Welcome to Kings Park, where the Sharks take on 7-time champions the Crusaders.
Kick-off is at 17h05 SA time.
Sharks: 15 Willie le Roux, 14 JP Pietersen, 13 Paul Jordaan, 12 Andre Esterhuizen, 11 Lwazi Mvovo, 10 Joe Pietersen, 9 Cobus Reinach, 8 Philip van der Walt, 7 Jean-Luc du Preez, 6 Marcell Coetzee, 5 Stephan Lewies, 4 Etienne Oosthuizen, 3 Coenie Oosthuizen, 2 Franco Marais, 1 Tendai Mtawarira (captain).
Replacements: 16 Kyle Cooper, 17 Juan Schoeman, 18 Lourens Adriaanse, 19 Hyron Andrews, 20 Daniel du Preez, 21 Michael Claassens, 22 Garth April, 23 Odwa Ndungane.
Crusaders: 15 David Havili, 14 Johnny McNicholl, 13 Kieron Fonotia, 12 Ryan Crotty, 11 Nemani Nadolo, 10 Richie Mo’unga, 9 Andy Ellis, 8 Kieran Read (captain), 7 Matt Todd, 6 Jordan Taufua, 5 Samuel Whitelock, 4 Scott Barrett, 3 Owen Franks, 2 Codie Taylor, 1 Joe Moody.
Replacements: 16 Ben Funnell, 17 Wyatt Crockett, 18 Mike Alaalatoa, 19 Luke Romano, 20 Jimmy Tupou, 21 Tim Boys, 22 Mitchell Drummond, 23 Ben Volavola.
Tweet
with the cheetahs pretty much just spinning their wheels, with no real signs of improvement
Lood is definitely open to a move
the most logical team for him would be Bulls, as even though they have exciting young locks, they lack experience in that position thus a lack of balance
I’m wondering if we should try and get him
might be abit harsh on the top three locks we have in respect of of ability right now
lewies
ousthuisen
Botha
ahead of a young and promising Andrews (who yes needs to still bulk up but is playing well, and probibly wouldnt have been playing if it wasnt for all the injuries, I believe the plan must have been to slowly bring him along in SR and play him in currie cup)
Giant (who still doent belong to us)
the namibian lock
JC Askle (playing well at the kings)
Lood can play both 4 and 5 at a high level
@revolverocelot (Comment 1) : think a lot of teams (including the Bulls and Sharks) will try to sign him but don’t forget about the Lions! They’re improving and might just be an attractive prospect for him!
Maybe I dont understand this game, but to me Lood is somewhere between mildly overrated and severely ridiculously motherfeakin overrated
I see sithole is warming up with match day 23
@Henkb (Comment 4) : that’s interesting. Anyone of Odwa, JPP or Mvovo missing?
@JD (Comment 5) : Nope all of them here,
@Henkb (Comment 4) : I think the non match reserves always warm up with the side, incase of injuries
@revolverocelot (Comment 1) : Are you serious?? Lood must come to us. Do you think this competition can be won without depth in key positions? Did you notice the Stormers won the lineout battle against the Brumbies and the game was theirs.
Lood is nowhere near overrated he is flippin good. Would love to see him in a sharks match day team.
Slightly nervous but also very excited about this game. This game will tell us exactly where we are
@JD (Comment 2) :
He and Franco will make a good combination
The Bulls will probably give him a contract in Afrikaans which might just tip it in their favor
@West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 3) : ja his not looking like the lood that played against Samoa , he’s playing like a slow,big teddy bear with zero energy
Never been so torn for a super bru pick before. I reckon the Crusaders may win by 7 but I’ve gone Sharks by 2. Let’s see…
Good luck Sharks, can win this one.
Crusaders are good, but IMO most of their aura stems from their helicon days, and let’s be honest, it’s been 8 years since they won SR.
@West Indies Cricket Board (Comment 3) : at first I did not like him but took a closer look at what he does and was surprised he really works hard but like EO don’t think he’s flashy so a lot of it is missed.
All Lood needs is some plastic surgery to his face to make him look like a man and he would be a better lock for it.
@Henkb (Comment 6) : then it’s just weird.
@nortie (Comment 14) : what’s a helicon? Is that some sort of conference in a helicopter?
Maybe you mean halcyon?
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 18) :
That will work.
(Holding thumbs)
@nortie (Comment 11) : hahaha ja. Just wonder if he moves to Durbs will his name change to Lead de Jager?
Good luck my boys. Give them stick.
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 16) : or maybe a scare or two?!
What was Impi final score?
OK Sharks are in the shit!!! All three Supersport “experts” backed Sharks to win!!! Is there enough time to change my Superbru pick to Saders!?!?!?
@JD (Comment 21) :
😆
Hopefully we see a full house at Kings Park for this epic clash?…..
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 24) :
You planning to watch the HaGuarEs tonight? 😆
I was always a fan of Lood, thought he had potential since he made his first appearance for the cheetahs
But yes his been sub par thus far this SR season. My view on that (as i’ve watched all their games) is that his really trying but he cant do everything himself in the forwards
he would send a big message by signing for the lions, lions are unlikely to lose players like the cheetahs have is a key cheetahs player and front line bok jumps ship to them.
I would love for us to sign lood, but bulls have a edge with their afrikaans culture, we can counter that but showing that we’re ahead of the bulls in terms of were the squad is to compete for the SR title by performing better than them this season
If Super Rugby games against the Crusaders at home can’t bring in anything near a full house then Natal has problems. This game would be a sell out at Newlands. Hopefully we see a large crowd.
@nortie (Comment 28) : for sure! I will be skreeu-ing for the Hug-u-ahrez!
@revolverocelot (Comment 29) :
Once the Bulls get their preferred coaching team of HM, Victor and FdP they might start pulling some players again.
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 24) : see on web it was 72-8. This means Impi has 39 points deference more vs Wits.
Thank goodness for Afrikaans commentary.
And JPP tackles Nadolo!!!
Why is the Sharks not kicking out!?!?!?!
Crotty is down. 0-0 after 3 odd min.
Penalty at scrum. Not sure Saders 3 totally lost his bind!!! But luckily score stays 0-0. Justice?!?!?!
Again Saders lose their bind in the scrum but no penalty.
Sharks pushing they luck with these kicks
1. Why are the Sharks kicking away EVERYTHING?
2. Why is JPP coming in off hs wing EVERY time?
How long can the defence hold on?
Only a matter of time before the Saders score a try. Huge pressure building, not helped by the Sharks feeding them possession.
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 41) : mvovo doing the same thing as jp, the habana syndrom
What did I say….
I simply cannot understand these tactics from the Sharks…
Inevitable.
Saders score 5-0.
And the wall breaks. Excellent patience from the Sanders.
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 45) : very strange!!!
Sharks were asking for this. Keep kicking the ball at them. Stupid.
Why the hell is the pa system playing music for they try? Just announce so and so scored
All our opponents have scored the 1st tries of the match?
The one time we retained possession JPP knocked on a sitter pass. It’s almost like we have no confidence holding the ball so we hoof everything away. You cannot defend your way to a win against NZ teams.
Saders 7-0 after 25min.
Give credit to the saders, Peyper is allowing them to run obstruction lines and we are not adapting. Seems though that Peyper is so scared of seeming biased that he is giving all 50/50 calls to the saders
Nadolo has a freakish boot.
We in for a spanking if we continue to do this
And we keep kicking back to the Crusaders. Keep the ball in the forwards?
Sharks are panicking now, lineouts imploding
And now the lineout falls apart
Gavin Cowley has picked up how the twins lose the ball in contact so easily
Sharks can’t even pass a ball without making an error… 🙄
Nothing working for the Sharks.
All the penalties and calls do seem to be going the Crusaders way..
Kick and defend. Rinse and repeat. 🙄
Mvovovoooooom!!!
