their attack is non-existent and their defence is a myth – conceding 69 tries does not indicate a good defence.

  • Comment 59, posted at 24.07.13 19:03:48 by Baylion Reply

    Baylion
     
  • @Baylion (Comment 59) : admittedly, Samoa is probably easier to defend against than the Super Rugby sides the Kings faced…

  • Comment 60, posted at 24.07.13 19:37:16 by robdylan Reply
    Competition Winner Administrator
    robdylan
     
  • @robdylan (Comment 60) : Rob, the point is:

    In 2010 the Lions let in 72 tries with Dick Muir’s all attack, no defence strategy and were lambasted. Even last year when the Lions let in 52 tries they were slammed for their poor defence by critics and supporters, and rightly so. The Cheetahs have been criticised for their poor defence in the past and they “only” conceded 47 tries last year.

    This year the Kings let in 69 tries and get praised for their defence?

    Sorry, but that doesn’t fly.

    I know I ask too much but all I ask is that people maintain a modicum of perspective.

  • Comment 61, posted at 24.07.13 19:54:24 by Baylion Reply

    Baylion
     
  • Baylion I have perspective and that is the Lions only good year in Super rugby happend in the early 90’s when they won it, since then they’re always in the running for the last place. They can only blame themself for losing their place in super rugby because if your best place in the last 6 years is 13th then you don’t deserve a place in super rugby.

  • Comment 62, posted at 24.07.13 23:05:02 by JD Reply
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    JD
     
  • @Baylion (Comment 61) : Deduct the Waratahs and Sharks games, and it drops down to approximately 49.

    We’ll only really know which team is better after the two relegation games.

  • Comment 63, posted at 25.07.13 05:56:43 by FireTheLooser Reply

     
  • @FireTheLooser (Comment 63) : Why don’t we sommer deduct the Bulls, Canes and Crusaders games as well, then they only conceded 29 tries?

    @JD (Comment 62) : Nobody denies that the Lions were co-architects of their downfall but don’t try and tell me dog turds are chocolate cake.

    While the Kings did better than expected they still were [email protected]

  • Comment 64, posted at 25.07.13 06:42:46 by Baylion Reply

    Baylion
     
  • @Baylion (Comment 64) : You know, the number one reason I don’t support the bulls is because of their supporters.

    You guys are becoming more and more like them, I think it’s the polluted Gauteng air.

  • Comment 65, posted at 25.07.13 07:00:23 by FireTheLooser Reply

     
  • @Baylion (Comment 64) : Ha, ha, its like after the Sharks beat the Rebels, some were just subtracting the Sharks tries from the tries scored list because it was against the Rebels, no doubt we must now do the same for the last game we played – the one against the Kings. 😈

  • Comment 66, posted at 25.07.13 09:25:17 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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    Salmonoid the Subtle
     
  • Maybe its time to compare apples with apples.
    Compare the Kings first season in this competition with the Lions (then Transvaal) in their first season. 😈

  • Comment 67, posted at 25.07.13 09:29:04 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
    Friend of Sharksworld
    Salmonoid the Subtle
     
  • @JD (Comment 57) : Ok, so if the Kings must play in the A section, what do you want to do with Eastern Province, Border and SWD, the unions that supposedly make up the Kings.

    I’ve asked Megatron before about all the new signings that came to the Kings and got no answer. The question being..to which union are they contracted to, if any, or do they all default to Eastern Province for the Currie Cup?

  • Comment 68, posted at 25.07.13 09:37:23 by Salmonoid the Subtle Reply
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    Salmonoid the Subtle
     
  • What some people seem to forget is that the Lions weren’t kicked out because of their record, although that might have convinced some unions to vote against them. They weren’t even kicked out for ending 15th last year. They were kicked out because they finished bottom of the SA conference and even if they ended 11th on the log they still would have been kicked out.

    Now consider the flip side: even if the Kings had ended 9th on the log they still would have had to play these knockout games.

    In the end the issue isn’t whether they did well or the Lions has a poor record, it’s the farcical situation SARU created that is the root cause of the ill-feelings between the supporters of both sides.

    In forcing a “promotion/relegation” contest onto a competition that isn’t designed for it SARU created a win/lose scenario and the impact on the losing team, financial and otherwise, is massive.

    According to Kevin de Klerk the Lions earnings this year is down 30%-40% on 2012 and that will only get worse if they lose the knockout contest.

    The bookies have the Lions as 4/5 favourites for the first match and I hope they got it right come Friday night.

  • Comment 69, posted at 25.07.13 09:51:51 by Baylion Reply

    Baylion
     
  • @Baylion (Comment 69) :

    But that’s not a problem if you win the relegation game… which you should… because the Kings are so shit? No?

  • Comment 70, posted at 25.07.13 10:53:57 by VinChainSaw Reply
    Author
    VinChainSaw
     
  • @Baylion (Comment 69) :

    4/5 favourites is about as close to even money as you’ll get!

  • Comment 71, posted at 25.07.13 10:54:34 by VinChainSaw Reply
    Author
    VinChainSaw
     
  • Salmanoid the Subtle the EP Kings must play A-section, SWD and Border stay in B-section, and the combined Eastern Cape Kings play super rugby.

  • Comment 72, posted at 25.07.13 11:51:57 by JD Reply
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    JD
     
  • @Zibbie (Comment 50) : Support the Bulls? Rob did you see that? 😯

  • Comment 73, posted at 26.07.13 08:43:02 by Original Pierre Reply
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