Great intercepted try MVOVO!!!!!
Luckily Mvovs gets the intercept.
What a fluke try.
We cannot rely just on intercepts.
But we will take the points.
McNichol is quicker than Mvovo.
Only way Mvovo will get the ball today is if a Shader passes to him.
Joe Pietersen allowed another kick at poles
Fast faster MVOVO!!!
And Joe gets another chance!
7-7 after 37min.
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 68) : just about everyone is quicker than the sharks wings this season lol
Set pieces are a balls up
@Poisy (Comment 72) : eish and I thought Mvovo was our quickest 😯
Our lineouts and scrums have gone to absolute shit
Peyper seems to have remembered there are 2 sides playing, we are getting more fortuitous calls
And now we get crunched in the scrum.
7-7 Half time.
Wow 7 – 7 at half time is no way a reflection on that half. It feels more like a 21 – 0 half.
Lets hope we see the now usual 2nd half boost from the Sharks.
Fortunately Saders 10 have left his kicking boots in NZ
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 74) : our quickest is playing outside centre right now being made to tackle instead of using his pace to score tries
So Reinach at half time says because its so tough to handle the ball in Durban, that’s the reason why they are kicking everything.
OK fine but how come the Crusaders are the keeping the ball way more and look like they are playing with glue on their hands then?
I can’t believe handre loves me I’m so overwhelmed
saders are a classy team wow
@Poisy (Comment 80) : can you imagine if Odwa happened to have caught that intercept? 😳 Mvovo had to run towards the corner and only then just beat McNicol who made up some ground on him.
What was the territory Stat for the first half? 99 to 1?
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 63) : Ja, Crusaders put in at scrum; it collapses = penalty to them; Sharks put in and they scrum illegally = penalty to them; its all penalties to them; beast looks bemused
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 84) : odwa wouldn’t have shot out of the defencive line
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 81) : That excuse is really starting to get old.
@Ben (Comment 85) : Supersport stats has handling errors at 8 – 3 for the Crusaders. Huh?
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 81) : When the Saders knock the ball, the win a penalty at scrum time – when the Sharks knock the ball, Saders get a penalty at scrum time….so it probably comes down to where the Sharks most prefer conceding the penalty 🙂
6 – 3 penalty count; Peyper seems like he’s being a bit of a nz fan-boy; Sharks haven’t been great bust haven’t got the appropriate advantage from crusaders infractions
65 – 35 to the crusaders
Need a change of tactics for the second half. Keep the ball in hand and kick out when we kick.
@Ben (Comment 93) : but the humidity? It only applies to the Sharks so they need to kick everything?
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 30) : Down here in cape town theres a way bigger NZ rugby culture support and rugby in general people love to go watch so its easy for the stormers to fill the stadium, in fact the amount of people who actually would go watch live rugby if the tickets were somewhats cheaper would double
way different on the east coast it seems
any ideas what we can do to change that ? Other than the obvious which is to win win win
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 89) : They have spilled the ball a couple of times, but then they just retake it at the next scrum. Sharks hardly had the ball to spill it.
In other news bafana bafana are holding cameroon 2-2 for now
Agree re Peyper, seems to be letting a lot of scrum infringements go the way of Crusaders.
Move the stadium to Kloof where there is no humidity. It’s also a less shit place for numbers to get to.
Gary Gold says they want to build the phase play. Here’s hoping…
Mvovo had to start from a stand still and McNicholl had the angle on him. You guys complaining have probably never played rugby?
Not sure why we’re not keeping the ball in hand. Also even more concerned about the lack of explosiveness of the bench…
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 99) : kloof not central I’d have a hard time going to game trying to find a taxi,I’d have to use the car,its way more fun using public transport
Ffs Peyper please be consistent.
McNicholl had to stop and turn….
@Big Fish (Comment 101) : that was not a standing start he ran out of the line to intercept the ball and I did play rugby but at scrumhalf not wing
@Poisy (Comment 102) : haha I wasn’t being serious but there’s no humidity in Kloof, Hillcrest, Botha’s Hill…
Crusaders tactics consist of kicking into our 22, and then attacking from our kicks.
Hahahaha another intercept Mvovo!
Fortune favours the brave.
MVOVO!!!!!!!
We’re riding our luck big time
Mvovo only Sharks to spend time in Saders 22 – twice 🙂
Sharks lead 14-7 after 45min.
Lots of the rugby watching population live up in Westville, Kloof, Hillcrest etc too… interesting thought.
Have a look at the replay guys.
Anyway, Old Slowboat crawls over for his second…
Our fastest player isn’t even making the 23. Sithole is seriously needed. Must have urked the fools gold coach
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 106) : where do you stay?
😀
Great thinking Esterhuizen. 🙄
Geez the Sharks are lucky tonight!
We are really riding our luck tonight
Some of us are not in front of a telly, a little more info would be appreciated 😉
I love this touch judge hehehe
@JarsonX (Comment 122) : crusaders get a yellow card for retaliation
Saders down to 14!
@Poisy (Comment 124) : Thanks
That must have been the longest we held onto the ball.
We lose another line out we get it back and kick it out for a change
Saders nailing us with 14 men.
Crusaders on the charge nodolo seems to score in corner after stepping jp tmo to confirm
Why are we so scarred of dropping Cobus. He fucks up any attack with his slow game and pass.
Try awarded, crusaders score with 14 men
We have a man advantage and we still kick the ball to them?
Try Saders. Sharks lead 14-12 after 51min
Bad play by Sharks.
Sharks are fortunate Crusaders don’t have a kicker.
Conversion missed sharks 14-12 crusaders
Try Crusaders. Smart NZ play. Dof SA play.
Sharks falling apart against 14
2 tries in 2 mins with 14 men
That was poor from the Sharks. Wake up boys.
Crusaders score another try with 14 men quick line out from half way
Guess which team is making a rare appearance again….
Please let me know when there is about 10mins remaining
Poor poor play by Sharks!
Well done Ninja
Very lucky Sharks!
Sharks have so much luck tonight
Lucky again
Thats justice because the fast throwin looked forward
Sharks must pool their money and play lotto today.
Try overturned foot in touch scores stay sharks 14-12 crusaders
Lucky why?
With all this luck the Sharks are being very dof
Van der Walt is quality
@JarsonX (Comment 152) : Nevermind
Saders forwards are teaching ours a lesson.
Crusaders had scrum in the 22 they send it wide go through some phases and lose it forward
Bad injury to a Sharks player
Feels like the Saders should be 40 points up. Have no idea how we are in the lead.
Van der Walt is down – head clash/neck injury
Break in play score still 14-12 to the sharks
@JarsonX (Comment 155) : It looked like the Crusaders had scored, then Peyper saw on a big screen replay that a foot was in touch so he cancelled the try.
@Spirit of Rugby (Comment 162) : I wonder if he can do that
Sharks have totally wasted the yellow card here
Vd Walt off in a stretcher injured! Hope he’s OK!
@Poisy (Comment 163) : until the kick is taken, yes.
Time back on we looking better in the scrums now with adriaans
Why do we keep the ball in the scrum? Get it out quickly.
Penalty to us in the scrum!!!
Sharks get a scrum penalty!
Get Andre to take the line kicks. Joe gets buggerall distance.
@Poisy (Comment 163) : Peyper said something about it being allowed when he asked for the tmo replay
Fucksake cobus is so slow
Dof play from Lewies……
Dumbass by Lewies
Sharks playing brainless rugby.
Penalty to saders lewis playing the man in the air in the lineout
Sharks are trying their hardest to lose this
First pebalty …. jumoing across the line
Terrible reactive reffing
Good skills from Saders to keep the ball alive.
Once again … this time a penalty because he made contact with the ball
Good defence from sharks to stop nodolo and company and we get a penalty and kick it out
Pietersen really needs to work on his line kicks
Willie Le Roux!!!!!!!!!
Mvovo injured in back play crusaders use him to attack that side and sharks couldn’t defend scared to hurt mvovo, we get the ball leroux chases down a kick and scores
Wille was offside. FFS
Not given 🙁
That was not infront
Try overturned leroux infront of kicker
Our luck’s running out
How can he call that from that camera angle
Mvovo off injured odwa is on
Odwa to score the winner, Ruan pienaar to come out of nowhere and kick the conversion!
How the TMO could tell Willie was in front from that single angle, I don’t know?
Thats a worse call than lytes try last week
Etienne looking injured aswell time is off but he gets up and shakes it off
Stop with the fucking kicking.
Silly stupid kicking.
Cooper is on
9,10,12 and 13 please get them off
Every ball we get, we skop….
10 min left sharks 14-12 saders
My granny can kick further than Joe
Shit
If you kick everything to the Crusaders, they will score tries.
Dof tactics from the Sharks.
Read scores after 15 phases right next to poles sharks 14-19 saders
Please take Reinach off now. His useless kick resulted in gifting ball to Saders and a try under the posts.
Now the Sharks have to hold the ball to chase the game
Well done Saders 19-14.
Well deserved try by the Crusaders
Penalty to us 5min left we kick to touch
The Sharks can’t even get to two phases
Holy shit this is kak by the Sharks
Saders bullying Sharks at the breakdown.
We lose ball in contact after line out we steal it back and they steal it back and kick on the full
Should have gone with the head on the Bru… 🙄
Patience now.
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 213) : The Sharks can only play without the ball
Any bets tactics will involve a kick?
1min left we have penalty and kick to corner
Game over. Not even two phases from the lineout.
The Sharks were so shit.
Another brain fart in possession and that’s the ball game.
What utter kak from the Sharks.
Penalty to crusaders obstruction saders kick out full time sharks 14-19 saders
Well done Saders!
You not gonna win if you not prepared to play
Didn’t deserve that losing bonus point. We are playing stupid Stormers rugby now. Playing not to lose, not playing to win.
The harks have no attacking threat to speak of. They cannot hold the ball through even two phases. This game really showed we are and that the “only unbeaten team” after 4 rounds was a bit of a false representation of our true strength and ability
We need to learn to play smarter the heart and passion is there but the tactics not so much
New year, same brainless shit. Only coach that can hold his head high is the Moroccan. The rest and the players need to start fucking pulling finger.
The further this competition goes the more Gold and the lack of a gameplan and cohesion becomes apparent. Egotistical boys attempting a team sport. Same old same old Gary Gold.
That obstruction at the end pretty much summed it up. Sloppy.
This was always on the cards. Same kak game plan from last year. Better defense the on!y difference.
@Ben (Comment 229) : Even the Stormers are better than us on attack. I just threw up saying that.
Apparently the humidity only affects the Sharks. The Crusaders went through 15 phases before the inevitable dam wall broke for their winning try.
Whhyyyyyyyy was I born a Shark? The most frustrating team on the planet to support.
Really not a great tactical game by the Sharks! Seemed as if they decided to just play of the mistakes of the Saders and sorry to say that will never work! Sharks are very lucky to only lose by 5 points!
kyle cooper got driven back 10 m in contact and lost the ball . REally mis bissie at hooker he would not take any kak
Hmmmm,
Do we have a Fetcher at all?
Seems to me we never had the ball and on the odd occasion we did get possession, our kickers couldn`t relieve pressure.
You can`t win with zero possession . . .
@Spirit of Rugby (Comment 235) : We have a very simple plan. Get the ball, kick straight to a Sader and then defend.
Unbelievable character on defence, absolute worry on attack! This team has massive heart and character, but as we have stated before, a defence minded team can’t win this competition. I am not so sure it is the coaches, I am just not convinced our players can run the ball like the NZ. It is tough to watch, so much heart but just no direction on attack. We don’t seem able to suck in defenders and choose when to run at tight forwards. The NZ tour will be tough, we can’t just tackle or we will get hammered n the tour
Just another loss to the Crusaders for this mediocre Sharks team and management.
@Bokhoring (Comment 241) : Yes, it’s brilliant 🙄
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 237) : not just the Sharks, SA rugby and mentality in general
And please get Andre or even Willie to take the line kicks. Joe gains about 12m with each penalty.
Looks like Golds words had no effect still kick away everything we get so we can defend first half and hope to keep the margin low. I don’t blame Gold, the players need to shape up.
GG way out of his depth playing these NZ teams
why the f#ck dont they let Esterhuizen kick . joe pieterson and willie cant kick far. whyyyyyyyyy dont they use esterhuizens big left boot to kick us out of our half
We can praise “defence”and “character” as much as we want but that will only serve to mask what has been coming with creeping doubts through the first 4 games and now a rising crescendo of absolutely no doubt at all – our supposed new attacking game is a non entity.
20 years of Super Rugby and you think we would have learned you cannot just kick and defend your way to a win against a New Zealand team.
Just utter, utter dof tactics. We were lucky it was only 5 points at the end, that felt like a 30 point drubbing.
I’m actually stunned that you guys aren’t able to take positives from that performance. Absolutely stunned.
Time for april to start me thinks
To me at 74 minutes were were 19 – 14 down and what do we do? Kick the ball away 🙄 That’s when I knew this Sharks team has no chance this year. You can have as much team cohesion and commitment as possible but the NZ are just so much SMARTER
@robdylan (Comment 251) : positives are were the best deffensive team in the tournament and the negatives are were the worst attacking team with no vision
Look our defence is great this year. All top teams should have a defence though. What else did we have?
Amazing how all is negative after our first loss…Rome was not built in a day! We can only do better from here. Go Sharks I believe.
@DuToit04 (Comment 256) : hear! Hear!
In other choker news England beat SL so floteas are out of World T20!!!
Bafana bafana drew 2 all with cameroon, england just beat sri lanka so proteas are out of world cup I can’t wait to see the boks this year when we still don’t even have a coach
I’m disappointed but not pissed. Last year we had no positives the whole season and fans were right to vent but this vitriol and bullshit some of you ‘fans’ spew is something else. Round five, tired and we go down to the Crusaders by so little – I’ll begrudgingly take it. As long as that stupid kick plan of Gold’s get’s shown the damn door again …….
@robdylan (Comment 251) : only positive is that they showed good defence for most of the game.
@JD (Comment 258) :you beat me by a full min with that announcement
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 253) : nobody is saying the Saders weren’t 100% better than us on the day.
I thought the Sharks really scrapped well, the loss hurts, but with the amount of ball the Crusaders had to not be overrun is a plus point.
Its not just the Sharks that keep kicking on the Kiwi sides to run back, it’s a SA epidemic.
Fortune almost favored the brave today, the Crusaders threw crucial points away by not having a reliable kicker.
Our teams, except for the Lions, just can’t seem to score tries like the Kiwis do.
Let me give you guys the positive.
Last year our full-strength team lost to these guys by 42 points in a gutless showing.
This year, a new team full of young guys scrapped hard for 80 minutes and lost by 5 points.
Come on. See what you choose to see. I’m choosing the positive.
We had no possession. No territory. It was a “gutsy” defensive display.
That game was a carbon copy of the typical Springbok v All Blacks game.
And just like those games the NZ team came from behind and took control in the last 20 minutes after the SA team spent all game tackling and kicking everything away.
The trend is downward – a poor draw which felt like a loss followed by a pretty one-sided loss at home where we rode our luck for a large period of the game before the inevitable loss happened.
By all means take positives if you wish but allow others to drop in a dose of realism.
I would like to see a replay of Willie’s disallowed try from a side angle because I felt the TMO was pretty quick to call that decision after one quick view of an angle from which I could not tell if he was in front of the kicker with any certainty at all.
@nortie (Comment 264) : very keen to see the Lions against these guys next week…. very keen
Oh well, game over. Time to move on. Just another loss to a kiwi team at home. Later.
Esterhuizen had a blinder good to see the centres are now sorted
We had two great pieces of luck handed to us thru mvovo. Other than that we did nothing. Call it vitriol or fans spewing, whatever you want but we are unable to finish unable to string together a successfull attack so yes we were crap. I won’t bury my head in the sand just to sound positive. Sharks need a lot more than this drek to even be considered for the second half of this competition.
@robdylan (Comment 267) :
Yes, it should be a cracking match.
The “live by the sword, die by the sword” game plan is a dangerous plan, just ask the Jaguares.
I think the Crusaders will relish playing at Ellis Park against a side that wants to have a go at them, they can and will fight fire with fire.
Sharks game plan today to frustrate them into making errors almost paid off.
Our teams just need that magical switch to conjur up the little bit of magic needed to score when we really need to.
Supporting a team like the Stormers I know the frustration when my side needs a try, knowing they can’t play catch up rugby
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 266) : “That game was a carbon copy of the typical Springbok v All Blacks game.”
I agree. And we ALL have a lot of work to do. But what did you really expect?
One thing is certain, the NZ teams are starting to fire.
Chiefs, Highlanders and Crusaders looking very dangerous now.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 268) :
Now you need us to win tonight, otherwise it’s almost a 8 point log swing 😆
@coolfusion (Comment 270) : “unable to finish”? That’s laughable. The ONLY two opportunities we had we scored tries from.
I’m pretty sure (100% sure) in a thread during the week I said the last thing we must do is kick on to their backs…….
@robdylan (Comment 275) : Exactly, it wasn’t that we couldn’t finish, we couldn’t create anything…which is worse.
@robdylan (Comment 272) : What did I expect?
1. A win. I always expect the Sharks to win at home against any team. That’s the starting point.
More esoterically:
2. Some evidence of an ability to retain possession and create tries, because it has been lacking all season so far. Saw none of that tonight.
3. Better handling too, because that has been really poor so far and again that was also poor tonight.
So against all three of my measurables, the Sharks disappointed. I’d have taken a loss with the other two being ticked.
Almost seem like the coaching staff panicked when the Jags scored 2 tries from turnovers while we were on attack. Since then we went back to Jake ball and talking about playing test rugby. Defence has been excellent, but still could not hold out the Saders. You need to build pressure to either get penalties or even better score tries. We are not going to make the quarters this way – we may as well work to get back to the positive rugby we played at the start of the season. It will be difficult against better teams but we need to start building for next year.
Some advice, never go to rugby with a friend who has a boyfriend. I kissed her on the cheek and got booed by the stadium 🙁
Don’t think we deserved to win, and in the same breath don’t believe we got a fair crack by Peyper and TMO
@Bokhoring (Comment 279) : the really disturbing thing is that we play even better NZ teams away from home 😯
@Seth101 (Comment 280) : who was the girl
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 282) : This Saders team has a very good pack but a lot of youngsters in the back line.
@nortie (Comment 274) : ha after that loss I changed my bru pick. I now have Stormers by 3…
@Bokhoring (Comment 284) : yeah, a Crusaders team we should have a good chance of beating at home…. their forwards schooled our though…
@Poisy (Comment 283) : Just a friend, hard to tell the crowed that when you’re one kiss cam though.
@Seth101 (Comment 280) : were you on the cam?
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 286) : come on mate let it go now we lost but I’m sure we will get better. Don’t work yourself up over the sharks ,you know how they are 😛
@Bayshark (Comment 281) : you mean the Willie try? I wasn’t convinced he was ahead
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 286) : I blame the forwards and Gold for that loss. The forwards got momstered, and Gold clearly sent them out with a game plan to kick, any boy did we.
@Seth101 (Comment 287) : hahaha I would have booed you too mate, surely you can kiss her on the mouth just for the cam no tongue or anything 😛
It is clear, NZ rugby is miles ahead of everyone unwilling to embrace ball-in-hand rugby.
This is not only a Sharks problem…the Lions, Jaguars and Sunwolves are all on-board.
@robdylan (Comment 288) : Yea, not for the first time either, because of where I sit I always end up on it 🙁
@Poisy (Comment 292) : She’s taken, I’m a gentleman :D.
@Seth101 (Comment 291) : the forwards got schooled, yes indeed, Just keen to understand what your plan was. You wanted the backs to run all the shit ball they got in their own 22 with 3 Crusaders on top of them every time?
I’m thankful for the losing bonus point. Your strategy wouldn’t have seen us lose by 30.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 285) :
That’s the spirit
@robdylan (Comment 296) : Forward pods, recycle and keep recycling. These guys are meant to be fit aren’t they?
Sure as hell is better then kicking onto the best counter attacking backline in the tournament. Out defence keep the score low, and pure luck kept the margin close.
@Seth101 (Comment 295) : you should get a tshirt that says “we are just friends” and stand up and kiss on the cheek
@Poisy (Comment 299) : Oh if I take her again I’m definitely taking a sign too.
We couldn’t see it on the big screen, was the offside for Willies try as questionable as it seemed?
@robdylan (Comment 296) : I don’t think anyone is suggesting a “run at all costs” approach. The Jaguars play that and nearly beat the mighty Chiefs with that by the way though.
We just need a good balanced approached. Tonight’s game was bizarre in that we didn’t try anything at all.
We have an inability to hold on to the ball, either handling errors or turnovers kill us. We need to fix this if we stand any chance of stringing a few phases together like the Crusaders seem to do with ease.
@Seth101 (Comment 301) : I only saw one angle and he looked well behind the kicker to me.
Commentators said something about there being other players in front.
@Seth101 (Comment 301) : very! They showed it on tv once from a dodgy angle and somehow tmo made a decision
Did not watch the game,so cant comment on what happened.just a bit of perspective though:thomas,botha,potgieter,lambie all need to return from injury,and im sure they will all be included in match 23.then there is also chili.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 302) : ok, look, I’m not going to argue that the Sharks picked the right game plan for occasion because we lost, so my argument wouldn’t hold water.
I just refuse to be negative because the yardstick here is an abjectly pathetic 40-point snotting. And we didn’t come anywhere near that level of kak tonight.
Well it took Gold four games to revert to his shite 2015 blueprint,this game was exactly that.
I walked out of the stadium feeling like I’d gone back a year.
We kicked everything we had straight to the hardest runner in Super rugby,and we did it again and again and again.
Our attrition rate is going to get worse and worse if we carry on playing this game watch the injuries pile up.
We lost van der Walt and Dan dupe tonight.,both looked serious
Oh and by the way fuck Pyper.
maybe you guys need the same scotch I’ve got to drink during the game 🙂
@Seth101 (Comment 301) : it seemed such an enormous swing moment in the game to call it so suddenly on one quick replay where the angle made it look wrong – but any human could tell the angle needed to be factored in… certainly it wasn’t decisive from the replay either way, I’d have called for a side on angle first bearing in mind the importance of the call.
Yea the crowd were upset, decision seemed to be made so quickly with one viewing.
@The hound (Comment 307) : exactly! Seth has already suggested that Jaguars game put the fear of death into Gold because ever since we have looked decidedly 2015… but with a better defence.
@robdylan (Comment 306) : Shit what game were you watching,we never looked like winning this game,correction we never looked like we wanted to win this game,we went out with that lets see how low we can keep the beating attitude,and you are happy with the result.
We never used to lose home games,at least we never were happy to lose home games.
@The hound (Comment 312) : preach it brother.
there we go, thats a clear indication that though we’re a godd side were not at the level of the really top teams in the comp at this point
saders are so so good
and when we had chances to launch attaches we would lose the lineout or knock on etc
we were on the back foot all game
lucky we didnt get killed
yes we looked good on defense against decent french teams (who werent full strength) the problem is that the best Oz and Nz teams read: tahs, brumbies, chiefs, canes, saders, landers. Play at a much faster pace than the teams we played in pre season.
I actually agree with the super sport anaylists when the say that we only really played two good teams in the saders and stormers, then bulls, kings dont count. And argies were decent
not to say we cant make the final or even win it all, just that i dont see it happening this year if we cant take on teams lf this caliber
maybe things will change once we get lambie or raun botha and J pottie back
we were so weak with the ball in hand today its like everytime we took contact we might turn the ball over
and our kicking accuracy was poor
I don’t think it matters if the home loss was by 40 or 1, they should never be accepted.
@The hound (Comment 312) : completely disagree, but that’s the wonderful thing about a democracy.
The reason we’re so bad on attack is : forwards running of 9 and not getting over the advantage line , but for some reason we still play it of nine to a forward . When the ball rarely gets to 10 AE always runs a shortball line and ball gets passed behind him ,because he mistimes his run , to a deep willie who is to deep to attack .
@shrodingers cat (Comment 317) : Running the ball off 9 isn’t always a bad thing but it pisses me off that our forwards are standing, waiting for the ball and only once they’ve got the ball they start running! By that time, defenders have got a head of steam and smash us. Utterly pathetic game from o
Didnt watch but feel the sharks need a fetcher in the match 23.marcell cant play every minute of every game.think cloete should have been contracted.sharks are not the finished product.yet,by the sound of things,the sharks might have won re: tmo decision?now factor in the players injured that should be in match 23.
@the ko (Comment 318) : From our guys *
@shrodingers cat (Comment 317) : We weren’t bad on attack, we didn’t attack. The only time the ball was run was when the forwards crashed it up to set up a kick.
@The hound (Comment 312) : Exactly, kicking onto an attack like that and then defending for 80 minutes is going to (and did) break players.
Gold almost had us convinced, almost.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 311) :
The Jaguares game took some time to get where they are.
Argentina brought Grahame Henry in when they joined the RC, they played experimental test sides for a long time in the June tests, lost a lot more than they won, but now, a few years down the line it’s starting to reap rewards.
SA sides won’t be allowed the same amount of “forgiveness” by their supporters to implement a game plan that means you lose so much more than you win.
Our players don’t have the skill set and running mindset even at schoolboy level, so it’s difficult to expect them to have it down pat when they play test or SR level.
well, that’s the last time I pick with the heart and not the head. You can fool me once…
@nortie (Comment 322) : Rubbish, I know everyone loves to say that is their test side, but it’s not. We have 16!!!! Let me repeat 16!!!! International players, the fact that they have a far far better game plan than us in their first season is plan and simply embarrassing and disgraceful.
@Seth101 (Comment 324) : 18 if you count the Namibians!!!
The other thing is coenie. he is a really strong ballcarier and showed it . But he really battles in the scrum so I don’t know maybe he should play loose head
@nortie (Comment 322) : what do you mean we have no patience? Hello-ooo-oo our maestro Gold would have been sacked well before now if that was true… if I could see the team was trying something I believed in but still losing then it would lend itself to even greater patience but when I see my team kicking EVERYTHING back to a NZ team and losing, well… that’s just dof…
@shrodingers cat (Comment 326) : A prop who can’t scrum shouldn’t play full stop. It’s not their job to carry.
@nortie (Comment 322) : Lions and Cheetahs disprove your point as far as running and handling skills. Kiwi teams just better at playing total rugby (defence, set piece, smart kicking game and attack).
I wish our set pieces hadn’t been terrible because then this lose would be completely Golds fault instead of partially.
@Seth101 (Comment 330) : Blame should go all around – entire coaching team (except defence and conditioning) and the players.
@Bokhoring (Comment 329) :
i wouldn’t use the Cheetahs as an example, teams don’t mind so much if they have a go and score three tries, they know they will score 4 or 5 against them. Similar to the Kings scoring at least 3 tries a game against the Kiwi sides, the level of intensity from the opposition isn’t as high as it would be when facing some of our sides who they consider as dangerous.
The Lions are a few levels above the other franchises when it comes to how we would like to see our sides play, but it’s still early days in the competition so we can only really ascess them after the pool stages to see where they end up.
But, they are allowed to express themselves on the field. Even if they lose, their supporters still back Akkers and the team.
@Bokhoring (Comment 331) : Fine, Everitt, Strudwick and Gold….Except Gold as head coach decides the game plan and should take 100% of the blame for that.
@nortie (Comment 332) : Cheetahs can score some brilliant tries, but their set piece and defence lets them down, i.e. my point about total rugby.
@Seth101 (Comment 333) : Du Preez as well.
Literally Nostraseth said DO NOT KICK ONTO THEIR BACKS, YOU WILL LOSE….
@Bokhoring (Comment 335) : From my understanding he is conditioning and partially defense.
Time to lower our expectations again…..we’re now playing losing JW rugby.
What I don’t understand – Gold at half time was unhappy with the amount of defending the Sharks did, yet Reinach said kicking the ball away was part of the plan.
What am I missing here?
@Seth101 (Comment 337) : I thought he is the new attack coach.
@Bokhoring (Comment 339) : You might be right, I don’t claim to be right. The Interwebs have both him and Everett as “Skills & Attack”. In which case blame him to, but blame Gold for the game plan.
@FireTheLooser (Comment 338) : Gold said at half time he wanted to see more phase play… but I doubt we even reached third phase once before kicking it away or coughing it up. Some disconnect there.
@robdylan (Comment 265) : I hear you bro, good point
but it was insanely fruatrating being on the back foot all game, its like they were toying with us
also as much as i love beast, i feel its insane to play him all game, loose head is supposed to be well stocked, give schoeman a chance for 20min off the bench and make marcell captain for those final 20min
@FireTheLooser (Comment 338) : Reinach is just really underperforming, that’s all there is too it. How can anybody justify the amount of mistakes this half-back makes for a pro rugby player, it’s lubricious. We will never be a consistent attacking force again with him at no 9. The moment where we chipped over and Odwa re-gathered and he chose to chip over again right into the back three hands just really summed up for me, that either he or the coaching staff have learnt absolutely nothing from their lack of imagination on attack in 2015. And that, despite the amazing strides in defense we have made, is why I will not return as a season ticket holder.
@Poisy (Comment 190) : Guys we were at the game and the Willie try should have stood as he was not in front and the ball was touched by a crusader, it replayed several times on the big screen
@robdylan (Comment 251) : Rob, IMO we did excellent tonight, the humidity in the stadium was very bad and extremely hot tonight, if you see what we did tonight in comparison to what happened last year we were excellent, the crusaders were just beter on the night
@Seth101 (Comment 287) : Must admit I also booooood you tonight on the kiss cam for kissing the girl on the cheek
@Henkb (Comment 346) : Clearly you didn’t listen to ‘Sharky says’ ;).
@Henkb (Comment 345) : mate how come the humidity didn’t affect the Crusaders who had the ball in their hands all game?
I can tell you now if we play this 2015 version we will lose to all the other NZ teams, the Jaguars away, the Sunwolves and the Lions home and away.
@Nostraseth (Comment 347) : Forgot about that when I saw the poor girl getting a half a kiss on the cam, and had to voice some sort of an opinion
@Henkb (Comment 350) : Lol she’s the one with someone not me, I can assure you a kiss on the cheek topped off with a displeased Kings Park was not my first choice.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 349) : Sunwolves are a stretch, but our tour is going to be brutal with the rugby we have played in the last two weeks.
@Nostraseth (Comment 352) : the Sunwolves have one dimensional SA teams’ number, there’s no fear there, it’s only a matter of time. Teams are unpicking our boring, one dimensional game with ease these days.
Now that we have the top of the log and unbeaten team animals off our back, I hope we will now forget about this “test rugby” approach, build on the good defensive effort and start trying some things on attack.
@Bokhoring (Comment 354) : all I think it will do is send Gold more into panic mode. That means more Jake ball and hoofing the leather off it. I cannot see us topping our group this year and I doubt we will be the best qualifier.
I’m not happy about the loss or the “game plan”. But for a team we all agreed was rebuilding at the beginning of the season they weren’t terrible. I’d like to see more attacking flair but Joe hasn’t shown that this season yet. I’d give April more of a run to see if we can get more attack out of him. Game wasn’t great but it doesn’t make our team crap either.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 348) : stories,way to many stories
@neilster (Comment 343) : CR is fast proving once again that he is the worst 9 in SR and yet Sharks have Claasen on bench,go figure that one out
@Hulk (Comment 356) : we’re not a bad team. Nobody is saying that.
Shit, we even improved from last year (it was impossible to get worse).
We’re a limited team though. That is now obvious. And it has slowly dawned on us all that for another year of Super Rugby we’re just in it to make up the numbers.
Sure, some of you were able to get to that space before any whistle was blown this year. There was even an article about it on here. But I think it’s shocking that a Sharks team, any Sharks team, is just in this competition to make up the numbers and it’s even more shocking that that is acceptable to anyone – especially after a catastrophe year like 2015.
Sure, we’ve had some misfortune with injuries to two of our big signings – Potgieter and Botha – but don’t let the talk of a young team fool you. We shopped for major players in Le Roux, Oosthuizen, Van der Walt and to a lesser extent Joe Pietersen to go with our vastly experienced Boks in Beast, Coetzee, JPP, Mvovo and other experienced Boks and Super Rugby players Reinach, Adriaanse, Lewies, Oosthuizen, Jordaan, Odwa. The team has an experienced core – enough of an experienced core to do well at this level. It’s not the calibre of player we have or their inexperience.
What is missing then? Can it really be as simple as brains in the coaching department? How else do you explain kicking all night long and defending for 80 minutes against a New Zealand team? Do our players lack intelligence too? Can they also not tell by now this tactic fails 19 times out of 20?
I am adamant and have been since the start that Gold simply is not good enough. I hope he proves me wrong, I really do.
I just don’t know if we have the brains in the coaching box to go the one step further than any Sharks coach has gone before. I doubt it. Seems like we’re destined to stick with what we have and hope for miracles.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 359) : You mention that you find it shocking that it is acceptable to some of us that we’re only in SR to make up the numbers this year. What are your expectations though, keeping in mind that you argued for realism earlier in the thread?
@vanmartin (Comment 360) : The realism is that we’re shitter than we all thought before today’s kick off.
Look in 20 years the Sharks have made 9 semis/play offs and included in that 4 finals. We’re almost at a semi/playoff every other year and we get a final every 5 years.
A team with that strike rate should be winning the damn thing every now and again. A team with that strike rate, you’d expect their fans to be a little more demanding.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 361) : So what are your expectations for this year?
@vanmartin (Comment 362) : Read up.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 363) : you reckon we should win SR this year? Your last answer was a little non-specific on 2016.
@vanmartin (Comment 364) : look, my point is this. The Sharks have the best record of any SA team against the foreign teams. They have been in the most finals and semis of any SA team. They have a certain history in this tournament they need to live up to and supporters need to remember that.
My disappointment this evening stems from my realisation that the Sharks will not win SR 2016.
I can be a realist about that but it doesn’t mean I need to accept this sorry situation for another year running. I demand more from a team of the Sharks’ history and ability.
You only have to realise that Stormers fans are way more demanding of their traditionally mediocre team to know that we Sharks fans have let the ball slip.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 365) : So if we’re more demanding the team will win SR?
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 366) : Their demanding fans haven’t done the Stormers much good though. I’d venture they’ve featured in less playoffs than we have despite their demanding fans.
What if the supporters have very little influence on the team’s success or failure?
Stormers are starting to show us their “different path”. They’re beating the Jaguars at their own game with lovely flowing back play.
These Jaguars dirt trackers look nothing like the team they put out against the Chiefs last weekend.
@vanmartin (Comment 367) : supporters have no influence on how the team plays in the 80 minutes on the field but you only need to look at English football to know what power fans actually have in influencing change when its needed and holding management to account.
@vanmartin (Comment 367) : were you happy with tonight’s game? What did you expect tonight?
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 369) : interesting how SA rugby unions are inevitably compared to private English football clubs in these debates. So how have SA supporters brought about change at the unions?
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 370) : Happy? Not completely, I expected a lot of kicking but more accuracy in the execution. Thought our set-pieces would be steadier too and felt there were some easing off in defence leading up to Read’s try.
My expectation? I predicted we would lose by 6.
I think there were decent positives to take out of the game but there’s plenty more to work on.
Might as well lay out all my cards. We won’t win SR this year and I don’t think we’ll win it next year either and I’ve made my peace with those expectations.
@vanmartin (Comment 371) : many examples. Here’s just one – the dismissal of the support coaching staff at the end of last year could be said to be a direct result of the fan outrage last year. The acquisitions in player and coaching personnel were also a direct result of the heat bearing down on Smit.
@vanmartin (Comment 372) : I find it disappointing that a union such as the Sharks is in a place where some fans – quite a large number it seems – expect them to lose at home.
I fully expect the Sharks to win Super Rugby every year and I expect they will next year especially in the easier Australian draw now that this year seems to be a dud.
Those are my cards on the table.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 373) : could be but how do you go about proving that? Could also be that the board got fed up or John himself got fed or…
The hypotheticals can work for both sides of this argument.
@robdylan (Comment 306) : yes must agree the Saders was good tonight. I’m just a bit disappointed as I think the Sharks should have done better.
Oh god they’ve just shown the highlights of the 2007 final on tv. Jaco on the goal post. The pain! What could have been… maybe then all of you Sharks fans would have had higher expectations of your team…
@vanmartin (Comment 376) : I can tell you if the fans had been prepared to put up with it nothing would have changed. Why would it have if nobody cared?
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 375) : I will never accept a loss at home even against the Saders!!! No use to talk about next year if we can’t beat NZ teams!!!
I’d take a Super Rugby trophy over a World Cup any day. That’s how much it means.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 374) : @Character_Schmarachter (Comment 375) : Just being realistic but sorry to dissapoint. I can still passionately support them despite having to temper my personal expectations.
Here’s a fun thought experiment. Would you still support the Sharks even if you knew they’d never win Super Rugby?
No need to answer the question in public but try it out, it can be very enlightening.
@vanmartin (Comment 372) : yes some serious work is needed before Sharks can win Super rugby! Scrums and lineouts was again a mess and surely must be first priority to fix and if the current coaches can’t I think it’s time to get specialized people that can!!!
@vanmartin (Comment 382) : well I have no other team so yes I would. But no team is incapable of winning it.
The Chiefs came from nowhere as did the Highlanders. The Reds and Bulls too. Look at Leicester in the EPL. 8 of the original 12 Super Rugby teams have won it so it really is a bit poor that the Sharks haven’t.
@vanmartin (Comment 382) : unfortunately my answer will always be YES!
at this stage I’d really like to see us give mjekevu and sithole some game time
hopefully mvovo’s fine for the lions in two weeks time
a backline of classens, joe, mvovo, esterhuisen, sithole, jpp/mjekevu, willie
would have a good balance of ability and youth
havnt heard of ungerer in awhile, he seem to have a really bad 2015, when he looked decent in his minimal play in 2014
also wasnt ungerer in a sa u20 wc team with another sharks youth team scrum half by the name of venter if im correct, what happen to him
im even ok with dropping jpp for the lions game, freshen the team up, use him on tour
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 379) : Because a whole organisation earns a living from this. Things have to change or it will eventually become irrelevant. That’s a big fear for a lot of people. So I can see change being triggered internally. Also convinced John hates losing.
I’m still not sure how one goes about proving how the change came about. Fans were very disapproving of Gold and he’s still around. Same for Ettiene Oosthuisen. Fans loved Wentzel and he was given his marching orders.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 384) : @JD (Comment 385) : Then we have that in common.
@vanmartin (Comment 387) : not really. There is no relegation in SR.
@Nostraseth (Comment 351) : I would have kissed her anyway, especially since you dont have a gf to answer too.
If her bf gets all upset, laugh it off, you were just having abit of fun, no big deal
PS: why does super sport not show the kiss cam lol
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 389) : no there isn’t but there is such a thing as loss of sponsorships. Ask the Lions and Kings how much fun that is.
@revolverocelot (Comment 390) : lawsuits will come once infidelity is advertised on national tv 🙂
@Seth101 (Comment 280) : hahaha ja boet just hope her boyfriend does not hurt you for kissing her on the cheek!
I get it though. You lower your expectation to minimise the hurt.
I choose not to compromise.
@revolverocelot (Comment 390) : he did not mention how big the boyfriend is! Maybe better to play it safe ;-P
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 394) : I also try to lower my expectations but somehow somewhere in every match I forget about it and start believing Sharks can win! Fuck losing hurts every time!!!
@Seth101 (Comment 301) : @robdylan (Comment 303) : think he was about half a meter ahead!
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 394) : I align my expectation with reality. As someone who values realism I’m sure you can appreciate that. I’ll also get it wrong on occasion and don’t mind people calling me on that.
I haven’t found a way to make losses stop hurting because I don’t believe there is a way.
@Nostraseth (Comment 351) : missed the kisscam but from some of the comments I do think you must post a pic of her so we all can decide if you made a mistake by kissing her on the cheek! ;-P
@vanmartin (Comment 398) : at the start of the Super 12 in ’96 when the Sharks were the ‘team of the 90s’ and were involved in epic clashes with the Blues, if I’d told you then that after 20 years of Super Rugby all of 8 of the 12 teams would have won it, would you have believed me if I told you the Sharks would not be one of them? You probably wouldn’t have back then and to my mind there has been some pretty abject underachievement along the way for that to occur.
@JD (Comment 399) : I second that request lol
To make the weekend even worse the Sharks lose and the Stormers win.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 402) :
Terrible game, but happy about the result.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 402) : Jaguares losing is much better for us. They’re in our conference, remember? The Stormers aren’t
@robdylan (Comment 404) :
You are welcome 😆
@robdylan (Comment 404) : oh I know. But I can’t bring myself to root for the Stormers. Ever. 🙂
anyway the Lions have toured NZ and they are now favourites to win our pool. I just hope we can eke out enough wins over the remainder of the season to scrape into the only qualifier place. Our competition is the Bulls and Jaguars so it was a good result that the Jaguars didn’t win tonight.
and *poof in the space of one game we go from the only unbeaten team to
– the conference leader with the lowest points tally
– the only conference leader with 3 wins from 5 (the rest have all won 4 from 5)
– already surpassed in points tally by the highest wild card team from another conference
– the Lions, a game in hand, will overtake us to lead our conference if they win next weekend while we’re on a bye.
Suddenly things don’t look quite as rosy as they did before today’s game. I think where we are now though better reflects reality.
@robdylan (Comment 404) : for sure. I really just hope this result will motivate the coaches and players to improve even more!!!
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 408) : lots of hard work ahead for the Sharks as the honeymoon is now over!!! Time to improve!!!
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 408) : Lions finished their tour yes but just one little problem for them is they face the Saders next weekend!
@JD (Comment 411) : the Lions are Chiefs killers remember? They may just beat the Crusaders.
The Sharks will kick, kick, kick and tackle, tackle, tackle against the Chiefs and receive a whipping for their effort.
You can’t have an effective ball in hand game if you do not have an effective lineout, scrum and ruck game. Once you have those in place everything will equate to zero if you don’t have a top quality scrumhalf. The Lions have all of that in place and that is why their game is able to improve. Do you remember how effective we were when we still had Charl at 9?? Our attack game has never recovered. Cobus puts every ball carrier he passes to under pressure.
@JD (Comment 393) : Lol I’m not one to he easily intimidated. It was more doing the right thing :D.
@revolverocelot (Comment 390) : They do it befpre the game, while TV views sit and watch the ‘analysts’.
The most disappointing part about the Sharks was not the loss, but that we are still nowhere on attack….I was really hoping to see some form of a spark, and there was nothing.
We’re either scared of losing, or too lazy to work hard on attack, and therefore prefer the easy option of kicking the ball away. Defense requires very little innovation.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 412) : Linking this comment but referring to a bunch of previous ones.
I completely agree, something I have always been shocked by is the ability to accept mediocrity when it comes to the Sharks. If you look at our history we should be doing a hell of a lot better. And as you pointed out, only one of 4 super 12 teams to not have won it, that’s just pathetic really.
On my phone so can’t link your comment, but van, you’re looking for micro change, look at macro change. There has been a lot of change in the Sharks directly due to fan unhappiness.
But if micro helps, at the stadium they have a brand new electronic advertising strip along the entire South? (opposite the grand stand) stand, that is so unbelievably bright you can’t actually see the game, but because people complained they turned it down halfway through the game…just a little micro example.
Macro, has been all the new signings, thenew staff, the new attempt and making watching live rugby more appealing (boy the are still struggling there). Change has come, answer have improved, just not enough and we shouldn’t be so quick to roll over and accept average.
My superbru can’t survive a reds win, come on tahs.
@Nostraseth (Comment 417) : I’m just not convinced by the argument that if fans are less accepting it’ll lead to Super Rugby success for the Sharks. I still maintain that it has very little influence on the team’s success. Some of you seem to confuse my accepting reality with accepting mediocrity. I’m not okay with the Sharks losing to the Saders, I want them to win but I could still see the very real possibility of it happening in this game anyway and make my peace with it.
You’ll criticise or question things like the outdated gameplan or poor attacking play but at the same time you’re disappointed that I’m taking these same shortcomings into consideration to deduce that we won’t win Super Rugby this year. All I’m really acknowledging is its going to take time to play like NZ teams if that’s even what the Sharks are aspiring to do.
Regarding the examples of change you’ve listed, we’re dealing with hypotheticals here as I mentioned before. You could list some reasons and I could list some reasons but neither of us have the proof to convince each other of what brought them about. You might say disgruntled fans and I might point to disgruntled sponsors or boards or CEO’s but truth is we just don’t know for a fact.
have been a supporter of natal when they were still playing in the b-division,before any currie cup wins.natal rugby of “old” was a quick-paced linking (passing) game between forwards and backs.is that not what is now being called “the nz style of play”?
Sounds like the team was bullied in the forwards and lost the battle of the breakdown?if so,that is why imo it would have been better to let bissie and the new coaching staff sit down and have a chat.
@50shadesofshark (Comment 421) : No, that happened, but what lost us the game was kicking literally every ball we got. 35 kicks from hand by us in the game (most of the weekend by any team).
@vanmartin (Comment 419) : Thing is, even disgruntled board and or sponsors goes full circle back to fan pressure. Sponsors don’t want to be associated with a brand that has a large t of disgruntled fans, and the board also don’t want to have a lot of disgruntled fans.
The fact that we saw the Sharks release all those polls and questionnaires showed their hand, and showed that they wanted to appease the fans.
How long before we expect news on Ginja-Ninja?
@Nostraseth (Comment 423) : Probably the BIG reason why the Kings can’t get a sponsor….only the Gupta’s could afford the bad press associated with the Kings.
@FireTheLooser (Comment 416) : Look at your scrumhalf….he ensures the game is played in slow motion.
@Nostraseth (Comment 423) : I’m glad you bring that up because I think this is exactly where we differ in opinion.
I think the sponsors, the board, the CEO, the management, the team simply don’t like losing.
You might counter at this point by saying that they don’t like losing due to negative public perception it creates.
Personally, in my own life, I’ve just found that personal dissatisfaction with the status quo is a far more powerful motivater to start moving away from complacency compared to what other people (even my family, which are the closest thing I have to fans) think of me.
@GreatSharksays (Comment 426) : We had Claasens the week before – still we were limp on attack.
Joe, Reinach and Willie kicked everything away….just because we’re good at defending, shouldn’t mean we only defend for the entirety of the game.
They should do the same with their match fees, kick it away to the opposition…. 🙄
@vanmartin (Comment 427) : I think that the whole crux of the fan dissatisfaction isn’t the loss but the manner in which we lost.
If we had gone all out to win and got a 40 points hiding ,i think most of the faithful who on the whole are a knowledgable bunch would have preferred it to this defeat.
We were on the defensive from the word go,the ball never went more than three passes,its as if that defence ninja is running the show and all we practice is defence.The stupidity of the game plan is when you play like that against New Zealand teams,eventually they are going to break through.
Also if you going to play a kicking game at least have someone with a bit of a boot,Willie and Joe are both in the Gio Apolon range as kickers.
I was watching the Crusaders back three thru the glasses and everytime Willie got the ball they were two moves ahead of the return kick thats how utterly spinelessly predictable Golds plan was.
Pat Lambie needs to return quickly at least thinks out of the box.
@vanmartin (Comment 427) : Sponsorship literally revolves around public perception.
@FireTheLooser (Comment 428) : We were first in kicks, and last in offloads… Says it all about our ‘game plan’.
@The hound (Comment 429) : Thank you. This season is starting to mirror 2014. Good first few games, managing log position, then Lambie (Yes I know this time was pre-season) got injured and we played Jake ball.
But we won’t do as well as 2014 because Gold is to useless to even implement Jake ball properly.
@Nostraseth (Comment 430) : No he is too cautious,Jake could play Jake ball because he had such a huge ego and he was prepared to gamble everything on the fact that he was right.
Gold is an unconfident person,he, never goes into any game thinking he is going to win,he goes in desperate not to lose,and his whole game plan is geared to that.
I would really love to know Rob DuPreez’ opinion on that game plan everything I know about the man says that did not have his signature on it.
@The hound (Comment 431) : I’d love to see Du Preez and James Smal together for the CC, and then SR next year.
To me (having watched him during previous Varsity Cup), Smal has a similar personality to Cheika, and that type of personality ignites the players.
Gold needs to be tasked with ensuring any/all big personalities are able to form a cohesive unit.
Leave the coaching to Robert.
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 412) : OK so they’re nearly as good as the Stormers then!?!?!?
@Nostraseth (Comment 414) : hahaha glad to hear!
@Nostraseth (Comment 418) : picking Sharks cost me 8/8!!! Next weekend I will not pick the Sharks!!!
@JD (Comment 435) : Next week you won’t need to lol.
@FireTheLooser (Comment 424) : yes really hope he’s injury is not to serious!
@The hound (Comment 429) : good point why did they not use Andre to kick at least some of the clearing kicks?
@FireTheLooser (Comment 432) : must agree would love to have James return and coach with RdP snr!
@Nostraseth (Comment 436) : hahaha yes I know!
@The hound (Comment 429) : I’m simplifying here but our debate revolved around whether we as supporters should expect a Sharks win / accept a Sharks loss and the outlook for our SR season. It’s because of some of the things you’ve pointed out in your post that I expected a loss against the Saders and accepted that we won’t win Super Rugby this season. Ironically Seth’s stats articles also highlighted our deficiencies on attack which helped me in forming my opinion. I reckon they will improve but that we need more time to get where we need to be. Some feel that I’m accepting mediocrity by not expecting the win. I feel it’s facing reality. The argument is furthered in that some feel that my opinion/outlook influences our success rate in SR. I feel that’s entirely up to the union and the team. I think both sides have made good arguments but not good enough to convince the other so I’ll leave it be and enjoy this amazing day.
@vanmartin (Comment 441) : What I was trying to say its not as cut and dried as always expecting to win,or always expecting to lose.
There is a further Ryder,going into win at all costs and going in to make sure you don’t loose at all costs.
Successful teams are the ones that go in always believing that they are going to win.Sharks under Gold don’t.
For my money Gold should be moved to kit duty,entrusted with making sure that the jerseys show up and the numbers don’t come off.
I would like to see us get a proper forwards coach,a Swys De Bruin a Gert Smal or a Johan Ackermann in the making.
The kind of guy who comes to mind is Juan Smith,if he is still pissed off with the Free State,he’d make a hell of a role model for our youngsters.
@vanmartin (Comment 441) : On what do you base your assumption that we’re going to improve on attack? Our entire attacking strategy is to kick, defend and hope for an error from the opposition. How many people here just knew that we wouldn’t be able to come back with a score of our own after the Reid try? The team simply don’t know how to manufacture opportunities from phase play and won’t learn how in the near future, because our game plan doesn’t allow for it.
The pre-season talk coupled with the games in France and the first Kings game, showed promise of a new attacking purpose. Our coaching staff palpably understood that we needed to change the way we played in 2015. They said as much. So what has changed so dramatically?
I think there have been two excellent points made in this thread:
– Gold is a nervous character who lacks confidence. He doesn’t play to win, he plays not to lose (just look how his entire career record reflects this).
– that game against the Jaguars at home put the fear of life into Gold
The result has seen the Sharks regress to the shambles we have seen in the last two matches – a team preferring to play without the ball precisely because they have no idea and no confidence what to do with the ball. They’re too scared and as such we’re back in 2015 playing desperation rugby.
With 5 of the next 6 games away from home (and 4 of them outside the Republic) I sadly foresee much more teeth gnashing and woe for the Sharks. We’re in a real scrap for that one wild card place now. It’s not going to be pretty.
– we are also victims of our own improved 2016 defence. We are taking the easy South African way out, (thinking) we can defend our way to wins to mask our attacking impotence. Injuries, fatigue, lack of bonus points will hamper that approach in the end as will our inability to score tries when we inevitably come up against top all rounded teams who have the ability to open up a lead and have a good defence themselves – usually in the first play off match.
@robdylan (Comment 275) : You’re going to call an intercept and a lucky scoop great finishing ability? That was two individual brilliance/ luck moments. Digging very deep for a positive aren’t you?
@coolfusion (Comment 446) : for me it shows that if Sharks can get Mvovo in space he has the hunger and abilities to finish. Great opportunistic tries from him.
@JD (Comment 447) : Why are we unable to create the space for him while in possession?
@Character_Schmarachter (Comment 445) : Defence should be non-negotiable, but tackles don’t get you any points. You need to kick penalties, drops or preferably score tries. We seem to have given up on trying to even build any pressure with ball in hand. The epitome of this approach was when after Odwa regained a ball from a kick close to halfway, Reinach promptly chipped it straight to an area with 4 red jerseys. The Crusaders never gave the ball back and scored the winning try on the other side.
@Sharks_have_Character! (Comment 99)
Great idea!
@Spirit of Rugby (Comment 448) : Which to me is definition of finishing. Create exploit finish. Not just luck or pick up from sloppy play. Someone needs to start the movement the team be good on execution and at the end finish. That is what I would want to see.
@Spirit of Rugby (Comment 448) : that is a good a question that I hope the coaches will solve before the end of the season!!!
@Bokhoring (Comment 449) : I could not believe my eyes when it happened! Very poor game management!